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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

The addition of all-day service with dozens of trains running midday....

Let’s make reasonable projections about ridership based on authentic data.

LOL. "Dozens of trains!" but we need authentic data.
 
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Just a sour NIMBY.
From this piece in 2015, it's evident he lives near the tracks.

Many boomers who bought houses near train tracks were told by Realtors in the 70's etc that "Trains are dead, cars are replacing trains, the future is in flying cars etc". They were sold a lie in order to appease them in buying essentially what should have been devalued property.

Imagine their shock and amazement that train service is experiencing a renaissance, and the train tracks they were told would be torn out and replaced with a nice walking trail is getting expanded service.

But their anger is misplaced.
 
I ride the midday Mount Joy trains fairly often and generally find them well used.... certainly beyond a busload or two of business.

The limiting factor is that the parking lots are full by 08:00, which really disincents midday travellers. When service goes to half hourly, the convenience of the schedule will improve but there still won't be any way to get to the station.

It's time ML (and us) recognized that conventional 45-foot municipal transit buses running on main arteries may be good for many, but they are a lousy way to do the first/last mile connection to a RER system. It's time for a more innovative approach, likely something with electric mini buses, online apps to hail the ride, and flexible routes that get people all the way into subdivisions. I wonder how long it will be before these vehicles can be automated.

- Paul
 
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Laugh at the guy, but he's bang on about the lack of last mile connections. If Mlinx doesn't address that, RER will be a big flop and midday trains will remain empty. Seeing empty trains will piss off people and they'll sour on transit expansion. Transit fans write off such concerns at their peril.
 
Laugh at the guy, but he's bang on about the lack of last mile connections. If Mlinx doesn't address that, RER will be a big flop and midday trains will remain empty. Seeing empty trains will piss off people and they'll sour on transit expansion. Transit fans write off such concerns at their peril.

I certainly concur that there needs to be better transit/transportation servicing suburban GO stations.

But I'm not sure why the onus is on Metrolinx.

York Region Transit is the local provider, on that line, and I would argue the onus is on them.

I've never heard someone suggest that the problem w/Danforth GO or Long Branch is that there isn't enough 'last mile'. That, of course, is because the TTC provides that.

Brampton has clearly established what happens when you vastly improve route structure and frequency/span of service. Ridership growth, and lots of it.

If YRT got proper funding support (which it has to ask for first), it could meet a great deal of the demand (not all of it) with conventional transit.

Take basic service on the major routes nearest each station and make sure you have 15M or better service in place, all-day, and that the local bus stops are either integrated to GO or at least convenient to access (walkway w/snowmelt and canopy/lighting), controlled street crossing, shelter w/heating w/next trip time display.

I would have no objection to suggesting Metrolinx communicate, clearly, in writing to York Region that service increases from GO are dependent on a matching investment in YRT.

Metrolinx was pretty much that demanding in Niagara and the result is regional transit (where there was none) and substantial (overdue) improvements in local service.

But they aren't the provider of said service.
 
I certainly concur that there needs to be better transit/transportation servicing suburban GO stations.

But I'm not sure why the onus is on Metrolinx.

York Region Transit is the local provider, on that line, and I would argue the onus is on them.

I've never heard someone suggest that the problem w/Danforth GO or Long Branch is that there isn't enough 'last mile'. That, of course, is because the TTC provides that.

Brampton has clearly established what happens when you vastly improve route structure and frequency/span of service. Ridership growth, and lots of it.

If YRT got proper funding support (which it has to ask for first), it could meet a great deal of the demand (not all of it) with conventional transit.

Take basic service on the major routes nearest each station and make sure you have 15M or better service in place, all-day, and that the local bus stops are either integrated to GO or at least convenient to access (walkway w/snowmelt and canopy/lighting), controlled street crossing, shelter w/heating w/next trip time display.

I would have no objection to suggesting Metrolinx communicate, clearly, in writing to York Region that service increases from GO are dependent on a matching investment in YRT.

Metrolinx was pretty much that demanding in Niagara and the result is regional transit (where there was none) and substantial (overdue) improvements in local service.

But they aren't the provider of said service.

Last mile needs to not just be there physically, but also reasonable.

