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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
reaperexpress
Senior Member
I was curious about the special schedule for the eclipse, so I consolidated the Lakeshore West and Via Rail timetables:
In total there are 6 round trips to Niagara (5 GO + 1 Via) on the 8th of April, which is the most there has ever been, as far as I'm aware. The Via timings are not bad for a day trip to Niagara, and that's clearly reflected in Via's surge pricing:
Price (excluding HST) of Via Rail trip from Toronto to Niagara Falls (eclipse is on 8 April)
In the morning there's hourly GO Train service to Niagara, with a slightly longer travel time than usual to account for heavy passenger loads and slower 12-car trains:
In the afternoon, there are special express trains from Oakville that are simply return trips from pre-existing PM Peak local trains from Toronto to Oakville. The Niagara schedule is completely different than usual. The 19:11 counter-peak GO train from Niagara train skips St. Catharines because it meets the PM Peak GO train towards Niagara there, and only one of the tracks has a platform.
In total there are 6 round trips to Niagara (5 GO + 1 Via) on the 8th of April, which is the most there has ever been, as far as I'm aware. The Via timings are not bad for a day trip to Niagara, and that's clearly reflected in Via's surge pricing:
Price (excluding HST) of Via Rail trip from Toronto to Niagara Falls (eclipse is on 8 April)
In the morning there's hourly GO Train service to Niagara, with a slightly longer travel time than usual to account for heavy passenger loads and slower 12-car trains:
In the afternoon, there are special express trains from Oakville that are simply return trips from pre-existing PM Peak local trains from Toronto to Oakville. The Niagara schedule is completely different than usual. The 19:11 counter-peak GO train from Niagara train skips St. Catharines because it meets the PM Peak GO train towards Niagara there, and only one of the tracks has a platform.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
GO Transit and TTC should follow the NY Path’s (and others) example and enact a ban on all electric bikes (and scooters) outside of designated mobility devices. That would kill several birds with one stone: reduce/eliminate the scourge of delivery app riders crowding the trains and platforms, reduce/eliminate the fire risk from dodgy batteries, and disrupt the delivery app business model of exploiting poor labour outside of the city (just in time for the international student visa collapse of available riders). For the rest of us, if you want to bring a conventional bicycle onto the GO Train, the strict rule of two bicycles per car must be enforced.
The PATH Train Just Quietly Banned E-Bikes at All Times - Streetsblog New York City
Advocates for delivery workers were blindsided. And one e-bike user told Streetsblog that the new ban would really make his life difficult.
nyc.streetsblog.org
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micheal_can
Senior Member
This could have some unintended consequences. For example,this could mean certain things that make Toronto livable could disappear. Imagine if all of those apps didn't work within the city of Toronto.GO Transit and TTC should follow the NY Path’s (and others) example and enact a ban on all electric bikes (and scooters) outside of designated mobility devices. That would kill several birds with one stone: reduce/eliminate the scourge of delivery app riders crowding the trains and platforms, reduce/eliminate the fire risk from dodgy batteries, and disrupt the delivery app business model of exploiting poor labour outside of the city (just in time for the international student visa collapse of available riders). For the rest of us, if you want to bring a conventional bicycle onto the GO Train, the strict rule of two bicycles per car must be enforced.
The PATH Train Just Quietly Banned E-Bikes at All Times - Streetsblog New York City
Advocates for delivery workers were blindsided. And one e-bike user told Streetsblog that the new ban would really make his life difficult.
Jonny5
Senior Member
Geriatrics like me remember the old days when there were no apps like those to use, like six or seven years ago. The stone age, basically.
People starved to death routinely, I figure. How did people even find a way to eat in that archaic distant past where food wasn't brought to you on a whim for very high fees?
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Admiral Beez
Superstar
I've never once used a delivery app, so IDK. If I want takeout, I go get it. And outside of food, I purchase very little merchandise nowadays - my 53 y/o self is focused on purging, not acquiring.
I'm not a Luddite, I just refuse to pay delivery fees and tips for what I can do myself.
micheal_can
Senior Member
Just like how there were places where GO did not go to. How did they commute? Was it better?
The fact that so many commute to serve those apps says you are in the minority.
Jonny5
Senior Member
What? The overwhelming majority have never and still don't use GO to commute to Toronto.
What? The overwhelming majority still don't use food delivery apps.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
These apps are exploiting labourers, mostly from the subcontinent while driving down our labour rates and negotiating power. When I see these poor chaps cycling through terrible weather so that Canadians can get their sandwich without leaving the house I can’t help but think of the coolies or wallahs of the British Empire. What’s next, do we want some Indian guys to carry us around?
I refuse to be party to this, and I’ll pick up my own lunch, thank you.
