The world's most liveable cities—Toronto #15, Vancouver #4

[arvy]

I really like Vienna & Geneva; could live in any of those cities. Pretty much agree with the top 10. As far as North America's west coast, I would rank it Vancouver/Seattle/Portland. The report had Portland ahead of Seattle.

 

[wonderboy416]

A bit ironic to hear that Asian cities have good schools, after last year.

My experience is that Japanese cities have many of the qualities you mention. I do not believe that most other Asian cities have good access to healthcare (in China, there is very little access, I understand). Their crime rates are low, especially in Japan, but in China most crime seems to be done by the party and there is no recourse for that kind of activity. I would rather live in a place with a functioning justice system, as well.

Frankly, I haven't seen an Asian city that I would prefer to Toronto. Seoul came closest, I guess, there was something about it that I really cared for a great deal. But they tend to be a bit ugly as well.

Well Japan and South Korea certainly have top-notch healthcare, great schools and many fantastic post-secondary options. As does Hong Kong, Singapore, Taiwan etc. Mainland China does scare me to death though (especially after reading a fantastic novel called Made poorly in China - author is escaping me).

Interesting about your feelings towards Seoul. I feel that Seoul is the Toronto of Asia. It's certainly world-class, an economic powerhouse and one of the continent's most important cities, yet Tokyo, Hong Kong and Beijing are always being regarded as the "major" asian cities according to the BBC, CNN and popular media just like Toronto always seems to be mentioned behind NYC, Chicago, LA etc... Those that live in and visit Seoul know how special it is, just like those that live in Toronto... those outside it tend to be ignorant about it. I was surprised not to see it on the list. You'd be hard pressed to find a better transportation system on the planet (and to think 2 new subway lines are opening within a year, and we're not talking Sheppard lines, they're actual subway lines with dozens of stations and transfer points to other lines. I won't go into the healthcare and education here... but I'd regard both as better than Toronto's offerings by a landslide (I can actually see a family doctor without notice rather than waiting 3 hours for a walk-in doctor who will spend all 30 seconds with me, most of which is writing a prescription).

 

[Archivist]

Interesting what you say about Seoul - you certainly know it better than I do - my warm feelings towards it are based on a week's stay with my nephew who is teaching English there. I found it warm, interesting, massive, and quite beautiful in its own way. The people seemed less reserved than in Japan, and not so aggressive as in China. The transportation system was top notch, and there were open areas around the city that were splendid. The Cheonggyecheon river was fabulous, and one of the few places I saw in Asia that was not commercially-oriented but was mobbed with people anyways.

My nephew is very enamoured of the city and I think would like to stay there permanently, which I understand.

If I ever had to "move to Asia" but could choose the city, it would be Seoul.

 

[Roy G Biv]

According to the article, they ranked the cities on '30 factors across 5 areas: stability, healthcare, culture and environment, education, and infrastructure.'

I'll use Paris, Munich, and Dusseldorf:

Healthcare: German and French healthcare > Ontario healthcare

Culture: No contest

Environment: These three European cities are situated in beautiful areas, all on rivers. Let's call it a tie (unless we're looking at how those cities treat the enivornment..)

Stability: Tie.

Infastructure: Win for Europe.

Education: I don't know enough to comment.


I don't think anything I wrote above is arguable....

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

Everything is arguable...

I don't think anything I wrote above is arguable....

Hahahaha... I love this line.

Why does being on a river make a city more liveable than being on a Great Lake? Or a Pacific Ocean? Or... in the case of Calgary... a different river? (I have taken a Bateaux-Mouche on the Seine, but I'd much rather take an inflatable raft down the Bow from Bowness to the weir, swim off Woodbine, or jog along English Bay.)

 

[Roy G Biv]

Hahahaha... I love this line.

I tried to be conservative in advancing my argument so I could say that!

Why does being on a river make a city more liveable than being on a Great Lake? Or a Pacific Ocean? Or... in the case of Calgary... a different river? (I have taken a Bateaux-Mouche on the Seine, but I'd much rather take an inflatable raft down the Bow from Bowness to the weir, swim off Woodbine, or jog along English Bay.)

And that's why I concluded that "Environment" is a tie. Those cities still take healthcare, culture, and infastructure. Any argument there?

