2014 Municipal Election: Toronto Transit Plans

[WislaHD]

Your voting for Tory because you assume he's not going to do what he promised to do!?!?

With Soknacki out, I don't know who to vote for. Tory's anti-Eglinton Connects stance bothers me to no end, but I am willing to bet that he is someone who will let council walk over him, which is ok by me since council is pro-most-of-the-things-I-like. Chow on the other hand has led an entirely uninspiring campaign, leaves me skeptical to her ability to heal and unite the city and city council, and bases her transit policy on purely populist reasons. She hasn't really given me a reason to vote for her despite the fact I should be her target demographic politically speaking.

What is this "Improved Bus Plan" that is superior to Chow's? I haven't seen this.

http://www.johntory.ca/fighting-gridlock-initiative/

- Queue Lane Jumping for Buses
- Using innovative MARLIN traffic priority signal system to fight congestion
- Express Bus Routes on major routes outside the city core

Among other things.

I can't find the article breaking down the problems with Olivia Chow's bus plan unfortunately but from what I remember the main criticisms are:

- 10% increased bus services doesn't actually address the problem nor improve the situation. Simply throwing in more buses doesn't help so long as buses are stuck in congestion and they all travel together in packs of 5-6. Trust me, I lived on Eglinton my whole life.
- The city doesn't have any extra buses for Chow's 10% service increase (source)
- The city doesn't have any extra facilities to actually store them (same Source^)
- Chow's Bus Funding plan simply amounts to restoring the $15million a year cuts to peak service by Karen Stintz. Not enough by any means. New buses alone (which she would have to order to meet her service increase cost at a minimum $500,000)

Her bus plan is impractical, misguided and unfeasible. Which is really unfortunate as she is priding herself, her rhetoric and her campaign on it. Tory's express bus plan, upgraded signal system and queue jumping will do much more for the majority of the city's bus riders than Chow's plan ever would.

 

[sixrings]

Your voting for Tory because you assume he's not going to do what he promised to do!?!?

What is this "Improved Bus Plan" that is superior to Chow's? I haven't seen this.

I'm confused by the bus plan as well.when and where was it mentioned and why would we assume it would be superior . Last night makes me want to vote for chow but at the moment I am anyone but ford type voter.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

Why do people care about Eglinton Connects. It won't be online until 2025, 10 years from now. We can talk about it in 2018-2019, after the crosstown is done. For now, let's get Doug out.

 

[nfitz]

With Soknacki out, I don't know who to vote for. Tory's anti-Eglinton Connects stance bothers me to no end, but I am willing to bet that he is someone who will let council walk over him, which is ok by me since council is pro-most-of-the-things-I-like. Chow on the other hand has led an entirely uninspiring campaign, leaves me skeptical to her ability to heal and unite the city and city council, and bases her transit policy on purely populist reasons. She hasn't really given me a reason to vote for her despite the fact I should be her target demographic politically speaking.

I'm the same place as you.

Chow's fix the TTC operations for $15-million is unrealistic. This is simply the cost to roll-back the Stintz cuts, which TTC priced this at $17.1 million (items 2 and 7 of their 9-item service improvement plan from October). Paradoxically, Chow made positive comments about this plan, but it would cost $45-million a year (not including the $20-million for 2-hour transfers which she rejected). And yet she still talks about $15-million. And though these sound like huge numbers, they are pocket-change on the TTC's $1.5-billion operating budget. Recall that a 5¢ fare increase last year raised about $28 million. Chow's meagre promise could be met by about a 2½¢ fare increase.

http://www.johntory.ca/fighting-gridlock-initiative/

- Queue Lane Jumping for Buses
- Using innovative MARLIN traffic priority signal system to fight congestion
- Express Bus Routes on major routes outside the city core

Ah, interesting. I haven't seen that. I'll have to review in detail, but at first blush how is this any different than items 5 and 4a respectively in what TTC passed in August. TTC priced the operating cost of this at only $9.3 million a year, with a capital cost of only $2.4 million a year for the signals and queue jumps ($12 million over 5 years) and $16.8 million for 2 years for new buses for the express routes. This is less of that shopping list than Chow is supporting (which is also woefully inadequate, as you have pointed out in the material I trimmed from the post).

 

[nfitz]

Why do people care about Eglinton Connects. It won't be online until 2025, 10 years from now. We can talk about it in 2018-2019, after the crosstown is done. For now, let's get Doug out.

You don't choose your mayor based on that. Besides, the polling that came out most recently on Friday showed Doug was unelectable - and that's before the media started turning on him over the weekend.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

You don't choose your mayor based on that. Besides, the polling that came out most recently on Friday showed Doug was unelectable - and that's before the media started turning on him over the weekend.

Doug is number 2 with 35 percent according to forum. He still has not introduced his transit plan.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I have a really hard time believing the Forum polling. There's now way in hell that Doug is more popular than Rob.

 

[nfitz]

Doug is number 2 with 35 percent according to forum.

Two polls came out Friday. Forum put Doug at 35, and Mainstreet put him at 18 with Chow at 30 and Tory at 51.

There's no indication that Ford has a chance. I can't imagine basing one's vote on keeping the guy out of office.

He still has not introduced his transit plan.

Sure he did. Back when he made his attempted coup on Waterfront Toronto. An elevated monorail to the Portlands.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Steve Munro's analysis of SmartTrack: http://stevemunro.ca/?p=10224

 

[kEiThZ]

I agree, if we're going to spend the money & effort installing new streetcar tracks & overhead wires, it should always be along an exclusive ROW separated from cars.

Agree with this. I wish they would have at least considered an alignment where both tracks were on one side of the street. Instead of in the middle.

In the downtown core, streetcars would be so much more efficient with curbside placement. Even better if they execute that with more one-way streets in the core.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Wouldn't the curve radii be a problem with curbside alignment?

 

[kEiThZ]

I was planning on attending but decided to go home instead when I heard that Tory dropped out.

Perhaps it is a calculated political move. SmartTrack is terribly weak as a transit plan, the best thing to do is just shut-up about it until after the election. Nobody will remember "TTC rider's group" being furious come election day.

edit: Cross-post with nfitz.

Indeed. But more to the point, were I in Tory's shoes why would I attend a lynch mob that is not open to my ideas at all?

It would be like John Tory attending a UT forum. nfitz would call him a racist. TigerMaster would launch into an utter tirade about how much better LRT is. So why bother?

SmartTrack has merits and has flaws. From a strictly political perspective, why bother with any audience that will not entertain any of the merits of your ideas.

 

[kEiThZ]

Wouldn't the curve radii be a problem with curbside alignment?

Not too sure with the new streetcars. More to the point, we need fewer routes that turn. Major streetcar routes should stay on the same corridor (which they largely do).

 

[kEiThZ]

I have a really hard time believing the Forum polling. There's now way in hell that Doug is more popular than Rob.

I believe it. Rob Ford is a lightning rod for criticism. Doug Ford has none of the baggage and all of the perception of Rob Ford's hardnosed political style. Imagine how popular Rob Ford would be if none of the issues about drugs or corruption had emerged. That's where Doug Ford is right now.

 

[Electrify]

I believe it. Rob Ford is a lightning rod for criticism. Doug Ford has none of the baggage and all of the perception of Rob Ford's hardnosed political style. Imagine how popular Rob Ford would be if none of the issues about drugs or corruption had emerged. That's where Doug Ford is right now.

Are we forgetting that Globe and Mail article from last year?

Rob's appeal came from his (apparent) everyman charm rather than his policies. Doug lacks that and comes off as far more hardened. Many of the people who would have voted for Rob will likely stay home rather than vote for Doug.