Pearson T1 - Pier F

[flipv]

Re: Terminal 1

Yea, BMI flew 2 years ago seasonally. I don't think it'll be back as they pulled out because of low yields. I agree it is a slick livery - but one we won't be seeing at YYZ.
JAT is currently in the shitter. About a year ago they signed a letter of intent for the lease of two 767-200's, yet nothing came of that, they were supposed to be delivered almost a year ago. I don't think JAT will be planning to fly its own metal to Pearson soon - I just hope it doesn't become a feeder airline for Lufthansa like some of the other regional airlines. I miss JAT's flagship DC-10's - those were some planes.

I heard strong rumours about Qatar coming to YYZ - this could be a possibility as Emirates is tied up due to antiquated bilateral agreements.

 

[Sir Novelty Fashion]

Re: Terminal 1

Qatar is running subway ads (with no specifics) - I'd call that evidence for your rumor.

 

[ahrvojic]

Re: Terminal 1

What type of long range aircrafts is Croatia looking to buy?

Sorry, after a bit more research I think I may have been a bit hasty in that claim. Croatia concluded an air agreement with Canada simultaneously with Serbia last December and Croatia Airlines was an observer of the negotiations, but I can't seem to find anything concrete about flights to Toronto.

Perhaps I'm a bit too excited about the prospect.

 

[flipv]

Re: Terminal 1

Hehe, I know in the entire ex-yu region only JAT is looking at major transcontinental routes. Until recently the DC-10's could've provided me with a direct link to Belgrade, but as of now I'll have to deal with transfering God know's where. The 767's are still to entre JAT's fleet according to Serbian sources - which means YYZ would be on the tables almost immediately. Same with JFK, ORD is a possibly as well. Back in the heyday of the late 80's JAT flew to every corner of the globe, from Melbourne to Cleveland and Detroit - truly a global airline.

 

[wyliepoon]

Re: Terminal 1

Oasis Hong Kong, a Hong Kong based budget airline currently offering flights between Hong Kong and Britain, is planning to expand to North American destinations. First stage of the expansion is flights to Oakland, CA and Chicago. According to their route map, the second stage includes destinations such as Toronto, New York, Vancouver and LA.

Hopefully it survives long enough to provide cheap flights on the Toronto-HK route. I bet a lot of Chinese people in Toronto would be thrilled with that.

www.oasishongkong.com/hk/en/flights/routes.aspx

 

[umademethisway]

Re: Terminal 1

For those airlines interested in getting permission to fly into YYZ, what could be some of the reasons for those airlines ultimately choosing not to fly into Toronto - or not being allowed to? I don't understand why Emirates wouldn't take the number of flights per day that they're allowed over what they had prefered. On the other hand, I don't understand why they wouldn't be allowed the number of flights per day that they were requesting. I would think that the more airlines operating out of YYZ (or any Canadian airport for that matter) would be better for that airport and the Canadian economy, no? Can someone who knows more about this shine some light on it for me, please? Thanks!

 

[umademethisway]

Re: Terminal 1

Yes, that's true. Oasis Hong Kong should be extending flights to Vancouver begining June 28 of this year. Toronto, Chicago and NYC will follow. I'd really like to see their aircraft at YYZ (operating out of T1, damit!)

By the way, who decides what terminal airlines operates out of? I hope to see at least half of the major international carriers currently operating out of T3 at T1 in the very near future. The arrivals level in T3 gets pretty cramped with international flights arrive. Let's utilize the features of the brand new T1!

 

[spmarshall]

Re: Terminal 1

I bet a lot of Chinese people in Toronto would be thrilled with that.

I'd be thrilled with that. I have a place to stay in HK offered, but finances aren't as good as I'd like right now for that. The flights are tremendously expensive.

Zoom almost makes London and Paris affordable for a recent grad school grad like me. If there was a HK equivalent, I'd book.

 

[flipv]

Re: Terminal 1

Lets see: Some airlines that have bailed (YYZ edition)
Hmmm.. this is quite the list.

1) Iberia - low loads transfered to YUL and eventually pulled out
2) Swissair, now Swiss - Codeshare and antiquated deal with AC forbidding Swiss from flying to TO, yet giving them the YUL market
3) BMI - low yields, codeshare with AC
4) Aer Lingus - dunno the dealio with that one but they bailed decades ago
5) TAP Air Portugal - supposed to be back soon, bad financial shape
6) VASP Brazil - bankrupcy
7) Virgin Atlantic - 9/11 and lack of aircraft, should be reopened
... etc etc.. We've lost quite our share of global carriers - yet hopefully we'll just keep on gaining, some of them back too!

 

[yyzer]

Re: Terminal 1

flipv, actually, here's the correct info:

1.) Iberia...loads were always high, yield (profit) was not

2.) Swiss...Swiss are not forbidden to fly to YYZ, they could start tomorrow...however, they do codeshare with AC, whereby Swiss fly the Montreal flights, and AC fly the YYZ flights.

