Transit City Plan

[Ed007Toronto]

I think the Finch line should stop at Finch West with the Sheppard subway being extended West to Downsview. That way people crossing the north end of the city wouldn't be dumped on the busy Yonge line.

 

[Antiloop33rpm]

Enviro: It is worth pointing out that I placed those lines on the map totally at random. I really don't know those areas well enough to plot an exact path for the lines into downtown. The only reason I drew them was just to indicate that a tunnel (following some route, whatever it may be) could be built to take those lines into the downtown core and turn them into an LRT/DRL hybrid (once extensive work was done at Union Station to properly accomodate half a dozen or so LRT lines entering into a single terminus).

 

[Darkstar416]

*This plan does nothing for downtowners. Toronto will remain a horrible city to go east-west through the downtown via transit (yet many of our densifying neighourhoods are along these corridors). Basically, someone will be able to get from VCC to King & Bay faster than someone will be able to get from Parkdale to Parliament via King, Queen, Dundas or Carlton. Why no exploratory talk of a DRL? Why no talk of a streetcar tunnel through the downtown?

 

[Darkstar416]

*The Eglinton portion of this plan is definitely the highlight and could easily transform vast swaths of this city. The TTC MUST get this right though. Limited stops, signal priority, frequent service, etc. A tunnel between Laird & Keele would be perfect! This is one of the TTC's busiest corridors (if not the busiest in terms of service routes) and would solve many headaches (post-construction that is).

 

[Darkstar416]

*All the other lines make a good deal of sense, although I admit I'm not too knowledgable about the situation in Scarborough.

 

[Darkstar416]

A bird chirped in my ear that will remain nameless, but do expect the following announcement from the TTC soon...

*24-hour subway service for Nuit Blanche 2007 and New Year's Eve 2007/2008.

*A return to diamond lanes on King St through the downtown with regular enforcement, despite Mirvish's protests.

*The King streetcar (and possibly all others) to go P.O.P. in 2008.

*A long-term plan to have all routes (bus and tram) go to 10 minutes or better by 2012 for at least 16 hours of the day.

Looks like T.O. is slowly becoming a "transit city" yet again!

 

[jayomatic]

I suggest people go read the comments area of this story on the globe and mail website. I've been arguing with people all day over msn telling me how stupid the mayor and ttc are. We really are the minority aren't we.

 

[Darkstar416]

A couple quick thoughts...

*A Sheppard LRT would be a waste of money. Keep running the Rocket busses until the time comes financially that Sheppard can be completed to STC (and even to Donsview in the west). Same goes with the SRT replacement. It should be replaced with a B-D extension to STC, nothing else.

 

[Brighter Hell]

*This plan does nothing for downtowners. Toronto will remain a horrible city to go east-west through the downtown via transit (yet many of our densifying neighourhoods are along these corridors). Basically, someone will be able to get from VCC to King & Bay faster than someone will be able to get from Parkdale to Parliament via King, Queen, Dundas or Carlton. Why no exploratory talk of a DRL? Why no talk of a streetcar tunnel through the downtown?

That's what I've been wondering too. Density and census maps show that a DRL would go through some of the densest and fastest growing neighbourhoods in the city. It's such a no-brainer that it should be #1 on the list. But for some reason council, staff, and the media are completely oblivious.

 

[prometheus the supremo]

do you mean they're on the game show they don't even know they're on?

 

[Bogtrotter]

.. a bird chirped into my ear once- a subway line along Eglinton makes sense for a world city which hopes someday in future to join ranks with Tokyo, London, Chicago, Sydney, Montreal, Paris, Madrid, Hongkong, Singapore, ... err I could go on for another dozen cities which have better urban coverage in their subway systems. Not that I'm critical of the TTC however- these poor blighters are inundated wih financial constraints. But I think the solution is a little more broad than the current 'local ' arrangement.

 

[dashingdan]

A good portion of the Eglinton LRT would be underground, so why not just make it subway? Or at least build the tunnel big enough that you could run a subway through it when the time comes to upgrade the LRT to subway.

 

[lokyin]

the plan looks really good from the point of view of when you're looking at the map.. good in the sense that it seems like it fills out a lot more parts of Toronto, looks quite balanced.

Jane is definitely there so that intensification can happen in the future. Don Mills can transform into a DRL in later phases if it extends past B/D southwards.

Ya, the most important thing is streetcar having priority and not having to wait for lights... I use the spadina streetcar frequently (or, i used to...) it's just so slow and the service is so sporadic. It needs to operate faster. Hope spadina and all future LRTs can have priorities.

 

[Twisted Son of Gumby]

Also, it should grow ridership quickly which will overload the system in key areas which will in turn force subway construction where it should be built rather than where it suits some political benefit.

Exactly. I think a fairly direct analog would be the old Bloor streetcar route, for example, which operated for decades until development along Bloor Street and Danforth Avenue, and the ensuing ridership that followed, gave cause to build the Bloor-Danforth subway. Stands to reason the same would happen in the long term with a good number of the proposed LRT routes that spark development and ridership in their corridors enough to justify an upgrade to heavy rail.

 

[socialwoe back with a vengence]

Ssh... I gotta make up for lost time!

Who says everyone using the subway goes downtown?

Agreed the inner-suburbs are vastly becoming just as trafficked as the core hence justifying these LRT routes.

Oh my god. Socialwoe's identity is revealed: he's David Miller! Light Rail on Morningside?! Have they ever been there?

Nope, though I am glad to have discovered I have ESP. Morningside can more than support a LRT, a subway even. With major nodes at every intersecting concession plus everyone busing in from the east ridership will skyrocket.

I support the Eglinton line. It'll be fairly impressive, sure, but I remain to be convinced that it won't be slower than the Bloor line.

But it'll cover a greater distance with more stops so if it's slower couldn't it be chopped up to that?

I'm with unimaginative on NE Scarborough being completely overrated,

In contrast to where? Anyone who doesn't live near mass transit will have be biased to thinking: why there and not here. The important thing is to remember that Scarborough is 1/3 of the city over an hour in places from the subway, this slashes commutes significantly and does hit some points of interest that's worthy.

Set a long-term plan to complete the Sheppard line, an LRT would make it a stubway permanently rather than just a slow-birth that grows over time.

Would anyone seriously miss the Sheppard subway though? Why can't we pull out now before another $10+ billion goes down the drain? All we have to do is raise the track level up an enbankment to allow passenger boarding at the current Sheppard stops.

It says Eglinton would be underground from Laird to Keele, surface the rest of the way. Easily the best part of the plan.

I wonder what the spacing would be like for the tunnel? I'm hoping subway length distances.

...spending billions on a tunneled streetcar is a complete and utter waste of money. Streetcars to the airport? That'll take, what, 90 minutes from downtown?

You say that like it takes any faster using the curent infrastructure. 90 mins sure beat the forever journey on the Malton bus or just missing the 192 and being stranded at Kipling for another hour.