Miscellany Toronto Photographs: Then and Now

[Urban Shocker]

The result of speculative building on newly available land north of Queen dating from the bustling, more affluent 1880s and 1890s ... versus the remnants of an earlier and less prosperous Georgian city south of Queen and west of Yonge, maybe?

I admire the relative uniformity of such blocks, too. Once established, a form can be expanded with minor variations, creating a strong identity based on fitting in rather than standing out. We still do it rather well, I think.

 

[Long Island Mike]

More good Then and Now pics of Toronto...You can learn something new every day!

Charioteer: Good Mutual Street Arena pics and ephemera-what is the exact cross street(Or a Google Map link) so I can find its exact location?
I like that 12/6 airview looking NE showing both City Halls along with Nathan Phillips Square well.
12/7 Deepend: I like those Bloor Street historical pics...
12/7 DB62: Interesting changes at the former Hockey Hall of Fame and
Exhibition Stadium...
12/7 DB62: I have memories of Penn Station in NYC because my father was a station employee there for more then 30 years-including the 60s when it was torn down to build Madison Square Garden above.
I was a child of early Elementary School age when it was torn down and I have few memories of the old Penn Station. Madison Square Garden opened when I was about 8 years old...

Losing Penn Station was a sacrifice-because its loss began in earnest the Historic Preservation movement which has saved many historic buildings since...I feel that Grand Central Terminal and Toronto Union Station -naming two historic stations- were saved by groups influenced after the loss of NYC's Penn Station...Thoughts by Long Island Mike

 

[Edward Skira]

It would also appear that the topography has also been homoginized in Moss Park. One of Toronto's "lost rivers" appears on the nineteenth century map, and the older photos show hills as a result. Not sure if the park was totally levelled after the massive demolitions (Ed007, any help?).

That would be Taddle Creek. It ran under my space and is the reason Britain Street curves south half way between Sherbourne and George Street. The street curves as it follows the old creek bed. People should check out the Modern Condo construction site at the north east corner of Richmond and Sherbourne. Even after weeks of no rain water continues to surface at the south end of the site. This is Taddle Creek trying to resurface.

 

[wwwebster]

That would be Taddle Creek.

Actually, to clarify and expand on Ed007's post, the 19th Century map posted by thecharioteer is an extract from James Cane's 1842 map, and it shows Taddle Creek running along Queen. The ravine in Moss Park was a Taddle Creek tributary called Moss Park Creek:

http://www.lostrivers.ca/mossparkcreek.htm

The photo that shows Excelsior Plate Glass in the background is looking south towards the backs of the buildings on the north side of Queen, and some of the roofline details can be matched to the Queen streetscape photo. Excelsior was at 189-191 Queen East (south side).

 

[thecharioteer]

you're right--it really looks like a thriving, stable area of commerce and community. what's amazing to me is how dense and uniform the Victorian streetscape is on Queen east of Yonge, as opposed to west of Yonge.

Once you get on the other side of the two big department stores and City Hall, Queen Street West appears to have been an area much more diverse in appearance and use: grander and larger scale commercial buildings, theatres and hotels, interspersed with a lot of ramshackle lath and stucco buildings. in other words, Queen west looks to be the poorer and more tawdry of the two. Maybe because of the proximity of The Ward?

Remember the location of the original Town of York and that during the 19thC the centre of gravity for Toronto was east of Yonge, not west. The City Hall and Market were at Front and Jarvis, the Courts were on Adelaide East, the Exchange on Wellington East. The main shopping street was King East. In addition, cultural and religious institutions such as the St. Lawrence Hall, St. James Cathedreal, and the Mechanics Institute (precursor of the Toronto Public Library), were all east of Yonge. The wealthiest residential neighbourhoods were on the east side, on Church, Jarvis and Sherbourne.

The shift westerly was gradual. However, even as late as 1903, the east side was chosen as the location 0f George Gooderham's new luxury hotel, The King Edward.

King Street East, 1899, soldiers marching off to the Boer War, in front of the future site of the King Edward Hotel on the right:

 

[UserNameToronto]

Actually, to clarify and expand on Ed007's post, the 19th Century map posted by thecharioteer is an extract from James Cane's 1842 map, and it shows Taddle Creek running along Queen. The ravine in Moss Park was a Taddle Creek tributary called Moss Park Creek:

http://www.lostrivers.ca/mossparkcreek.htm

Taddle Creek ran along Queen to George, then cut south along a small street with a bend in it in the Lost Rivers map--that's Britian St.

