News   Jul 15, 2024
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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

Humour aside, this is far from nationalization (or provincialization).

The Quebec taxpayer bought a 49.5% in the C Series program...that's it....and got that for $1B.

CDPQ, on behalf of their depositors (which are pension plans) bought 30% of the rail division for $1.5B.

Neither of these would meet even the most general definition of nationalization.
 
So ... how soon does everyone think 4413 will be here?
There's a loaded flatcar in TB waiting for pickup by CP for over 24 hours now. So I'd put my money on early next week - about a month after 4412. Though could be 4402 or even something else.
 
http://www.financialpost.com/m/wp/b...st-for-public-explanation-of-streetcar-delays

Bombardier Inc rejects Toronto Transit Commission request for public explanation of streetcar delays

No Bombardier Inc. executives will attend Monday’s Toronto Transit Commission board meeting despite the TTC’s request that the company’s CEO appear in person to explain persistent streetcar production delays.

“There’s no provision (in the contract) that says we have to go discuss this publicly before their board,” Bombardier spokesman Marc Laforge said in an interview.

He added that the company is “more than willing” to meet with the TTC’s executives and board members privately.

The TTC is fed up with Bombardier’s performance on the $1.2-billion contract, which should have seen at least 67 new streetcars on Toronto’s streets by now. Instead, Bombardier has said it will only have 16 in service by the end of the year.

At its Oct. 28 meeting, the transit commission’s board directed chairman Josh Colle “to write to the CEO (of) Bombardier requesting he appear before the board at its November commission meeting to explain Bombardier’s failure to meet past deadlines and its delivery commitments for streetcars going forward.”

Laforge said it was not CEO Alain Bellemare who received the request, but Raymond Bachant, president of the Americas division at Bombardier Transportation.

The TTC is also pursuing legal action against Bombardier for damages related to the delays.

“As you might imagine, the litigation leaves us no choice but to decline that invitation before the public board,” Laforge said, adding that the contract lays out a clear dispute-resolution process.

“Our only requirement is that the discussions be in accordance with the resolution process in the contract,” he said.
 
Why must Bombardier be so secretive? The public must know the sins of Bombardier and why it is taking so long for Bombardier and its parts suppliers to manufacture the Flexities.
TTC has publicly stated they are going to sue Bombardier for damages. Surely under such circumstances, Bombardier has no option other than not to provide evidence against themselves.
 
Why must Bombardier be so secretive? The public must know the sins of Bombardier and why it is taking so long for Bombardier and its parts suppliers to manufacture the Flexities.
BBD has no obligation to inform the public...they have an obligation to discuss with their customer and they are saying that they will not (because their contract does not oblige them to) do that informing in a public forum.

The TTC has an obligation to keep the public informed and they would be free to do that after their private meetings with BBD.
 
TTC has publicly stated they are going to sue Bombardier for damages. Surely under such circumstances, Bombardier has no option other than not to provide evidence against themselves.

Exactly this. Everyone seems to think this is a sign that Bombardier doesn't care, but when has any company ever made a comment on a matter that is pending litigation? The TTC must have known this was going to happen, and if they did are using it as a tool to make Bombardier look bad in the public's eye.
 
Yup, not remotely surprising. If this really is headed for the courts (which honestly I doubt, but the threat is there), then it's only prudent for Bombardier to limit its public comments on the matter as much as possible. Anything they say could complicate the legal process.

All that said, I strongly suspect (and hope) this will end in some kind of settlement -- a recovery of some sort of reasonable schedule, eventually, with extra vehicles thrown in in lieu of financial compensation. This could actually be an opportunity for the TTC to put a dent in its huge capital budget shortfall, which it won't pass up lightly.
 
This could actually be an opportunity for the TTC to put a dent in its huge capital budget shortfall, which it won't pass up lightly.
The motion in October requested that "TTC staff, in any negotiations on damages, liquidated or otherwise, to consider as a priority additional LRV's as compensation".

The 50-million penalty alone is worth about 10 new vehicles. At the current delivery rate, these would start arriving in 2030.
 
I don't think this was discussed yet, but yesterday (Sunday) some time between 11:30am and noon I saw 4409 on Queen Street at Church. I was shocked to see it so I fumbled with my camera phone to take a pic before it could pull away. What's not pictured is that there seemed to be about 4-5 people riding it...not altogether...but dispersed through the car, so I think it was in service?

IMG_8448.JPG
 

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