Transit City Plan

[kettal]

Of course there won't be any guarantees. There's no guarantee now. I hate to bring up this example, but suppose somebody decides to end his life on the tracks at Leslie Station? Then your precious subway will be delayed. Despite it being a subway!

Your prediction of total chaos on the streets is quite unfounded.

As an aside, suicide is a lot more challenging with LRVs than it is with a subway train.

 

[Ansem]

Of course there won't be any guarantees. There's no guarantee now. I hate to bring up this example, but suppose somebody decides to end his life on the tracks at Leslie Station? Then your precious subway will be delayed. Despite it being a subway!

Your prediction of total chaos on the streets is quite unfounded.

As an aside, suicide is a lot more challenging with LRVs than it is with a subway train.

Like you said:

To stop a subway, it usually takes a suicide...

Lrt:
-Snow
-accident
-Traffic light malfunction
-left turns delay


There's a higher risk of delays of shutdown than a subway...

 

[scarberiankhatru]

The sailing may be relatively smooth and comparable to a subway inside the tunnel, but since vehicles will be at the mercy of traffic lights outside of the tunnel, frequency is an unknown variable that could lead to dreaded bunching, particularly given the TTC's not so pretty track record of managing long lines. Maybe I'm old-fashioned, but I like to include *waiting* in total travel times, not just the time spent on a moving vehicle.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Like you said:

To stop a subway, it usually takes a suicide...

Lrt:
-Snow
-accident
-Traffic light malfunction
-left turns delay


There's a higher risk of delays of shutdown than a subway...

Snow has closed down the Spadina HRT subway, accidents do happen on the subway as well (not just suicides), the signal lights also malfunction, and there are delays due to people holding the doors open.

 

[nfitz]

... and there are delays due to people holding the doors open.

Does holding doors open really delay? The ones I've seen tend to be the train is packed so much, that someone has some fabric or strap in the door, that they aren't even aware of. Normally the door being held open catches on the second try.

And the door being held is often for a good reason! Some operators seem much to keen to close the doors too fast ... one day this week in rush hour, I was still lining up to get out the door of the train, and the chiming started ... and the doors started to close ... and opened again ... I looked down the platform and even then there were still people exiting the train - let alone the poor buggers who were patiently waiting to board the train (plenty of space in the train, with all the people getting off). It's no wonder people charge the doors ...

 

[Automation Gallery]

The future of our streets
Will Transit City expansion plans alleviate traffic chaos — or just make our streets less car friend.

http://www.towncrieronline.ca/main/...ewstory&storyid=7921&rootcatid=&rootsubcatid=

 

[MisterF]

Snow has closed down the Spadina HRT subway, accidents do happen on the subway as well (not just suicides), the signal lights also malfunction, and there are delays due to people holding the doors open.

Accidents, traffic signals, and delays are all worse on street-running LRT than on a subway. This isn't rocket science.

 

[RedRocket191]

Accidents, traffic signals, and delays are all worse on street-running LRT than on a subway. This isn't rocket science.

No one disagree... But the original comment was that suicide is the only thing that stops a subway.

 

[Epi]

I don't think the Sheppard subway will change anytime soon. It's ridership is increasing by leaps and bounds, and once Sheppard TC and Don Mills TC gets built, it will probably go even higher. With all of the new condos built along Sheppard as well, ridership can only go higher still. (Thousands of units at Bayview and Sheppard, 2000 in Concord Park Place, and 1000s more at Fairview Mall).

At current, you'd need LRT every 5 minutes to equal out Sheppard's peak ridership, so if the ridership went any higher, then you'd for sure need trains to short turn at Don Mills to keep it from overcrowding. In that case, you get the same problem with transfers.

As well it'd probably cost a ton of money to retrofit subway tunnels to work with LRT due to platform length and pantograph needs. I just don't see them abandoning the Sheppard line, stubway or not.

 

[Second_in_pie]

I don't think the Sheppard subway will change anytime soon. It's ridership is increasing by leaps and bounds, and once Sheppard TC and Don Mills TC gets built, it will probably go even higher. With all of the new condos built along Sheppard as well, ridership can only go higher still. (Thousands of units at Bayview and Sheppard, 2000 in Concord Park Place, and 1000s more at Fairview Mall).

At current, you'd need LRT every 5 minutes to equal out Sheppard's peak ridership, so if the ridership went any higher, then you'd for sure need trains to short turn at Don Mills to keep it from overcrowding. In that case, you get the same problem with transfers.

As well it'd probably cost a ton of money to retrofit subway tunnels to work with LRT due to platform length and pantograph needs. I just don't see them abandoning the Sheppard line, stubway or not.

If Sheppard was extended to Downsview and had added stations enough so there wouldn't be any bus service (not that I have a thing against the bus, but it means that people can easily get to the subway without needing to take a bus) Then I would see it's purpose as a subway for NYCC. Seriously though, those stations are so far apart! Revive Willowdale station and make a new one between Leslie and Don Mills. Then I wouldn't object to it at all. Actually, I'd hail it as a step in the right direction as both a link for the YUS and a subway to provide service to the rapidly growing NYCC, probably soon to be the uptown downtown.

 

[Ansem]

If Sheppard was extended to Downsview and had added stations enough so there wouldn't be any bus service (not that I have a thing against the bus, but it means that people can easily get to the subway without needing to take a bus) Then I would see it's purpose as a subway for NYCC. Seriously though, those stations are so far apart! Revive Willowdale station and make a new one between Leslie and Don Mills. Then I wouldn't object to it at all. Actually, I'd hail it as a step in the right direction as both a link for the YUS and a subway to provide service to the rapidly growing NYCC, probably soon to be the uptown downtown.

To bad it will take a richmond hill subway to put the downsview extension on the table...

 

[Second_in_pie]

To bad it will take a richmond hill subway to put the downsview extension on the table...

A Richmond Hill subway will happen I tell you! Anyways, extending Sheppard wouldn't interfere with the TTC's philosophy of "It's always better to extend a line forever than to start a new one"

 

[Epi]

If Sheppard was extended to Downsview and had added stations enough so there wouldn't be any bus service (not that I have a thing against the bus, but it means that people can easily get to the subway without needing to take a bus) Then I would see it's purpose as a subway for NYCC. Seriously though, those stations are so far apart! Revive Willowdale station and make a new one between Leslie and Don Mills. Then I wouldn't object to it at all. Actually, I'd hail it as a step in the right direction as both a link for the YUS and a subway to provide service to the rapidly growing NYCC, probably soon to be the uptown downtown.

While a Willowdale station would be nice to have, having an extra station between Leslie and Don Mills is a bit of a waste. There's absolutely nothing worth going to between those two streets and the ridership simply does not justify it.

 

[nfitz]

There's absolutely nothing worth going to between those two streets and the ridership simply does not justify it.

Between Shaugnessy Blvd and the back lane to Longhope Place - there is literally nothing at all. And both those locations are 500 metres from a subway station already. There's a reason, however, that the station at Willowdale was already roughed in.

 

[Dan416]

If Willowdale Station is already roughed in, how much would it cost to build it? How much would it cost if we did it on the cheap? How much if we TTC-size it (i.e. supersize it)? I think a Willowdale Station on the existing line, and an extension west to serve Bathurst and Downsivew would add ridership to Sheppard and make it much more useful.

But you gotta wonder, if the TTC considered this, how logical does it become to have a Sheppard East LRT being planned east of Don Mills? If we're gonna make the Sheppard line useful as a crosstown corridor, it should go from Downsview to STC at the least.