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Transit Fantasy Maps

Gweed and I have a similar concept of future rapid transit in GTA, maybe the same inspiration. My map was basically rip off of Berlin U-Bahn/S-Bahn.

Rapid transit at both local and regional scales integrated into one system was the idea. Of course, we both added LRT as well, which is semi-rapid transit, not true rapid transit, but it's not too out-of-place either.

I don't think BRT fits though, because it is not rail. Even if it did fit, they would be hard to represent on the same map. Just look at the planned service for Mississauga Transitway for example:
33m5phg.png

Not only are there a huge amount of lines overlapping, even with GO buses excluded, but the distinction between what is a rapid transit line and what is not rapid transit line here is very blurred.

For the record, true "rapid transit" means limited stops, high frequency, all day, all week service, all door boarding, grade-separation, and other priority measures if needed. Commuter trains are not rapid transit. My map does not show any commuter rail service.
 
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doady said:
Gweed and I have a similar concept of future rapid transit in GTA, maybe the same inspiration. My map was basically rip off of Berlin U-Bahn/S-Bahn.

Rapid transit at both local and regional scales integrated into one system was the idea. Of course, we both added LRT as well, which is semi-rapid transit, not true rapid transit, but it's not too out-of-place either.

I don't think BRT fits though, because it is not rail. Even if it did fit, they would be hard to represent on the same map. Just look at the planned service for Mississauga Transitway for example:
33m5phg.png

Not only are there a huge amount of lines overlapping, even with GO buses excluded, but the distinction between what is a rapid transit line and what is not rapid transit line here is very blurred.

For the record, true "rapid transit" means limited stops, high frequency, all day, all week service, all door boarding, grade-separation, and other priority measures if needed. Commuter trains are not rapid transit. My map does not show any commuter rail service.
Click to expand...

Yup, the S-Bahn concept is exactly what I was going for. Leave the E Lines to deal with long distance travel, the subways for travel along heavily used urban corridors, and LRT lines as feeder lines.

With the BRT I decided to show the corridor, and not the specific route. I realize that with a lot of these there are going to be a lot of branch routes, etc. But by showing the BRT corridor, even if it's just dedicated lanes, it shows that there's some sort of higher order transit there. I used the same colour for all of them, just so that people could see that there's some sort of improved bus service there, and then they could consult a local route map to see the branch info, etc.

I think it's worthwhile to show it on the map, just for reference, but I don't think it should be the focus of the map by any means, which is why I chose a relatively passive colour, so that it doesn't jump out at you (the E Lines on the other hand are all very bright colours, so your eye is drawn to them first, exactly what you want them to be).
 
I'm curious why I've never heard a proposal for rapid transit on or near Dufferin, considering it's the busiest bus line. I'm not sure why it's so busy, it's possible that the Eglinton or Jane LRT will/would take some of the pressure off Dufferin, but Jane seems very far away.

Well okay, the old Queen Subway, plans for which were abandoned in the 70s, mentions Dufferin - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_line
 
I'd like a streetcar for Dufferin going south from Bloor to the exhibition, heading east to combine with the harbourfront streetcar for a 509 Dufferin-Harbourfront line. I don't know how much car traffic is on Dufferin south of Bloor during rush hour, but I think a side of the road ROW would be cool if it could be squeezed in.
 
Dufferin is very busy further north too, I'm not sure where people are boarding, maybe near Eglinton or Lawrence? No less busy, from what I've seen, than south of Bloor. A long-term plan should include a connection to the Eglinton LRT. Furthermore, I'm not sure it has to be on Dufferin precisely. Part of the popularity of the Dufferin bus must be due to lack of alternatives. There seems to be a good deal of development potential around the Junction Triangle and north between Caledonia and Weston Rd due to underused industrial land. Maybe an LRT should go from say Eglinton W and Caledonia to Bloor and Lansdowne assuming it's easier to follow the train tracks. I realize that's where the Rail Path is. A connection to harbourfront would be great.
 
calimehtar said:
Dufferin is very busy further north too, I'm not sure where people are boarding, maybe near Eglinton or Lawrence? No less busy, from what I've seen, than south of Bloor. A long-term plan should include a connection to the Eglinton LRT. Furthermore, I'm not sure it has to be on Dufferin precisely. Part of the popularity of the Dufferin bus must be due to lack of alternatives. There seems to be a good deal of development potential around the Junction Triangle and north between Caledonia and Weston Rd due to underused industrial land. Maybe an LRT should go from say Eglinton W and Caledonia to Bloor and Lansdowne assuming it's easier to follow the train tracks. I realize that's where the Rail Path is. A connection to harbourfront would be great.
Click to expand...

An LRT along Caledonia to Bloor vs Dufferin? You must be kidding. There is way more traffic on Dufferin. There is no way the Caledonia bus runs as frequent as Dufferin which is every 2 min. An LRT down Dufferin though could not be grade separated,. There is no room. There are 2 lanes in both directions, when cars are not parked on the west side
 
You're 100% correct, but I'm saying that Caledonia is close enough to Dufferin that people might use it if it was an alternative.

