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2018 Ontario Provincial Election Discussion

44 North said:
But they did have a different leader. It wasn't a hypothetical, he was there, with a costed platform, and huge support. The current dip in PC support and obvious osmotic gravitation toward NDP I think is a direct result of people *not* being able to safely say the 'PCs will do a better job'. For starters they don't have a costed platform two weeks before an election, which should furrow an eyebrow or two. Particularly for those who want to deal with our fiscal situation. But then there's Doug, who in my eyes doesn't have leadership qualities and is not well-spoken. He's supposed to be a businessman but I wouldn't buy what he's selling. Heck, Rob was a better speaker/leader/salesman.
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And even if you didn't like the Brown Stuff, there were two very talented and competent ladies each of whom would have been shoo-ins in the election.
MTown said:
I vaguely remember Clark as MP, sure as hell don't remember him as PM, but I reckon he was a decent public figure. I mean, he sure as hell would make this trio look even worse than they manage on their own.
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Joe wasn't a very effective leader, it takes a certain type of swagger to make that work, but he was one of Cdn history's finest parliamentary scholars.

Clark did an incredible amount of work behind the scenes to protect and promote democracy in this nation. Highly respected by all the Parties, he works well with people.

Sigh...but that was a golden age of politics and leaders, where the Tories and Whigs were both Centrists, just as the Republican Party in the US was historically for the Little Guy. It was only after Eisenhower that the roles started to invert. Timing was roughly similar in Canada, but half a generation. The Cons were the party of the little guy and farmers.

Phhh...that's sure changed, unless you're part of the local mafia, and Dougie's your boy...
 
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steveintoronto said:
And even if you didn't like the Brown Stuff, there were two very talented and competent ladies each of whom would have been shoo-ins in the election.
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Any one of those three likely would have cleaned up. Not sure what people were smoking when they chose Ford instead. Hint: it sure as hell wasn't ganja....I'm more thinking along the lines of a certain plant HCl, if you get my meaning.
 
TransitBart said:
Hence the expression, “none of the above”.
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That's if they are all equally bad.
The reality is, none are as good as we would like - and it's that way in every election. If you can't chose the best party, than shouldn't you chose the least bad one?
 
BurlOak said:
Ye, I remember everyone complaining about Trudeau not releasing his platform until 2 weeks before the election - and the voters really punished him for it.
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Was he going on about "trust me"? I honestly don't remember. I didn't vote for his gang, don't you worry.
 
MTown said:
I didn't say that.

....but, sure, I'll answer your question with the same analogy I've used in this thread at least three times before:

Two sides of the same shite coin.

Or, to put it more simply: no.

Then again, that would be my answer to the inverse of your question. :)
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I'd say they are two quite different coins.

Horwath is a nicer looking, nicer spoken leader.
The PC Party will not doubt do better for economy, jobs, etc.
It's a choice between appearance and competence.
 
we lived through this in the early 1990's. Alberta and BC are living through this now. Someone must be in an awful small cocoon to consider voting for the NDP.
 
BurlOak said:
I'd say they are two quite different coins.

Horwath is a nicer looking, nicer spoken leader.
The PC Party will not doubt do better for economy, jobs, etc.
It's a choice between appearance and competence.
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Is it? I see it as a choice between incompetence and incompetence. Which, let's be honest, isn't a choice at all.

I see both as being bad for the efficient use of my taxes. The ones I work hard to pay. One will spend more foolishly whilst the other will make it harder for the government to pay off our debts thereby using more of my money to pay interest with in the long term. This isn't a choice between anything.

"Do you want to be shot in the left leg or the right leg?" ...throw in the Liberals and we're being offered the choice of being shot in the third leg.
 
BurlOak said:
we lived through this in the early 1990's. Alberta and BC are living through this now. Someone must be in an awful small cocoon to consider voting for the NDP.
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BC's economy is currently the healthiest in the country.

Wasn't that the most important metric by which to measure government performance?
 
King of Kensington said:
If true...WOW!

https://www.thepostmillennial.com/leaked-poll-ndp-in-ontario-take-massive-lead/
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In 2007, John Tory wasn't good enough, so McGuinty was returned - thus began the lost decade when Ontario debt increased by over 100% (while Canada only up 26%). Shortly thereafter, everyone regretted their decision.

In 2011, Tim Hudak wasn't good enough, so McGuinty was returned and that spawned the many arms of the Gas Plant Scandal. Shortly thereafter, everyone regretted their decision.

In 2014, Tim Hudak wasn't good enough, so Wynne was returned and that spawned the many arms of the political corruption, cash-for-access, etc. Shortly thereafter, everyone regretted their decision.

History does have a way of repeating itself. I have no doubt that voters will regret their choices. Back in the Bob Rae era, it was hard to find 10% of people who actually voted for him.
 
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