W. K. Lis
Superstar
Save Toronto is organizing voices for tomorrow's Cavalcade of Lights at 7pm at City Hall, named "Cavalcade of Boos":
Hmmm... Oversized kitchen forks and (British word for flashlights) torches.
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Rob Ford's Toronto
- Thread starter MetroMan
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arksi
Active Member
As much as I think Ford deserves booing, I don't think this is the right time or place for it.
FromTheHammer
Active Member
Just because they are photographed together does not mean that they attended the game together. I could easily see Ford being so socially unaware as to not realize that Payman was distancing himself. Robbie probably showed up, saw him, thought "hey. there's my old pal Payman" and plunked himself down right next to him.
NYCBoy2305
Active Member
TheTigerMaster
Superstar
No. It's perfect
JustAnotherGuy
New Member
What this would suggest -- and I don't disagree -- is that anybody who adheres religiously to a received political ideology, regardless of where it lands on the political spectrum, effectively surrenders his or her capacity to think critically. They have chosen partisan engagement, which involves an antagonistic dynamic (us versus them) rather than critical thought.
DeathSilver
Active Member
I'm starting not to believe in coincidences when it relates to Rob Ford.
krbcan
New Member
Based on his loutish behavior and horrendous performance as a mayor, he should be booed long and hard at EVERY public appearance he makes. Otherwise, he just won't get it that he needs to change
basic
Senior Member
Rob Ford might have been out-saved by David Miller: James | Toronto Star
How’s this for a head-scratcher?
David Miller, the former mayor who’s been roundly excoriated as a tax-and-spend socialist, may have saved Toronto taxpayers twice as much as Mayor Rob Ford.
Ford boasts he has saved Toronto taxpayers $1 billion over his term in office, ending November 2014.
It’s an astonishing accomplishment, one that qualifies him as the greatest mayor (when it comes to money management) in Toronto’s history, and maybe best in the world, the hyperbolic Ford says.
His financial acumen brought Toronto back from the brink of bankruptcy, Ford claims. The inference is he saved us from the fiscal disaster that was former mayor David Miller.
(The “bankruptcy” claim is so far from the truth it deserves its own column, so let’s set that aside.)
Meanwhile, using Ford math, the councillor who was Miller’s budget chief calculates Miller saved $1.8 billion, likely more, over his four-year last term, ending 2010.
That would make Miller no less than a financial wizard.
In fact, says Councillor Shelley Carroll, much of Ford’s success in keeping budget increases at a minimum directly goes back to steps Miller took to shore up Toronto’s shaky budget foundations.
One of the biggest Miller wins was getting the province to take back — upload — costs of many social programs that Premier Mike Harris dumped on Toronto during amalgamation.
“It should be noted that the upload is now phased completely in and gives Ford $369 million that no other mayor or budget chief had at their disposal,” says Carroll.
She’s been crunching the numbers because of Ford’s fantastical claims during the summer. The mayor has ramped up the $1 billion boast now that the city’s 2014 budget has been launched — the last one before re-election.
The Ford narrative is already clear: Before Ford, bankruptcy. With Ford, budget heaven. After Ford, back to disaster.
Only the most gullible swallow this. Several journalists have deconstructed Ford’s claims and exposed them as greatly exaggerated, often double-counting, using budgetary hocus-pocus and defining savings in unconventional ways. Read the devastating reality check from The Star’s City Hall Bureau Chief Daniel Dale, from last Tuesday’s paper, at thestar.com.
Ford claims the ending of the vehicle registration tax as saving taxpayers’ money and includes $50 million per year for four years; one-fifth of the $1 billion.
In reality it is not a “saving” for ratepayers, only those who license their cars; and the amount is $173 million, not $200 million. And it begs the question: If removing an item from the tax bill is a “saving” for taxpayers, does that not apply to Miller when he moved waste management off the tax bill and made it a user fee?
Carroll calculates $492 million in Miller “savings” from waste management, plus $30 million in other user fees.
Now you see why city manager Joe Pennachetti doesn’t want to include such user fees as budget savings. Using Ford’s logic, an increase in transit fares provides money the city doesn’t have to tax for, and would be a “saving.”
Pennachetti has slowly backed off Ford’s $1 billion claim. He says it is closer to $400 million.
But, using Rob Ford math, the one he is peddling to the public, Carroll confidently claims the following as Miller time savings:
$92 million in “efficiency management of completed capital projects,” or money from projects coming under budget.
2009-2011 Sick Leave Liability savings of $174.1 million. This is the little-told benefit of the 2009 garbage strike. City did get some concessions. Plus another $31 million in net payroll costs from not having to pay the strikers.
