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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

It could be possible that Bombardier would build a new plant in southern Ontario too. Can the Thunder Bay plant handle the number of vehicles Toronto needs?

They claim that they can, but I agree that southern ontario is a better place for the plant considering how badly our manufacturing has been hit. If Chrysler does pull out of Ontario then the Brampton Plant could be the perfect site.
 
They claim that they can, but I agree that southern ontario is a better place for the plant considering how badly our manufacturing has been hit. If Chrysler does pull out of Ontario then the Brampton Plant could be the perfect site.

There would be a bit of synergy in a closed car plant producing mass transit and since it has a direct link to the railway line.....the cars could be built then delivered directly to Toronto without needing roads
 
City a step closer to new streetcars
Posted: April 22, 2009, 10:11 PM by Barry Hertz TTC, Hall Monitor, city council, city hall

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By Allison Hanes, National Post

The Toronto Transit Commission will finally reveal tomorrow which light-rail manufacturer wins a billion-dollar contract to build new streetcars — the biggest deal the city has ever awarded and some say potentially the biggest such purchase in the world.

The successful bidder will be either Bombardier Transportation’s Flexity Outlook model or Siemens’s Combino Plus — both modified to fit Toronto’s existing network of streetcar tracks.

But after a false start, a long delay and a redrawing of the process to get the contract award on the right track, the TTC still doesn’t have funding pledged for the big-ticket buy.

Brad Ross, a spokesman for the TTC, said yesterday the commission remains “hopeful†that funding from the Ontario or federal governments will be “forthcoming.â€

But he added that after the winning bid is announced, a “window of time†will open in which the TTC must place its order. He did not disclose how long that “window†would be open.

The TTC needs approximately $1.2-billion to purchase 204 new low-floor, fully accessible streetcars to replace its ageing fleet. These would be specially designed to run on the existing tracks that lace through the city core.

The winner would also be a likely source to build an additional 400 new off-the-rack streetcars to operate on Transit City lines — eight dedicated light-rail lines the city wants to build to connect every corner of Toronto.

This option would likely push the total bill for the full fleet of light-rail vehicles into the $3-billion range.

Mayor David Miller pointed out this week that Premier Dalton McGuinty has already pledged funding for the cars on two of those new lines — along Finch Avenue and Eglinton Avenue — when he announced infrastructure money for their construction to great fanfare this month.

He said the city is hoping to tap in to federal infrastructure funds to buy new cars for the existing lines, while the province will likely be called on to step up for the balance of Transit City.

“We have our share of the funding, the third. There’s funding for the Transit City cars in the Transit City projects that Premier McGuinty announced the funding for recently,†Mr. Miller said.

“We’re considering other possibilities for funding — for example, the economic stimulus fund.â€

Mr. Ross said having new streetcars for the old rails is a state-of-good repair project, but it is also something the city will be legally required to do in the not-so-distant future in order to make its transit system fully accessible.

“Transit City is wonderful and it’s exciting and it’s new but these replacement vehicles are critical to the downtown network,†he said.

The contract for the new streetcars was supposed to have been awarded last summer; however, the process was derailed when the TTC said the only two submissions it received had failed. One, from a British firm, was deemed not commercially viable, but the front-runner, Bombardier, was disqualified for a design the TTC said would derail on Toronto’s tight-radius turns.

The process was scrapped and the TTC decided to work with the world’s three leading light-rail makers — Siemens, Bombardier and Alstom — in a more open competition.

In the end, only Siemens and Bombardier offered bids, submitting sealed envelopes that TTC officials have now reviewed. Their final recommendation will be made public in a report tomorrow.

Mr. Ross said the determining factor this time is price.

While the two contenders must both still meet the TTC’s technical requirements, he said engineering workshops and consultations — overseen by fairness monitors — over the past eight months should have made specifications abundantly clear.

David Slack, a spokesman for Bombardier, said yesterday that despite time lost, the company would be able to meet the tight deadlines for delivery and the 25% Canadian-content requirement.

He is looking forward to the big announcement. “It’s a big deal,†Mr. Slack said.

Once the contract is awarded, the first prototype streetcar will arrive for testing in 2011 and the first new models should be ready in 2012, with the last shipment arriving in 2018.

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/.../22/city-a-step-closer-to-new-streetcars.aspx
 
I find myself more and more enraged by this bizarre bureaucratic kabuki that has to go on before Queen's Park or Ottawa will deign to send us some of our own money to make necessary infrastructure investments.

The streetcar replacement isn't some pie-in-the-sky rapid transit scheme that's been slapped on the books; it's an absolutely essential, state-of-good-repair program to replace existing vehicles relied upon by hundreds of thousands of people daily on a less than one-to-one basis.

It's bad enough that we apply a feast-or-famine approach to this thing, and wait for 100% block obsolescence instead of replacing old vehicles progressively, as with buses. But to have to go through this will-they-or-won't-they process of reading the tea leaves while a multi-billion dollar commercial negotiation is underway is absurd beyond belief.

When Adam Giambrone calls Queen's Park and asks, 'so, we have to talk to major corporations about buying rail vehicles for which the provincial government is partially responsible, will you be funding the purchase?' is the answer seriously 'umm, maybe?!?'
 
Well, the whole problem is that transit is a "municipal reponsibility". The provice seriously sometimes forgets that almost half of the province's population lives in the GTA, and this is absolutely essential. But, no, we must not anger the rest of Ontario.
 
I find myself more and more enraged by this bizarre bureaucratic kabuki that has to go on before Queen's Park or Ottawa will deign to send us some of our own money to make necessary infrastructure investments.

The streetcar replacement isn't some pie-in-the-sky rapid transit scheme that's been slapped on the books; it's an absolutely essential, state-of-good-repair program to replace existing vehicles relied upon by hundreds of thousands of people daily on a less than one-to-one basis.

It's bad enough that we apply a feast-or-famine approach to this thing, and wait for 100% block obsolescence instead of replacing old vehicles progressively, as with buses. But to have to go through this will-they-or-won't-they process of reading the tea leaves while a multi-billion dollar commercial negotiation is underway is absurd beyond belief.

When Adam Giambrone calls Queen's Park and asks, 'so, we have to talk to major corporations about buying rail vehicles for which the provincial government is partially responsible, will you be funding the purchase?' is the answer seriously 'umm, maybe?!?'

"Sorry, Adam, we just promised GM we'd help them build cars that nobody want to buy."
 
Well, the whole problem is that transit is a "municipal reponsibility". The provice seriously sometimes forgets that almost half of the province's population lives in the GTA, and this is absolutely essential. But, no, we must not anger the rest of Ontario.

Well considering that the province put out a plan called MoveOntario that focused only on the GTA-Hamilton, I think you might be exaggerating a bit. Not to mention the fact that while the province is helping to bail out large auto companies located mostly in the GTA, factories in other sectors elsewhere in Ontario are shutting down without any action being taken - factories which are arguably more important for the economic viability of their communities. Until I moved out of the GTA I might have agreed with you, but now I'm much more sympathetic to the argument that the province largely ignores most of Ontario outside of the Golden Horseshoe until election time comes around again.

That being said, I can't see the province not funding this. They're probably just waiting for an opportune time to announce funding.
 
The auto companies have more plants outside of the GTA than they have inside the GTA. Also, any bailout will benefit parts suppliers across the province.
 
I could see that turning into a disaster if it were to happen. I'd rather just let one company handle it.

Assuming both companies are ISO certified it wouldn't make a difference. Parts and components already come from hundreds of different suppliers.
 

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