 

[christof53]

Really? They seem rather ridiculous to me... and bias towards North American cities.

Can someone explain why Toronto/Calgary/Vancouver would be higher than Munich? Or Paris? Or Dusseldorf?

These cities have far better arts, health-care, and public transportation.

These cities are also very expensive to live in, which I imagine hurt their overall score significantly. Employment opportunity and crime would be others.

 

[OttoSchloss]

Health care in Germany is not socialized.

 

[TrickyRicky]

I think it's interesting that when we think about opportunity we first think career opportunity. This is definately a key issue but I don't think it is at the heart of the matter.

Take a city like Zurich for instance. I was born there and I am comfortable saying that the quality of life under many measures, many of which are mentioned here is just superior to a place like Toronto. That said there is just something missing in Zurich and many other european cities. You can live there and maybe get an OK job, the place takes care of you fairly well and provides a top notch standard of living but in the end you just don't have much say or sense of purpose in the whole relationship. Everything is just so regulated and established.

Opportunity is not just about getting a job, it's about being able to pursue the initiatives that are important to you. Look at the mechanics of how people end up taking on initiatives and become successful in any endeavour from business, to art, to creating a family and home for themselves. These things all require such things as inspiration, chance influences, a network of like-minded individuals, room to grow, the flexibility to make mistakes and time to learn from them, a tolerant establishment, a dynamic and shifting cultural and demographic backdrop etc. I could go on but then I would be writing someone's book on the subject for them.

Yes transportation, social programs, cultural funding, etc. etc. are all important and wonderful and measurable but they are not ends in themselves, they only matter so far as the impact and opportunities they provide for people to realize their aspirations in this world.

 

[Redroom Studios]

I still cant figure out why Burlington isnt on the list !

 

[ganjavih]

Health care in Germany is not socialized.

What do you mean by that? Almost everyone in Germany has some basic coverage.

 

[OttoSchloss]

What do you mean by that? Almost everyone in Germany has some basic coverage.

But it's not like Canada's health care system. It's single payer. You're right it's basic with many people opting for private insurance. It's the sort of health care system the U.S. will eventually adopt (not Canada's model).

 

[allabootmatt]

I think it's interesting that when we think about opportunity we first think career opportunity. This is definately a key issue but I don't think it is at the heart of the matter.

Take a city like Zurich for instance. I was born there and I am comfortable saying that the quality of life under many measures, many of which are mentioned here is just superior to a place like Toronto. That said there is just something missing in Zurich and many other european cities. You can live there and maybe get an OK job, the place takes care of you fairly well and provides a top notch standard of living but in the end you just don't have much say or sense of purpose in the whole relationship. Everything is just so regulated and established.

Opportunity is not just about getting a job, it's about being able to pursue the initiatives that are important to you. Look at the mechanics of how people end up taking on initiatives and become successful in any endeavour from business, to art, to creating a family and home for themselves. These things all require such things as inspiration, chance influences, a network of like-minded individuals, room to grow, the flexibility to make mistakes and time to learn from them, a tolerant establishment, a dynamic and shifting cultural and demographic backdrop etc. I could go on but then I would be writing someone's book on the subject for them.

Yes transportation, social programs, cultural funding, etc. etc. are all important and wonderful and measurable but they are not ends in themselves, they only matter so far as the impact and opportunities they provide for people to realize their aspirations in this world.

TR, I think you are getting at something I have often thought about in continental Europe, particularly Germany. As spectacular a standard of living as many such places offer, there is something...quotidian about it. It's hard to describe. North American big cities (New York, Toronto, LA, Chicago, Montreal etc.) definitely have a feeling of dynamism that is absent in Europe anywhere except maybe London.

I think perhaps the difference is between 'mature' and stable societies, which most European countries are, and young, rapidly-changing and growing ones.

 

[Roy G Biv]

But it's not like Canada's health care system. It's single payer. You're right it's basic with many people opting for private insurance. It's the sort of health care system the U.S. will eventually adopt (not Canada's model).

Exactly, it's better than Canada's.

 

[lordmandeep]

Paris is beautiful...

however the massive large swaths of poverty and of areas with unemployment over 10-20% really is a scar on that city.


Like would i prefer to live in Calgary or in Paris.

If I were rich Paris, a regular Joe, Calgary...