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VIA Rail

Just got back from a great weekend VIA trip to Montreal. Left Friday morning from Union, enjoyable run on VIA without delays, food was good for economy. Stayed at Hotel Bonaventure, which is connected directly to VIA's Montreal station. Great hotel with outdoor, year-round roof top pool and duck pond. Great for the kids.

Two great nights in Montreal, including good dinners out at http://www.lepoispenche.com/ and http://www.etoiledesindes.com/, shopping on St. Catherine, plus a great walk from Notre Dam cathedral (worth the $5 admission) up the hill to a cliche and great lunch at http://www.maindelisteakhouse.com/ then a walk back to the hotel through the Eaton Centre and underground city. Lastly took a bus tour of the mountain and sites.

Then today took the VIA home, again an on-time, fast and pleasant run with good service. The car was rather worn out, especially the upholstery, but I find that the older cars have more confortable seating.

So, if you're looking for a three day weekend, I recommend VIA to Montreal.
 
Watch this closely as it relates to VIA's (Desjardins-Siciliano's) concept for HFR. I also see it being a way forward for the Missing Link:
Risks abound as Trudeau makes big pitch to giant investors: Paul Wells
Prime Minister Justin Trudeau on Monday hopes to persuade some of the world’s most powerful institutional investors that Canada is the place to put their money to work.

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau will kick one of his most ambitious and uncertain projects into high gear in Toronto on Monday: a plan to attract tens of billions of dollars from outside investors to pay for an unprecedented burst of public infrastructure investment.

It’s a big day for Trudeau. He will lead two sessions with large institutional investors. The first is for large Canadian investors including the Ontario Teachers’ Pension Plan and Quebec’s Caisse de dépot et placement.

Federal officials have been planning for Monday’s second meeting, organized with the New York asset manager BlackRock, at least since midsummer. Trudeau will be joined by nine senior cabinet ministers to pitch Canada as an investment destination. Their audience will be two dozen representatives from pension plans, sovereign wealth funds and other international organizations that control a combined $21 trillion in assets.

The meeting follows Finance Minister Bill Morneau’s announcement in his fall economic update two weeks ago that the government will create a Canada Infrastructure Bank to supplement federal spending by attracting outside investors. Morneau said his goal is to land $4 from investors for every dollar the feds put up. That would suggest a $140-billion windfall, given the $35 billion the Trudeau Liberals will use to capitalize the new bank.

For the investors, the lure is stable long-term returns, measured on the same decades-long time scale over which pension plans must provide for their members, at rates of return that look pretty good in the context of an extended global slump in interest rates.

For the Liberals, the attraction is the possibility of dreaming bigger on roads, rail, power grids and social infrastructure than Morneau could afford through direct federal spending alone. [...]
Click to expand...

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada...ctor-capital-for-infrastructure-projects.html
 
steveintoronto said:
TFirst off, VIA have never stated they wanted to or intended to *own* the RoW. D-S has been meticulous from the get-go that VIA will (gist) "Own the rolling stock", ostensibly through the Gov't of Canada.
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When I refer to my suspicion of VIA having been sold a lemon, I'm referring to the concept, not the real estate.

If VIA can run this historically slow, winding, non-grade separated route to Montreal via Ottawa in less time than the current Toronto-Montreal travel time, then all the power to them, and it's great news.

I'll believe it when I see it though. I'd be a fool to opine much further at this early point.
 
Are there any past reports on this proposal floating around the net? The windiest and slowest section will no doubt be the now-railless slog between Havelock and Perth through land God gave to Cain. But in this instance, perhaps it'd be wiser to construct a straighter route alongside the meandering former route? Would also save tearing out chunks of the TC trail. Any mention of that in the past?
 
44 North said:
Are there any past reports on this proposal floating around the net? The windiest and slowest section will no doubt be the now-railless slog between Havelock and Perth through land God gave to Cain. But in this instance, perhaps it'd be wiser to construct a straighter route alongside the meandering former route? Would also save tearing out chunks of the TC trail. Any mention of that in the past?
Click to expand...

There may have been "proposals" but whether these involved "study" is a good question.

The most detailed source reports from the 1989-1995 period don't mention this line at all.

https://web.archive.org/web/20110706200555/http://www.bv.transports.gouv.qc.ca/mono/0986299.pdf
http://www.bv.transports.gouv.qc.ca/mono/0985915.pdf

I recall earlier proposals in the 1980's, in response to the Pepin cuts. My recollection is that these postulated a routing north of, but not far from, Kingston, with a "satellite" station north of that city.

I wonder if there is a more complete set of links somewhere.

- Paul
 
crs1026 said:
There may have been "proposals" but whether these involved "study" is a good question.

The most detailed source reports from the 1989-1995 period don't mention this line at all.

https://web.archive.org/web/20110706200555/http://www.bv.transports.gouv.qc.ca/mono/0986299.pdf
http://www.bv.transports.gouv.qc.ca/mono/0985915.pdf

I recall earlier proposals in the 1980's, in response to the Pepin cuts. My recollection is that these postulated a routing north of, but not far from, Kingston, with a "satellite" station north of that city.

