Toronto shootings

[Rufus8]

The crime rate in Toronto was higher than it is today in the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, 1990s and the early 2000s.

I'm not really prepared to entertain that 'morality' has gone down the drain while we have fewer homicides, fewer serious assaults etc.

What I am prepared to entertain is that there have always been people who would break the law if it was easy to do so; there have always been people who will break the law out of ignorance or persevered necessity.

What we do is tackle those things by enforcing through automation what we used to through people (running reds, stop signs and/or speeding are all enforceable by cameras)

What we do is ensure that everyone receives a good education, which should always (and currently does) feature discussions of good citizenship and character.

Points of emphasis naturally change and will cycle based on what is more problematic at a given time. Sexual consent, littering, the environment, helping the elderly etc etc.

Doubtless some things need cycling again, that will forever be the case.

The population is greater than it was in the 50's and 60's and 70's. Also conscription was a way of roping in the kids to see who was going to be trouble, everyone had an eye on them. Income disparity was also greater, renting was not seen as a character failing and government money was only available to a few (the elderly, children). Everything was different. The thing about moraliity is it is down to the individual, the government can't do anything about it. Personal responsibility is such a drag!

 

[CityStay]

Would Shooting of the Day, Stabbing of the Day, Homicide of the Week be 3 threads or just one?

Asking for a friend..

 

[Northern Light]

Would Shooting of the Day, Stabbing of the Day, Homicide of the Week be 3 threads or just one?

Asking for a friend..

Let's start dismantling your snark with facts.

50 most dangerous cities (over 300000) world wide (by homicide rate)

List of cities by homicide rate - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Please note there's not one Canadian City in the bunch.

Ah, you say, that's nice, but what about just comparing Toronto within Canada?

Done.

Top 16 Worst Major Cities in Canada by Crime Rate

Are you safer in a large city in Canada or in a smaller town?

www.immigroup.com

We are the 16th most dangerous city

That would make us safer than Montreal, Halifax, Regina, Hamilton, Victoria, Winnipeg, Edmonton or Calgary.

Or once again, let's look at the positive.

11 cities around the world where crime is low, hospitals are plentiful, and families can feel safe

Big cities aren't necessarily unsafe.

www.independent.co.uk

Toronto, 4th safest city in the world. (looking solely at personal security from crime, #5)

You're welcome.

 

[pman]

Yup, nothing to see here. Complacency all round, chaps.

 

[Northern Light]

Yup, nothing to see here. Complacency all round, chaps.

You do like to make statements that have nothing behind them or are at least grossly exaggerated.

Calm yourself.

Who here said that Toronto would benefit from initiatives to lower crime and/or violent crime?

I myself have advocated for several, repeatedly.

That is not complacency.

What I have insisted on is that we not have moral panic over a decaying society and rampant crime when that isn't true either, as objectively measurable by the facts.

Less hyperbole, more substance.

Also, I have yet to see much concrete action from you on any area you complain about regularly, in any thread. Be that constructive suggestions, or emails/contacts, or asking for support for a particular initiative or idea.

You're just endlessly full of complaints and cynicism. A reminder, if you're not part of the solution, you are the problem.

 

[MisterF]

The population is greater than it was in the 50's and 60's and 70's. Also conscription was a way of roping in the kids to see who was going to be trouble, everyone had an eye on them. Income disparity was also greater, renting was not seen as a character failing and government money was only available to a few (the elderly, children). Everything was different. The thing about moraliity is it is down to the individual, the government can't do anything about it. Personal responsibility is such a drag!

Wait, conscription?? This isn't Israel, we don't have conscription and didn't from the 50s to the 70s either. Population is irrelevant if the crime rate had gone down.

 

[Jasmine18]

Lol at Trudeau saying ford wants to make guns easy to buy..

When did provinces dictate gun laws?

Fake news much?

 

[Towered]

For a city with a daytime population of over 5 million I'd say we do not have so many shootings. Young? They're always young because they're impressionable, impulsive and feel invincible. That's why the military recruits the young, since you can't reliably expect those with lived experience to march into danger for the sake of a flag.

Let's start dismantling your snark with facts.

50 most dangerous cities (over 300000) world wide (by homicide rate)

List of cities by homicide rate - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Please note there's not one Canadian City in the bunch.

Ah, you say, that's nice, but what about just comparing Toronto within Canada?

Done.

Top 16 Worst Major Cities in Canada by Crime Rate

Are you safer in a large city in Canada or in a smaller town?

www.immigroup.com

We are the 16th most dangerous city

That would make us safer than Montreal, Halifax, Regina, Hamilton, Victoria, Winnipeg, Edmonton or Calgary.

Or once again, let's look at the positive.

11 cities around the world where crime is low, hospitals are plentiful, and families can feel safe

Big cities aren't necessarily unsafe.

www.independent.co.uk

Toronto, 4th safest city in the world. (looking solely at personal security from crime, #5)

You're welcome.

It's stunning how dominant Latin America is on that list of the world's most dangerous cities.

 

[Johnny Au]

CP24 (and some other news sources) are to blame for perpetuating the belief that Toronto is somehow dangerous. Toronto is still one of the safest major cities in the world. After all, CP24 (and some other news sources) gain views/readership from crime news.

 

[Jasmine18]

CP24 (and some other news sources) are to blame for perpetuating the belief that Toronto is somehow dangerous. Toronto is still one of the safest major cities in the world. After all, CP24 (and some other news sources) gain views/readership from crime news.