Nowadays I don't even see strollers along this stretch of Queen anymore.

May be, but Sunday mornings at 10:30 there's a steady stream of strollers on Britain St.

 

[Edward Skira]

Taddle Creek ran along Queen to George, then cut south along a small street with a bend in it in the Lost Rivers map--that's Britian St.

Look at the map on the previous page. Taddle Creek shifted north of Queen at George and then cut down to Britain about midway to Sherbourne. I should know. I've got core samples to prove solid earth is 8 feet below the floor of my basement. The rest is fill.

May be, but Sunday mornings at 10:30 there's a steady stream of strollers on Britain St.

Grace Church has certainly brought a lot of kids here on Sundays.

 

[Goldie]

Movie time

Once a popular neighbourhood movie house.

click on thumbnail to enlarge

 

[LowPolygon]

Remember the location of the original Town of York and that during the 19thC the centre of gravity for Toronto was east of Yonge, not west. The City Hall and Market were at Front and Jarvis, the Courts were on Adelaide East, the Exchange on Wellington East. The main shopping street was King East. In addition, cultural and religious institutions such as the St. Lawrence Hall, St. James Cathedreal, and the Mechanics Institute (precursor of the Toronto Public Library), were all east of Yonge. The wealthiest residential neighbourhoods were on the east side, on Church, Jarvis and Sherbourne.

The shift westerly was gradual. However, even as late as 1903, the east side was chosen as the location 0f George Gooderham's new luxury hotel, The King Edward.

King Street East, 1899, soldiers marching off to the Boer War, in front of the future site of the King Edward Hotel on the right:

given that, i would imagine that cheaper and more available land might be part of the reason that New City Hall, as well as both Simpson's and Eaton's were built on the less developed west side of Yonge?

i would imagine that these large scale projects were an important part of why Bay Street became the the center of gravity for the financial industry in the city.

 

[LowPolygon]

The result of speculative building on newly available land north of Queen dating from the bustling, more affluent 1880s and 1890s ... versus the remnants of an earlier and less prosperous Georgian city south of Queen and west of Yonge, maybe?

I admire the relative uniformity of such blocks, too. Once established, a form can be expanded with minor variations, creating a strong identity based on fitting in rather than standing out. We still do it rather well, I think.

There is a lovely, unassuming almost Haussmann-like character to these blocks that define what i love about Queen St. Thankfully there are still some good examples left standing. Queen E of Sherbourne to Seaton; pockets of Queen W of Bathurst over to Crawford; much of Parkdale...

 

[Mustapha]

Once a popular neighbourhood movie house.

click on thumbnail to enlarge

The Thin Man is a charming picture. Still very watchable 70 years after its release. Great on screen chemistry between the two stars.





December 11 addition.






Then: Jarvis looking N from St. Charles. October 1960.

Now: October 2009.

 

[adma]

If I may be LI Mike for a sec, interesting how there's *two* 1960 Pontiacs on the right of the old pic, right next to each other...

 

[Conrad Black]

Amazing how urban Queen and Bay was back in the day. Today with NPS and the Sheraton it looks so wide open.

 

[CityPlaceN1]

given that, i would imagine that cheaper and more available land might be part of the reason that New City Hall, as well as both Simpson's and Eaton's were built on the less developed west side of Yonge?

i would imagine that these large scale projects were an important part of why Bay Street became the the center of gravity for the financial industry in the city.

I think there's another factor that needs to be considered which is transportation. Yonge Street was, and still is, the major north south line for transportation. Check maps of the city back in the day and you'll see what a major obstacle the Don and its various branches were. Until the Bloor Viaduct was built and until Mt. Pleasant was pushed through Rosedale the most eastern road heading north was Yonge. And Queen operated in a similar manner for east/west traffic. No surprise then that Eatons and Simpsons were located at Yonge and Queen, the two most important roads in the city in those days.

 

[Mustapha]

Queen, looking west from Sherbourne (1923):

And looking east from Jarvis.