3.) BMI...another codeshare deal with AC...they only flew here for one summer, at AC's request, because at the time Air Canada had equipment shortages....they only planned that single summer season, and have since reverted back to the AC codeshare

4.) Aer Lingus have never flown a scheduled service to YYZ...the current antiquated bilateral restricts them to Montreal only...they did fly charters on behalf of Sunquest Vacations during the 1979 summer season, but that is all.

5.) Air Portugal...pulled out in spite of very high loads, but again lower yields...although there were rumours at the time that their Canadian staffers had tried to unionize, just before the decision was made...their routings have since been flown by SATA Azores, who fly a scheduled service year-round...the bilateral between Canada and Portugal does permit multiple carriers, so you could maybe see their return one day, but they are currently focused on other areas, like Brazil

6.) VASP and Varig...both were unable to build a profitable service ex-YYZ, both subsequently went bankrupt...

7.) Virgin Atlantic...only flew from June 2001 till Sept 2001...pulled their flights a couple of weeks after 9-11...they have stated they intend to return one day

Incidently, there are others as well....we've lost a few, but gained many more.

Aviation bilateral agreements are tightly controlled by Transport Canada....unfortunately, historically, these have tended to benefit Air Canada, by keeping out unwanted competition (such as the current Emirates fiasco), rather than benefiting the Canadian public, by allowing as much competition as possible. But I digress.

 

[yyzer]

Re: Terminal 1

For those airlines interested in getting permission to fly into YYZ, what could be some of the reasons for those airlines ultimately choosing not to fly into Toronto - or not being allowed to? I don't understand why Emirates wouldn't take the number of flights per day that they're allowed over what they had prefered. On the other hand, I don't understand why they wouldn't be allowed the number of flights per day that they were requesting. I would think that the more airlines operating out of YYZ (or any Canadian airport for that matter) would be better for that airport and the Canadian economy, no? Can someone who knows more about this shine some light on it for me, please? Thanks!

Where would you like to start? o.k., Emirates....code EK..

Canada and the United Arab Emirates negotiated an Air Service Agreement back in 2000, which allowed a maximum of 6 flights per week by airlines of each country...after this agreement was put in place, EK advised they instead wanted 7 x's weekly flights from Dubai to YYZ - one more than permitted...the Canadians said no....(all airlines have daily flights as a goal, as it is more efficient that way...otherwise, they have crew and other staff not working that day, and less than daily schedules are less attractive to the business traveller)....why anyone would negotiate an agreement allowing only 6 weekly flights is anyone's guess.

The U.A.E however have several carriers....in addition to EK, there is Etihad, Qatar Airways, and Gulf Air. When EK were unable to get permission for the 7th weekly flight, Etihad then announced they would be happy to fly 3 x's weekly, from Abu Dhabi (one of the UAE airports) to YYZ....So they used up 3 of the 6 permitted frequencies. So there are still 3 unused weekly flights from the UAE side, plus Air Canada could fly 6x's weekly from YYZ to anywhere in the UAE, including Dubai.

In spite of repeated requests from the UAE for an expanded bilateral, the Canadians (Transport Canada) have thus far said no.

That's it - hope this makes sense.

yyzer

 

[EnviroTO]

Re: Terminal 1

Qatar, Kuwait, Bahrain, and Oman are independant of the UAE and would have separate bi-lateral agreements if they had agreements but I don't believe they currently do. Qatar Airways is from Qatar, Gulf Air is based primarily in Bahrain but also Oman, Kuwait Airways is from Kuwait, and Etihad (Abu Dhabi) and Emirates (Dubai) are both from the UAE.

 

[yyzer]

Re: Terminal 1

Enviro....sheesh, you are right....I always thought Qatar was one of the emirates, but they are separate...my mistake...

Gulf Air were formerly a joint creation of Abu Dhabi, Bahrain, & Oman, weren't they? Or did Abu Dhabi divest itself, now that Etihad came along?

 

[down on the upside]

Re: Terminal 1

anyone else noticed the advertisements for Qatar Airways on the subway? maybe they're coming to to soon?

 

[umademethisway]

Re: Terminal 1

yyzer - It does make sense. Thank you. I now have a better understanding of the situation with Emirates. I hope that they can reach an agreement with Transport Canada. I'd love to see their aircraft grace our wonderful airport! And I plan to visit Dubai someday soon, I wouldn't mind flying one of their machines. I wonder which aircraft they would fly here.

Now it's been awhile since I've been to YYZ. Is Etihad flying there themselves or are they code sharing?

Air Canada's triple seven will be flying into YYZ on Thursday. Any idea what time it's scheduled to arrive? I'd like to try and make it there after the conference for the 1 Bloor E. project. I know I've seen the information somewhere online regarding AC, but I can't remember where.

Thanks again for your help dude! Much appreciated.