Actual “cost reductions through efficiencies of $443.7 million,” a figure that is supposed to compare with Ford’s $800 million that Pennachetti says is really about $400 million.
Provincial upload of services in 2008 and 2009 totalled $426 million — money the city didn’t have to tax for anymore, hence a saving.
The above underscore how dubious Ford’s claims are.
The significance is this: Ford’s been a total disaster on every front but holding spending in line. He says nobody can do savings like him, so Torontonians should ignore his circus act and re-elect him.
But by Ford’s own calculations, even David Miller could do better. In fact, did. Ouch!
How’s this for a head-scratcher?
David Miller, the former mayor who’s been roundly excoriated as a tax-and-spend socialist, may have saved Toronto taxpayers twice as much as Mayor Rob Ford.
Ford boasts he has saved Toronto taxpayers $1 billion over his term in office, ending November 2014.
It’s an astonishing accomplishment, one that qualifies him as the greatest mayor (when it comes to money management) in Toronto’s history, and maybe best in the world, the hyperbolic Ford says.
His financial acumen brought Toronto back from the brink of bankruptcy, Ford claims. The inference is he saved us from the fiscal disaster that was former mayor David Miller.
(The “bankruptcy” claim is so far from the truth it deserves its own column, so let’s set that aside.)
Meanwhile, using Ford math, the councillor who was Miller’s budget chief calculates Miller saved $1.8 billion, likely more, over his four-year last term, ending 2010.
That would make Miller no less than a financial wizard.
In fact, says Councillor Shelley Carroll, much of Ford’s success in keeping budget increases at a minimum directly goes back to steps Miller took to shore up Toronto’s shaky budget foundations.
One of the biggest Miller wins was getting the province to take back — upload — costs of many social programs that Premier Mike Harris dumped on Toronto during amalgamation.
“It should be noted that the upload is now phased completely in and gives Ford $369 million that no other mayor or budget chief had at their disposal,” says Carroll.
She’s been crunching the numbers because of Ford’s fantastical claims during the summer. The mayor has ramped up the $1 billion boast now that the city’s 2014 budget has been launched — the last one before re-election.
The Ford narrative is already clear: Before Ford, bankruptcy. With Ford, budget heaven. After Ford, back to disaster.
Only the most gullible swallow this. Several journalists have deconstructed Ford’s claims and exposed them as greatly exaggerated, often double-counting, using budgetary hocus-pocus and defining savings in unconventional ways. Read the devastating reality check from The Star’s City Hall Bureau Chief Daniel Dale, from last Tuesday’s paper, at thestar.com.
Ford claims the ending of the vehicle registration tax as saving taxpayers’ money and includes $50 million per year for four years; one-fifth of the $1 billion.
In reality it is not a “saving” for ratepayers, only those who license their cars; and the amount is $173 million, not $200 million. And it begs the question: If removing an item from the tax bill is a “saving” for taxpayers, does that not apply to Miller when he moved waste management off the tax bill and made it a user fee?
Carroll calculates $492 million in Miller “savings” from waste management, plus $30 million in other user fees.
Now you see why city manager Joe Pennachetti doesn’t want to include such user fees as budget savings. Using Ford’s logic, an increase in transit fares provides money the city doesn’t have to tax for, and would be a “saving.”
Pennachetti has slowly backed off Ford’s $1 billion claim. He says it is closer to $400 million.
But, using Rob Ford math, the one he is peddling to the public, Carroll confidently claims the following as Miller time savings:
$92 million in “efficiency management of completed capital projects,” or money from projects coming under budget.
2009-2011 Sick Leave Liability savings of $174.1 million. This is the little-told benefit of the 2009 garbage strike. City did get some concessions. Plus another $31 million in net payroll costs from not having to pay the strikers.
Actual “cost reductions through efficiencies of $443.7 million,” a figure that is supposed to compare with Ford’s $800 million that Pennachetti says is really about $400 million.
Provincial upload of services in 2008 and 2009 totalled $426 million — money the city didn’t have to tax for anymore, hence a saving.
The above underscore how dubious Ford’s claims are.
The significance is this: Ford’s been a total disaster on every front but holding spending in line. He says nobody can do savings like him, so Torontonians should ignore his circus act and re-elect him.
