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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

Well the good news, is that it delays the 60th car that triggers the end of the option period until 2017.

Though I keep commenting that if Bombardier isn't acting in good faith, TTC can sue to get more than the contractual $50 million in damages. How they provided the previous schedule which started deliveries in March, if there were new problems in the supply chain in Mexico that are causing more delays now is just not beleviable - they must have known this when they lied about the previous schedule. This is (yet another) example of Bombardier not acting in good faith.
 
Duck said:
Aw, come on. That's not really fair to laugh. It sounds like as reasonable an explanation as any for the delay. I'm optimistic they'll deliver. Let's see how April plays out.

I'm very curious how they'll slot in production of the 14 FLEXITY Freedom LFLRV's for Waterloo, as all 14 are scheduled to be delivered by year end.
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Bombardier's handling of Toronto's streetcar delivery is nothing short of comical. They have bungled it up soooo badly. Excuse after excuse after excuse is not acceptable when an entire city is waiting on their streetcar fleet to be replaced. I honestly think the City of Toronto would have been better off sending a $1.25 billion transfer payment to Thunder Bay for economic stimulus then going out and buying (yes, more expensive) streetcars from Siemens.

I am willing to give Bombardier a fresh chance for the 14 FLEXITY Freedom LFLRV's for Waterloo and other LRVs for the Metrolinx LRT projects. But if they mess those projects up......
 
"The entire city is waiting on their streetcar fleet to be replaced" is a bit dramatic. The general public can barely tell the difference between a Flexity and an ALRV.
 
alexanderglista said:
Bombardier's handling of Toronto's streetcar delivery is nothing short of comical. They have bungled it up soooo badly. Excuse after excuse after excuse is not acceptable when an entire city is waiting on their streetcar fleet to be replaced. I honestly think the City of Toronto would have been better off sending a $1.25 billion transfer payment to Thunder Bay for economic stimulus then going out and buying (yes, more expensive) streetcars from Siemens.

I am willing to give Bombardier a fresh chance for the 14 FLEXITY Freedom LFLRV's for Waterloo and other LRVs for the Metrolinx LRT projects. But if they mess those projects up......
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Any chance Toronto can sue BBD for the economic impact of this? Probably not :) (I'm just looking for ways to bleed BBD dry out of spite)
 
Duck said:
The general public can barely tell the difference between a Flexity and an ALRV.
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That's just a crazy comment. Between an H6 and a T1 perhaps ... between a Nova and an Orion, sure.

But between the ALRV and the Flexity? Just judging by the looks you get, and the cameras being pulled out when one goes somewhere unusual, most people are well aware.

And really that's not the point. The point is that they are running buses now on some routes because of the shortage of streetcars. So ignore the crowding issue ... there's few that mistake a bus for a streetcar ... and if they do, they are likely to be run over by it, as they walk to the centre of the road!
 
Crazy maybe, but it's crazier to want to willingly "screw Bombardier over" just out of spite (TigerMaster). That's so... childish.

I get that it sucks, but I often feel that the people who are whining the hardest are just looking for something to whine about - that they don't actually care about the delivery schedule at all. They just are looking for someone to blame because it's fun. If TigerMaster was actually interested and cared about them and the project, he'd be excited every time one shows up, not hating on Bombardier constantly.
 
Duck said:
Crazy maybe, but it's crazier to want to willingly "screw Bombardier over" just out of spite (TigerMaster). That's so... childish.
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Bombardier fully has the capability to fix this situation. They've clearly chosen not to. Accordingly, I want them to pay for this.

Duck said:
I get that it sucks, but I often feel that the people who are whining the hardest are just looking for something to whine about - that they don't actually care about the delivery schedule at all. They just are looking for someone to blame because it's fun. If TigerMaster was actually interested and cared about them and the project, he'd be excited every time one shows up, not hating on Bombardier constantly.
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I couldn't care less about the streetcars. My one and only prerogative is improved transit services, and Bombardier is standing in our way.
 
Duck said:
Crazy maybe, but it's crazier to want to willingly "screw Bombardier over" just out of spite (TigerMaster). That's so... childish.

I get that it sucks, but I often feel that the people who are whining the hardest are just looking for something to whine about - that they don't actually care about the delivery schedule at all. They just are looking for someone to blame because it's fun. If TigerMaster was actually interested and cared about them and the project, he'd be excited every time one shows up, not hating on Bombardier constantly.
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Given just how badly BBD has screwed everyone, and that they lie endlessly with bogus delivery schedules, it's time they were nailed to the wall. I don't want to screw BBD over spite, but I'm glad to see that TTC is fighting this.

I question why you are so quick to bend over for BBD. I have to think you have some relationship with BBD apart from being a transit rider.
 
I don't, at all - just a huge fan and a proud Canadian. I think they make the best trains out there.

I think a huge, huge part of the problem is that because of the legal battle between the TTC and Bombardier, Bombardier can't be transparent about what's actually, specifically going on, so people come up with these fantastic theories about how they have board meetings rubbing their hands together trying to figure out the best way to make everyone in Toronto miserable.

It's a lot like when you're at Canada's Wonderland and a ride "breaks down" and the operators don't tell you anything about what happened, because they're not supposed to. So people start saying "OH THE TRAIN FELL OFF OMG OMG PEOPLE DIED", when really all that happened was a cable broke on a prox switch and the train stopped automatically on the block brake, and the maintenance guy comes out and it takes him 20 minutes to swap out. BFD. The mind is the devil's playground... if you really think Bombardier's folks are "out to get you" you have a pretty sad outlook on life.
 
Duck said:
I think a huge, huge part of the problem is that because of the legal battle between the TTC and Bombardier, Bombardier can't be transparent about what's actually, specifically going on, so people come up with these fantastic theories about how they have board meetings rubbing their hands together trying to figure out the best way to make everyone in Toronto miserable.
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No, that's not the prevailing theory. It's more like, the poor erecting bay supervisor is staring dumbfounded as two workers demonstrate how this time it's Tab Q that won't line up with Slot R, and the people on the other end of the phone in Mexico swear they built it correctly, and Head Office has stopped returning phone calls.

- Paul
 
While its true Bombardier Transportation makes some outstanding products, it doesnt help that their management team is an outright laughable joke from head to toe. It's been proven that they lie through their teeth on an almost weekly basis, and are either not interested or dont know how to resolve production issues.
 
nfitz said:
That's just a crazy comment. Between an H6 and a T1 perhaps ... between a Nova and an Orion, sure.

But between the ALRV and the Flexity? Just judging by the looks you get, and the cameras being pulled out when one goes somewhere unusual, most people are well aware.

And really that's not the point. The point is that they are running buses now on some routes because of the shortage of streetcars. So ignore the crowding issue ... there's few that mistake a bus for a streetcar ... and if they do, they are likely to be run over by it, as they walk to the centre of the road!
Click to expand...
All of that is true....but I doubt the average guy on the street is aware why those buses are running....the few I have asked (really limited sample size but so far 100% consistent in the answer) think it is an attempt by TTC to increase service and that buses work better than streetcars because they can zig zag around cars....true story.
 
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