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Ontario Northland/Northern Ontario Transportation

lenaitch said:
Two million was only the federal subsidy. I don't know what other support it received.
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It didn't. This was an example of the province hanging tough - because Ottawa had traditionally paid and if QP had reached for the check, then it would set a precedent that would let Ottawa off the hook for the White River train and probably more. Ontario called the bluff and In the end Ottawa didn't blink.

At the time, both QP and Ottawa were Liberal, so one can't blame partisan rub points.

In my humble opinion, the ACR local train to Hearst is a remote service and can't be rationally differentiated from others, but Ottawa is not looking to add to its obligations in this area.

- Paul
 
crs1026 said:
It didn't. This was an example of the province hanging tough - because Ottawa had traditionally paid and if QP had reached for the check, then it would set a precedent that would let Ottawa off the hook for the White River train and probably more. Ontario called the bluff and In the end Ottawa didn't blink.

At the time, both QP and Ottawa were Liberal, so one can't blame partisan rub points.

In my humble opinion, the ACR local train to Hearst is a remote service and can't be rationally differentiated from others, but Ottawa is not looking to add to its obligations in this area.

- Paul
Click to expand...
It may have also been the fact that CN saw the ACR as a money losing venture that they wanted it sold off.
 
Because ONTC is already serving Ottawa’s rail station, a morning southbound service/evening northbound nominally serving Northlander could also act as a thruway from VIA service to/from Montreal into the Ottawa Valley… if there was the will to create and market that cooperation.
 
crs1026 said:
In my humble opinion, the ACR local train to Hearst is a remote service and can't be rationally differentiated from others, but Ottawa is not looking to add to its obligations in this area.
Click to expand...
It absolutely is. Just off the top of my head, once outside The Soo/Searchmont area, I doubt it touches road more that half a dozen times. Although very few actual remote communities were served (and that may be what the feds hung their hat on), the big losers were remote hunting and fishing lodges and private hunting and fishing camos along with simply itinerate sportspersons. Hunting a fishing up there is big tourist dollars, much of it from the US.

In actuality, the line has probably been a money loser since Algoma Ore Division shut down in Wawa in 1998, and was made worse by the Dubreuilville sawmill shutting down in 2008. If I recall, the diamond with CP at Franz was severed fairly recently, so get any service back running will no doubt have some significant cost (CN still owns and operates from OBA to Hearst).

Algoma Central received some fairly significant land grants to open up that part of the province, much like CP did out west, so maybe the line has some inherent value beyond rail operations, but I don't really know how such things work. A friend had a camp north of Wawa, and he leased the land from the ACR.
 
dowlingm said:
Because ONTC is already serving Ottawa’s rail station, a morning southbound service/evening northbound nominally serving Northlander could also act as a thruway from VIA service to/from Montreal into the Ottawa Valley… if there was the will to create and market that cooperation.
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It is unfortunate how disconnected things are, even when they look connected. Maybe some sort of 'code share' like air carriers is needed.
 
crs1026 said:
It didn't. This was an example of the province hanging tough - because Ottawa had traditionally paid and if QP had reached for the check, then it would set a precedent that would let Ottawa off the hook for the White River train and probably more. Ontario called the bluff and In the end Ottawa didn't blink.

At the time, both QP and Ottawa were Liberal, so one can't blame partisan rub points.

In my humble opinion, the ACR local train to Hearst is a remote service and can't be rationally differentiated from others, but Ottawa is not looking to add to its obligations in this area.

- Paul
Click to expand...

I wouldn’t attribute it to partisan politics but in 2014, the subsidy for the ACR was cut by the Harper-led Conservative government.
 
Screenshot_2024-07-21_183805.jpg
 
roger1818 said:
Ya, it’s probably cheaper to transport refrigerated and frozen goods by train than it would be to fly them in to the northern communities (like Moosonee).
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Immensely cheaper. The three new units are replacing three existing units and recycling their numbers. I could find nay reference as to how old the previous ones were.
 
lenaitch said:
Immensely cheaper. The three new units are replacing three existing units and recycling their numbers. I could find nay reference as to how old the previous ones were.
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If they are reusing the numbers, the older ones were ex-CN units built in the late 1960s but modernized/converted into reefers when purchased by ONR in the early 2000s.

Dan
 
This was very much overdue….the return of the Northlander to Timmins and the eventual completion of Highway 400 to Sudbury gives Northern Ontario a direct smooth connection to the GTA and Southern Ontario.

Many people are unaware of just how important this is for the region. Northern Ontario is some of the most remote regions in Canada.

 
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