But by Ford’s own calculations, even David Miller could do better. In fact, did. Ouch!
urbandreamer
recession proof
Oh are you referencing that TCHC 200 Well building incident? Hmm
cgwalnut
New Member
I have to chime in about the "cavalcade of boos" and savetoronto:
don't do it. it's not the place for this sort of thing (a lovely family event) and only turns Ford into the martyr he wants to look like. the middle (which ford has lost already) will look on at this with disgust and maybe they'll start to have some sympathy for, and solidarity with, the guy. it will be written off as the same group of "professional protestors" disrupting yet another event (which, really, is true).
listen, the average person out there hates the circus, and the performers, that is the protesting crowd. it's profoundly annoying. I used to be a part of it and I grew to hate it. the same old chants, speakers, language and theatre. nothing new. it's preaching to the converted and just gives everybody involved a self serving collective adrenalin rush. it accomplishes zero and may actually have a negative effect.
two recent examples of great public protest i think would be a) the silent shaming of the college dean in California after the pepper spraying incident on campus during the occupy times a few years ago and b) city councils turning of their backs on ford just a couple of weeks ago. powerful stuff.
if you feel you must do something (and I understand the need/want/urge) think about a silent shaming. turning of backs, some sort of clothing/colour solidarity - something. something new, creative and respectful. no megaphones, no chants and no damn puppets.
don't do it. it's not the place for this sort of thing (a lovely family event) and only turns Ford into the martyr he wants to look like. the middle (which ford has lost already) will look on at this with disgust and maybe they'll start to have some sympathy for, and solidarity with, the guy. it will be written off as the same group of "professional protestors" disrupting yet another event (which, really, is true).
listen, the average person out there hates the circus, and the performers, that is the protesting crowd. it's profoundly annoying. I used to be a part of it and I grew to hate it. the same old chants, speakers, language and theatre. nothing new. it's preaching to the converted and just gives everybody involved a self serving collective adrenalin rush. it accomplishes zero and may actually have a negative effect.
two recent examples of great public protest i think would be a) the silent shaming of the college dean in California after the pepper spraying incident on campus during the occupy times a few years ago and b) city councils turning of their backs on ford just a couple of weeks ago. powerful stuff.
if you feel you must do something (and I understand the need/want/urge) think about a silent shaming. turning of backs, some sort of clothing/colour solidarity - something. something new, creative and respectful. no megaphones, no chants and no damn puppets.
urbandreamer
recession proof
I sometimes wonder what happened to those silly Mike Harris protesters from c.1997. I tend to believe they're all millionaires with offshore tax shelters living in the Annex, Rosedale and High Park.
A creative protest would be to bring a crack pipe and "light it up" in front of Rob Ford. Everyone smoking "crack" would be entertaining.
Btw, Rob Ford in person is actually a decent human being. (Sober.) Says someone I know who's met him.
A creative protest would be to bring a crack pipe and "light it up" in front of Rob Ford. Everyone smoking "crack" would be entertaining.
Btw, Rob Ford in person is actually a decent human being. (Sober.) Says someone I know who's met him.
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rightwingSUVdriver
Active Member
How bout someone brings a powerful stereo system and broadcasts his angry crack-induced rant on repeat? Or a 5 second loop of "I've got more than enough to eat at home"... Or "orientals work like dogs"
urbandreamer
recession proof
Or maybe just a DJ playing that "Tune of the Year" by WTFbrahh.
Long Island Mike
Senior Member
Macleans 2013 Newsmaker of the Year: Toronto Mayor Rob Ford
WKL and Everyone: I noticed this cover at first and thought that it was a joke but after checking the Macleans link
this is what the special issue will be with Mayor Rob Ford front and center here...
That cover literally runs the gamut spectrum from those people who are admired and respected in Canada to
those who are notorious for their problems such as Mayor Rob Ford...For some reason I can't get the Duran Duran song
"Notorious" lyrics out of my mind as I reply to this topic...
A certain public library that I sometimes go to gets Macleans as one of their periodicals and has a well-stocked archive
that is easily accessible of Macleans back issues along with special issues like this one...I will be paying them a visit
sometime soon probably after this special issue becomes available...it will be a good read...
LI MIKE
WKL and Everyone: I noticed this cover at first and thought that it was a joke but after checking the Macleans link
this is what the special issue will be with Mayor Rob Ford front and center here...
That cover literally runs the gamut spectrum from those people who are admired and respected in Canada to
those who are notorious for their problems such as Mayor Rob Ford...For some reason I can't get the Duran Duran song
"Notorious" lyrics out of my mind as I reply to this topic...
A certain public library that I sometimes go to gets Macleans as one of their periodicals and has a well-stocked archive
that is easily accessible of Macleans back issues along with special issues like this one...I will be paying them a visit
sometime soon probably after this special issue becomes available...it will be a good read...
LI MIKE
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