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micheal_can
Senior Member
Do you only get your food from places that pay a living wage too?These apps are exploiting labourers, mostly from the subcontinent while driving down our labour rates and negotiating power. When I see these poor chaps cycling through terrible weather so that Canadians can get their sandwich without leaving the house I can’t help but think of the coolies or wallahs of the British Empire. What’s next, do we want some Indian guys to carry us around.
I refuse to be party to this, and I’ll pick up my own lunch, thank you.
reinventingthewheel
Active Member
I can appreciate the sentiments here, I personally haven’t ordered delivery for many years since my days as a busy (lazy) student. But I do think these delivery services serve a good purpose.
Rather than relying on customers from a very local area (or active individuals willing to travel like ourselves), a business can reach a wider demographic using bike delivery services – especially as we remove more and more on-street parking. For some businesses this extra reach is needed to stay afloat.
Now to the original point, I do see there is a problem with the regulation of e-bikes and general etiquette. I see plenty of near-misses where e-bikers put pedestrians at risk. There are dodgy batteries in some of these things and they do crowd some train cabs. I was even hospitalized by a careless e-biker late last year and still haven’t fully recovered.
But these concerning incidents are of relatively low frequency. A detailed risk analysis on this subject would yield results that do not warrant this level of mitigation approach, where the hazard is effectively eliminated (ban all e-bikes on transit). We need to be pragmatic about our approach to risk mitigation and we should attempt to reduce the resources needed for intervention (it’s one thing to ban it but it’s another challenge to enforce it).
Allow me to kick off some brainstorming with one alternative (just spitballing, not suggesting it’s the right solution): a revised vetting process and regulation for delivery personnel, possibly requiring a registered home address and restricting delivery to within a region.
Rather than relying on customers from a very local area (or active individuals willing to travel like ourselves), a business can reach a wider demographic using bike delivery services – especially as we remove more and more on-street parking. For some businesses this extra reach is needed to stay afloat.
Now to the original point, I do see there is a problem with the regulation of e-bikes and general etiquette. I see plenty of near-misses where e-bikers put pedestrians at risk. There are dodgy batteries in some of these things and they do crowd some train cabs. I was even hospitalized by a careless e-biker late last year and still haven’t fully recovered.
But these concerning incidents are of relatively low frequency. A detailed risk analysis on this subject would yield results that do not warrant this level of mitigation approach, where the hazard is effectively eliminated (ban all e-bikes on transit). We need to be pragmatic about our approach to risk mitigation and we should attempt to reduce the resources needed for intervention (it’s one thing to ban it but it’s another challenge to enforce it).
Allow me to kick off some brainstorming with one alternative (just spitballing, not suggesting it’s the right solution): a revised vetting process and regulation for delivery personnel, possibly requiring a registered home address and restricting delivery to within a region.
micheal_can
Senior Member
generalcanada
Senior Member
There really is no need for licensing. The problem isnt the bikers, its the delivery apps.
There is a reason they ride on sidewalks, theres a reason they ride the wrong way on 1-way streets, its because of how they get paid, If they dont deliver as quick as possible, they get docked pay.
For example instead of taking the extra 30 seconds to cross a street properly, they go on the sidewalk on the same side of the street to save time.
New York has done this and they already see a drastic improvement in the safety of the riders.
If you remove the need to save those 30 seconds of course they will act better.
Now the banning of delivery except for your home location is simply a bandaid. Remember its not the region people live in thats the problem its what makes them do what they do
Bojaxs
Senior Member
These apps didn't exist when I worked in DT Toronto back in 2009-2011. People simply left their desk and went to one of the many food courts in the underground.
A lot of smaller, family run, restaurants don't actually like using these apps because the apps get to take their cut from every order placed at the restaurant. These smaller restaurants are forced to increase their prices to compensate. In turn making their menus more expensive and less competitive with the bigger restaurants. These apps are designed to benefit the big chain, franchise restaurants like McDonald's. Restaurants that aren't exactly hurting to reach customers from further away.
I remember one time I placed an order at an independent pizzeria using Skip. When I went to pickup my order, the guy behind the counter kindly asked me to place my order by phone instead of using a delivery app. He said he would even throw in a couple free drinks with my next order. I pretty much stopped using delivery apps since then.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
It's not easy, but I try and do the least harm through my consumption habits, such as leaning more vegetarian and bulk packaged foods. For my food shopping, Canada's largest supermarket chains are union shops. Most restaurants I buy from are non-chain, owner operated. I do not use or support food delivery apps because they're both a waste of money and exploitative of immigrant unskilled labour. It's as if Canada is setting up a new caste system or renewing the Indian indenture system where you do whatever your overseers tell you in the hope of getting a residential permit. As a country, we can do better than this.
Back on topic, we want GO Transit to be used by commuters going to work or school and leisure travelers. Stuffing the system with potentially incendiary e-bikes and exploited international students to deliver our sandwiches to our lazy backsides is not right.
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