Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

[EastYorkTTCFan]

So Metrolinx shoulders most of the blame for Presto's stumbling stage debut in Toronto. Although just because people from the 905 region are used to using Presto doesn't mean the TTC couldn't have installed Presto and then made it live after a complete installation. The only reason I can see to do it the way they are is to use the public as guinea pigs to works out the bugs, in which case they should have a grace period which allows for systemic problems as well as user errors.

No the TTC decided that because of the 905 people already having presto to make it easier for them to use the system rather than having to carry extra fare with them. The presto roll out in Toronto has been very slow mainly because of multiple back and forth nagotiations of who pays for it.

 

[amnesiajune]

The other systems all had simpler fare structures and didn't have as many requirements as the TTC plus they didn't put it live as they were building it.

The TTC's fare structure is as simple as any of the 905 transit agencies. What's bonkers is the TTC's transfer policy, but no farecard system would be able to automate it with 100% accuracy. It's just way too complicated and relies on a lot of human judgement.

Anyways, Presto was working perfectly fine on the TTC until it was overhauled in the last couple of years. The first generation card readers hardly ever went down.

 

[amnesiajune]

No the TTC decided that because of the 905 people already having presto to make it easier for them to use the system rather than having to carry extra fare with them.

That's not quite right. The TTC was never really warm to Presto. They accepted it as a condition for Eglinton Crosstown LRT funding in 2011.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

The TTC's fare structure is as simple as any of the 905 transit agencies. What's bonkers is the TTC's transfer policy, but no farecard system would be able to automate it with 100% accuracy. It's just way too complicated and relies on a lot of human judgement.

Anyways, Presto was working perfectly fine on the TTC until it was overhauled in the last couple of years. The first generation card readers hardly ever went down.

I think they have less problems with the ones that are wired rather than the wireless ones on buses and streetcars. They said at the last commission meeting that they are down to an 8% failure rate on them, and the ideal rate of failure is 1 to 2%.

 

[amnesiajune]

I think they have less problems with the ones that are wired rather than the wireless ones on buses and streetcars. They said at the last commission meeting that they are down to an 8% failure rate on them, and the ideal rate of failure is 1 to 2%.

Yep. And as a side note, a friend of a friend (through software industry connections) is an architect for Presto. Apparently the failure has to do with the wireless network setup in TTC bus garages and streetcar houses. The card readers (wired ones too) are designed to go out of service if they haven't synced with the central system for 24 hours, and they're were having some problems connecting to the network the way it was originally set up (the setup is done by the TTC).

 

[Voltz]

Yep. And as a side note, a friend of a friend (through software industry connections) is an architect for Presto. Apparently the failure has to do with the wireless network setup in TTC bus garages and streetcar houses. The card readers (wired ones too) are designed to go out of service if they haven't synced with the central system for 24 hours, and they're were having some problems connecting to the network the way it was originally set up (the setup is done by the TTC).

TTC buses and streetcars have cellular data connections for the Presto readers, not Wifi in the garages like the 905 systems have. It syncs up pretty quick after tapping.

 

[amnesiajune]

TTC buses and streetcars have cellular data connections for the Presto readers, not Wifi in the garages like the 905 systems have.

They have it but at the moment they rarely use it because of the cost.

 

[Voltz]

They have it but at the moment they rarely use it because of the cost.

I've often noticed taps show up on the presto website sooner than it would take for the bus to make it back to the yard and sync there.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

TTC buses and streetcars have cellular data connections for the Presto readers, not Wifi in the garages like the 905 systems have. It syncs up pretty quick after tapping.

I believe they connect to Wifi when they are in stations equipped with it but also will connect to celur when on the road. I've actually seen taps on buses and streetcars appear before ones I have done at stations.

 

[LNahid2000]

The busiest subway station in Toronto (Bloor-Yonge) has one Presto reload machine that is currently out of order (it's often not working when I pass by). Does anyone know if there are plans to add multiple machines to each station, like in every other city with smart card payment? I don't like online reload because I was planning on using the my presto card tomorrow morning, and the online reload might not make it on time.

 

[amnesiajune]

Does anyone know if there are plans to add multiple machines to each station, like in every other city with smart card payment?

Yes, the TTC is planning on putting multiple self-serve reload machines in each station. When? Who knows... It's TTC scheduling.

I don't like online reload because I was planning on using the my presto card tomorrow morning, and the online reload might not make it on time.

Why not use autoload?

The busiest subway station in Toronto (Bloor-Yonge) has one Presto reload machine that is currently out of order (it's often not working when I pass by).

I know it's off-topic, but Bloor-Yonge isn't actually that busy for passengers entering/exiting the system. College, Dundas, Queen, King, Union, St. Andrew, Finch and Eglinton are all busier.

 

[LNahid2000]

Why not use autoload?

I don't like the limitations of autoload...minimum $20 load and min $5 balance for autoload trigger. And and I can get to Bloor-Yonge station without going outside, so I'd rather just walk 2 minutes and load there when needed. Anyway, I'll just load tomorrow morning at Bay instead.

 

[nfitz]

I don't like the limitations of autoload...minimum $20 load and min $5 balance for autoload trigger. Anyway, I'll just load tomorrow morning at Bay instead.

It's far less cash locked up than buying a $150 metropass every month. Or even a roll of tokens. Or heck, 10 tokens these days ....

 

[Megaton327]

It's far less cash locked up than buying a $150 metropass every month. Or even a roll of tokens. Or heck, 10 tokens these days ....

It's also protected against loss and you can ask for a refund, minus 4% of your balance, at any time.

 

[LNahid2000]

It's far less cash locked up than buying a $150 metropass every month. Or even a roll of tokens. Or heck, 10 tokens these days ....

It's not about cash locked up...it's about having control over when my credit card is charged. I use transit maybe once a month, so making the 2 minute trip to the subway station to reload usually isn't a big deal for me.