I wonder if there is a more complete set of links somewhere.

- Paul
Click to expand...

Thanks for this. Not exactly what I was thinking, and a bit farther south.

One thing I'm wondering is whether CP is on board with VIA's plans so as to work in tandem on a new passenger/freight route. Not sure how important a new freight route could be to Smith Falls, but there may be a reason to relay track just east of Havelock. The proposal for a pumped storage facility at the Marmora mine is still alive afaik, and may require a rebuilt rail connection during its construction (considering the scope of what's proposed). With the active Unimin mine already connected, this may bolster the case for improving the entire route to Peterboro and Scarboro. Costs would naturally be shared as a joint CP-VIA venture (e.g single track with sidings...passenger rail gets priority).
 
Strange, because I always thought the best direct route for VIA, if it had to skip Kingston, was to rebuild the former Canadian Northern railway line between Napanee and Smiths Falls, while figuring something out between Pickering and Napanee, such as moving all passenger trains or all freight trains to the CP line between east of Belleville and Durham Region.

The old CN line, abandoned in the 1980s, is also still intact, used as a trail in Frontenac and Lanark counties.
 
I've posed this question in the transit fantasy thread, but maybe better posed here. Does anyone think any other abandoned rail lines will ever be resurrected as operating rail lines again for passenger service? Owen Sound sub, or the Ottawa Valley subdivisions for example?
 
44 North said:
Are there any past reports on this proposal floating around the net?
Click to expand...
Yes, VIA have done studies, as articulated and itemized by Urban Sky in this very forum and described on-line by D-S himself. Even the passing loops have been discussed, let alone expected times, speeds and track performance.
 
ShonTron said:
Strange, because I always thought the best direct route for VIA, if it had to skip Kingston, was to rebuild the former Canadian Northern railway line between Napanee and Smiths Falls, while figuring something out between Pickering and Napanee, such as moving all passenger trains or all freight trains to the CP line between east of Belleville and Durham Region.

The old CN line, abandoned in the 1980s, is also still intact, used as a trail in Frontenac and Lanark counties.
Click to expand...
"while figuring something out between Pickering and Napanee, such as moving all passenger trains or all freight trains to the CP line between east of Belleville and Durham Region. " Well that's a monumental task right there. There's been opportunity for years for this to be discussed, the Class Is aren't interested. The only way to make this happen that I can see is one *massive* rationalization of southern Ontario rail revolving around the Missing Link.

If the Missing Link is announced in the next few months, then many things are possible. It's not by chance that D-S is indicating from every angle that the old O&Q is the front-running contender.
 
44 North said:
One thing I'm wondering is whether CP is on board with VIA's plans so as to work in tandem on a new passenger/freight route.
Click to expand...
CP would be heads over heels on this. They can't justify the cost to upgrade the line just for present freight use, and meantime, through (questionable) ownership of O&Q they're sitting on a sizable land value, so any enterprise where there was none before to revitalize the value of that property has to get their attention. Bear in mind that VIA (via D-S) has stated repeatedly that the RoW would be from (mostly) private sources.

44 North said:
Costs would naturally be shared as a joint CP-VIA venture (e.g single track with sidings...passenger rail gets priority).
Click to expand...
Not necessarily at all. Been discussed at length prior. Watch for *Investment* capital to address this. The real question is whether CP is part of the consortium to do this, or sell off assets, or at least contribute them (sale of O&Q might be legally complex)(it's a leasehold) to the new consortium. There's going to be lots of general discussion about this in the next while, and specifically to this or any other "dedicated" corridor for passenger in the next while.
 
Fritter said:
I've posed this question in the transit fantasy thread, but maybe better posed here. Does anyone think any other abandoned rail lines will ever be resurrected as operating rail lines again for passenger service? Owen Sound sub, or the Ottawa Valley subdivisions for example?
Click to expand...
The problem with those lines is that they don't really go anywhere. The Peterborough line has the advantage of being a connection between Canada's two biggest cities. The line to Owen Sound goes pretty much just to Owen Sound, which has, what, 20,000 people? The Ottawa Valley lines could have commuter potential but the market would be limited, with no large population centres.

I've always thought that passenger service to Collingwood would be very successful. It would be useful for the whole area between Blue Mountain and Wasaga Beach, which attracts a lot of visitors year round. It would mean not having to drive the busy and slow Highway 26.
 
Fritter said:
I've posed this question in the transit fantasy thread, but maybe better posed here. Does anyone think any other abandoned rail lines will ever be resurrected as operating rail lines again for passenger service? Owen Sound sub, or the Ottawa Valley subdivisions for example?
Click to expand...

On the Owen Sound Sub idea, I could maybe see passenger service on it as far as Orangeville, and within Brampton and Mississauga however I would see that as being more for GO rather than VIA. If the province "wanted to open up Manitoulin Island" to easier passenger access, you could take passengers to Owen Sound by (VIA?) train then put them on a ferry like the Chi Cheemaun, if it departed from OS. That however is a very flawed hypothetical idea. The Owen Sound line would be more viable for farm freight, and I'd expect a freight railway to take the lead on rebuilding it before VIA ever did. Oh to dream though....
 
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