Dufferin is a great street for driving and a rare street that goes from north of the 401 all the way to the lakeshore. So because it's practical to a large number of transit riders, and because the bus can travel relatively quickly, it's a popular line that has attracted riders from other routes. That doesn't mean the LRT, if one is built, needs to go right there. It would be better to find a route that would allow grade separation and is not too far away.
 
I posted this on the DRL routing thread, but I'll re-post it here since a) getting a complete DRL, let alone two as shown here makes it seem like quite a fantasy, and b) the subject of Dufferin came up.

funone.jpg


Here the Queen DRL (red line) is a little more slow moving - it could be a buried LRT with rather frequent stops. That would be good for the small-scale retail and walkability of Queen and Roncesvalles as well.
To offset it, I imagined the Dufferin - Pape collector as having somewhat more rapid speed and fewer stops, designed to whisk big crowds in and out of the core, quickly. It would, though, have the advantage of also being a "places you want to go" line - with it's Dufferin Gates, Ontario Place, Princes' Gates, Market, and Distillery Stops. (Plus an off-map Science Centre one, I imagine). It also has extra GO access in good locations, which would be handy. One would be in the proposed Bathurst Station location, another as a Portlands - Distillery Gateway at Cherry.

It could also be built in stages. The Queen line, for example, could be built only south of Bloor in it's first stage. The Dufferin-Pape collector could either only be built south of Bloor first as well, or even just south of the Queen line. Or, the Queen line could just extend underground between the northward arms of the Dufferin-Pape collector. At any rate, the lower transfer floor of the stations could just be roughed in until needed if the city is feeling abstemious as usual.
 
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CanadianNational said:
I posted this on the DRL routing thread, but I'll re-post it here since a) getting a complete DRL, let alone two as shown here makes it seem like quite a fantasy, and b) the subject of Dufferin came up.

funone.jpg


Here the Queen DRL (red line) is a little more slow moving - it could be a buried LRT with rather frequent stops. That would be good for the small-scale retail and walkability of Queen and Roncesvalles as well.
To offset it, I imagined the Dufferin - Pape collector as having somewhat more rapid speed and fewer stops, designed to whisk big crowds in and out of the core, quickly. It would, though, have the advantage of also being a "places you want to go" line - with it's Dufferin Gates, Ontario Place, Princes' Gates, Market, and Distillery Stops. (Plus an off-map Science Centre one, I imagine). It also has extra GO access in good locations, which would be handy. One would be in the proposed Bathurst Station location, another as a Portlands - Distillery Gateway at Cherry.

It could also be built in stages. The Queen line, for example, could be built only south of Bloor in it's first stage. The Dufferin-Pape collector could either only be built south of Bloor first as well, or even just south of the Queen line. Or, the Queen line could just extend underground between the northward arms of the Dufferin-Pape collector. At any rate, the lower transfer floor of the stations could just be roughed in until needed if the city is feeling abstemious as usual.
Click to expand...

I think the key in all of these types of things is to recognize that the needs of Queen and the needs of a relief line cannot be accomplished in a single line without significantly compromising one of those needs.

It's the same flaw with Transit City: Is it a long haul line, or is it a local feeder line? It's both, but it does neither very well.

I do like the map though, although I personally think that if you're going to go with a King alignment, you'd be better off going with a Wellington alignment. Same benefits as King, plus you get a connection to Union, and you build under a less important street.
 
my transit dream;

it would probably take about 30-50 billion dollars to finish, but what the heck, i'll show you it anyways.

heres the legend;

red: underground heavy rail subway

orange: surface heavy rail subway

green: possible future subway extension (though not immediate)

dark blue: underground LRT

light blue: aboveground LRT


first, an overall map. it implements all of the original transit city, with some modifications to some lines and extensions to others.

1torontotransit1.jpg


I decided to put Sheppard underground for the part of the west extension, and have the old subway portion changed to underground LRT, allowing for a single continuous line.

I put in the Hurontario LRT and a highway 7 LRT as well.

Finch gets built in the east as per transit city, and gets extended in a large westward extension to Markham road.

Eglinton gets built out to the airport in the west and up to just past Sheppard in the east.

I put in an extension of the Bloor line to Square One mall in the west, as well as the rebuilding of the RT to be part of the Bloor line, with an extension to Malvern.

I built the DRL down queen, using the railway ROW to cheaply travel up to the airport. in the east it runs up Pape until Eglinton, runs on laird for around 2km, then hops on don mills until Steeles. a possible future extension of the DRL is into Markham centre, to help get easy transit access to the proposed hockey arena there.

1torontotransit3.jpg


1torontotransit2.jpg


I split the Spadina and Yonge lines at union. (probably a stupidly high price sticker for this)

Yonge goes down, serves Southcore, the Skydome, Cityplace, the Ex, and heads out through Humber Bay to port credit. it runs above ground for a bit south of high park.

the southern Spadina extension serves the booming donlands, and then continues on to the beaches.
 
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