True but the thing is we have a lot more shootings then before and the great income inequality and distrust of police and we do have the foundation to start having more an American style shooting problem.

Just because the raw numbers are not there does not mean things are acceptable and myabe we should try to stop it before it gets to that point.

 

[Northern Light]

True but the thing is we have a lot more shootings then before and the great income inequality and distrust of police and we do have the foundation to start having more an American style shooting problem.

Just because the raw numbers are not there does not mean things are acceptable and myabe we should try to stop it before it gets to that point.

No one, so far as I can discern has been suggesting otherwise.

The argument is that 'panic' is neither justified nor helpful.

When your focus is prevention, and the next generation of youth, most of that action is policy (minimum wage, social assistance rates etc.), legislation (gun control) and early intervention with struggling youth
through education, healthcare and social work systems.

When you panic, the response tends to focus on more police and longer sentences etc etc, rather than addressing the core issue. That's not to say police have no role in arresting (pun intended) the problem; but its a comparatively small part of the solution required.

One needs to be rational about such things and have a calm discussion, starting with facts as they are, rather than how they may be perceived.

 

[CityStay]

Let's start dismantling your snark with facts.

50 most dangerous cities (over 300000) world wide (by homicide rate)

List of cities by homicide rate - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Please note there's not one Canadian City in the bunch.

Ah, you say, that's nice, but what about just comparing Toronto within Canada?

Done.

Top 16 Worst Major Cities in Canada by Crime Rate

Are you safer in a large city in Canada or in a smaller town?

www.immigroup.com

We are the 16th most dangerous city

That would make us safer than Montreal, Halifax, Regina, Hamilton, Victoria, Winnipeg, Edmonton or Calgary.

Or once again, let's look at the positive.

11 cities around the world where crime is low, hospitals are plentiful, and families can feel safe

Big cities aren't necessarily unsafe.

www.independent.co.uk

Toronto, 4th safest city in the world. (looking solely at personal security from crime, #5)

You're welcome.

What a crap dismantling!

So we're not in the bottom 50 worldwide? Shocker there, quite an accomplishment!

Safer than Montreal? They've averaged 32 murders over the last 13 years and are on a downward trajectory, we've averaged 73 and are on an upward trajectory (we were in the mid 50s between 2011-2015 then hit 75, 65, 96). Back in the '70s, '80s, '90s Montreal was way more violent than Toronto but they are currently at 12 (!) on a pace for 16 (!). We're currently at 54 on a pace for 70.

And the Economist report you cite is from 2017 and only compares 60 cities worldwide. Where are Berlin, Hamburg, Munich, Vienna, Helsinki, Oslo, Copenhagen.. just to name a few. The 2019 report has dropped us to 6th overall and 8th in personal security.

https://safecities.economist.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Aug-5-ENG-NEC-Safe-Cities-2019-270x210-19-screen.pdf

The Economist must be watching too much CP 24!

 

[CityStay]

CP24 (and some other news sources) are to blame for perpetuating the belief that Toronto is somehow dangerous. Toronto is still one of the safest major cities in the world. After all, CP24 (and some other news sources) gain views/readership from crime news.

If only they would stop reporting shootings, stabbings and murders our crime rate would plummet, right?

 

[CityStay]

No one, so far as I can discern has been suggesting otherwise.

The argument is that 'panic' is neither justified nor helpful.

When your focus is prevention, and the next generation of youth, most of that action is policy (minimum wage, social assistance rates etc.), legislation (gun control) and early intervention with struggling youth
through education, healthcare and social work systems.

When you panic, the response tends to focus on more police and longer sentences etc etc, rather than addressing the core issue. That's not to say police have no role in arresting (pun intended) the problem; but its a comparatively small part of the solution required.

One needs to be rational about such things and have a calm discussion, starting with facts as they are, rather than how they may be perceived.

Nobody is claiming that Toronto is on its way to becoming the next Caracas or Mogadishu but the sharp increase in violence over the last few years should be a cause for concern.

Dismissing, diminishing, rationalizing and otherwise burying your head in the sand won't solve anything.

You want facts? Go to the TPS site instead of Googling cherry-picked 'rankings' sites.

Public Safety Data Portal

The Toronto Police Service Public Safety Data Portal provides police open data, data analytic and web map applications to the public to improve the understanding of policing, improve transparency and enhance confidence through open data.

data.torontopolice.on.ca

Shootings have been on a steady upswing over the last 5 years and are almost triple what they were in 2014.

At what point do you face up to reality? 5x? 10x?

 

[pman]

Yes, I think having the top earners paying little to no income tax via loop holes is a problem. Close the loop holes on dividend income/loss right offs, etc. so that every income level pays the correct rate below.

The New 2018 Canada Income Tax Rates and Brackets

The Canada tax system can be complex. Here's a list of the 2017 Canada tax rates, tax brackets and deductions you can take to lower your bill.

www.mileiq.com

What Are The Canada Tax Brackets for 2018?

Income	Tax Rate
The first $46,605	15%
$46,605 to $93,208	20.5%
$93,208 to $144,489	26%
$144,489 to $205,842	29%
over $205,842	33%

Those are federal only. The combined federal-provincial top marginal rate in Ontario is 53.5% on ordinary income, kicking in at around $220k in taxable income. If you have high T4 income (salary), there aren’t that many loopholes, and you certainly don’t end up paying little to no income tax.