When the TTC last mile was 50% off when you took GO it was worth it. To pay full fare ontop of the already relatively pricey GO trip, many people will just stick on a longer bus ride and avoid the train etc.
 
Last mile needs to not just be there physically, but also reasonable.

When the TTC last mile was 50% off when you took GO it was worth it. To pay full fare ontop of the already relatively pricey GO trip, many people will just stick on a longer bus ride and avoid the train etc.
The suburban local services have long had GO integrated fare structures where the local fare costs only $0.75 or so.
 
The suburban local services have long had GO integrated fare structures where the local fare costs only $0.75 or so.

yes but that is only half of the last mile equation. There are two last miles, at your arrival and destination.

What good is a co-fare in suburbia when you dont get one downtown? Most people need to then take the TTC from Union.

The disincentive will cause someone to just take a Markham bus to a TTC bus and avoid the midday GO trains altogether.
 
^I agree that ML need not be the local service provider, but I don't agree that it therefore falls on YRT.

The premise when ML was created was that it would somehow rise above parochial issues and silo-bust the bureaucratic and parochial political mindset of individual transit properties. This hasn't happened, and if anything ML's own poor track record continues to leave the municipal operators determined not to play nice. It's time to tear up that whole idea - doing it the same way and expecting a different result is craziness.

What first-mile/last-mile needs is a completely new system. Sure, the municipal transit grids can carry some connecting passengers with GO, but some other system and method is needed in parallel. Think of it as Uber-sharing and not as more bus routes.

I would like to see this put out to an RFP procurement. If the whole GO operation can go to P3, surely this can. One would likely see a lot more innovative proposals come forward this way, proposals that sidestep the existing infrastructure (politicians, management and unions) and their engrained modus operandi and mindsets altogether. Certainly, the municipalities could bid on these if they chose, but without any monopoly guarantee.

I don't see fare integration as a problem. Personally I would be content to tap my phone on the last-mile provider even if I tapped my Presto Card for the rest of the ride. Just price the service accordingly.

- Paul
 
Just a sour NIMBY.
From this piece in 2015, it's evident he lives near the tracks.

Reminds me of when I took the Stouffville train back in the day and a guy who backed onto the track would come out to his deck everyday to give the train the finger. I think it was near the 16th Ave. crossing.
 
That poor guy was just laughed at and forgotten as this. I feel his pain though, having to be awakened by the train horn every hour till mid night...
 
^ Then don't buy a house that backs on a rail line. Possibly, as an earlier post said, the developer told them that it was an lightly used freight line that will probably end up being torn up. I suppose the taxpayers could agree to whatever costs and liabilities required by TC to approve a no-horn exemption, but then, oh, the rumbling.
 
Too much GO train service too soon on Stouffville line
OPINION Sep 08, 2019 by Sean Pearce Markham Economist & Sun


The GO train service on the Stouffville line has been, and continues to be, a wonderful asset for early morning and late day commuters travelling to and from work each day.
That’s where “wonderful” ends.

The addition of all-day service with dozens of trains running midday demonstrates a lack of reasoned planning and forethought on the part of Metrolinx. The majority of these midday trains are near empty. In spite of ridership data, that clearly doesn’t warrant so many trains so soon, Metrolinx plans on pushing ahead with a 400 per cent increase of trains on the Stouffville line.

This “build it and they will come” philosophy ignores the obvious, that many GO station stops are huge parking lots, or stops where commuters are obliged to find additional transport once they exit the train.

My neighbours laughingly refer to these dozens of midday trains as “ghost trains.” There really is little humour in this. It is a sad lack of insight on the part of Metrolinx and city planners to believe that current growth rates in York Region require trains every 15 minutes. Let’s make reasonable projections about ridership based on authentic data before investing any more taxpayer dollars on “too much, too soon” ventures.

Dave Pollard
Markham
The midday Kitchener line trains were mostly empty the first 2 years. Now the 9:00, 10:00, 11:00 and 12:00 have a good amount of people on it. In fact I think they need to increase the 9:00 from 6 to 10 coaches. It's been standing room only for a while now after malton. The remaining trains are usually 1/2 to 3/4 full. The new evening trains are usually empty going towards union but riding the new 7:53 train about 30 people got off at each station (after Etobicoke north) to mount pleasant.
 

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