GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[Platform 27]

This route would make a lot of sense. Personally, I would create a route that went:

1. University of Waterloo
2. Laurier University
3. Uptown Waterloo
4. Downtown Kitchener
5. (Via Hwy 7)
6. Downtown Guelph (Connections to Georgetown GO Bus)
7. University of Guelph
8. Aberfoyle Park and Ride (Connections to Cambridge, Milton GO Buses)
9. (Via Hwy 6)
10. McMaster University
11. Hamilton GO Centre
12. (and potentially) Stoney Creek Park and Ride (connections to Niagara GO Bus)

With 4 downtown cores and 4 universities, such a route would serve GO's bread-and-butter market and would most certainly be a success.

I've signed the petition and I also encourage others to do so.

Better still, sneak in a quick jaunt east from the 403/6 jct. to Aldershot GO Station before reversing west to Mac, so there's Lakeshore West daytime train connectivity, too.

 

[TOareaFan]

Anyone know when the April schedule changes will be announced? We are nearly half way through March already!!

 

[Northern Light]

Oh Vegeta......

The masses would like their GO insider's report, please.

 

[DavidH]

Oh Vegeta......
The masses would like their GO insider's report, please.

Yes, please....

 

[hwy7]

A letter to the editor from Monday's Georgetown Independent:

Metrolinx plan is a reason for outrage
Dear editor,

I read with interest your story on the potential ‘delay’ of construction of the Georgetown line, due to the Canadian Transportation Authority ruling that orders GO to use quieter construction methods near communities and schools.

The claim is that this will potentially delay the introduction of all-day two way GO service to Brampton and Georgetown.

Unfortunately Metrolinx is pulling your community’s collective leg.

The Environmental Project Report (EPR) published by Metrolinx last summer quite clearly states that no construction is required to increase service to 42 trains each day from the current 19. Two-way, all-day service is possible now, without any construction. This is referred to as the scenario called ‘future no-build’ in the EPR.

In addition, at the October 2009 Metrolinx board meeting, general manager Gary McNeil announced that GO will only add 10 additional runs when the construction is completed in 2015.

These two Metrolinx ‘facts’ are not very well known to your community and they ought to be.

You ought to be outraged that you are promised all-day two-way service and will not get it. You ought to be outraged that they could, if they wanted to, increase to 42 trains a day without constructing any new tracks, and yet they won’t. You ought to be outraged that they will not give you more than 10 new trains even after the construction is finished.

We all ought to be outraged that we are rushing to spend well nigh a billion of our scarce tax dollars to construct all these new rails through Toronto that won’t be needed, or used, for GO services.

The real reason for the rush, and for the huge cost, is to construct rails to give to a private company to run nearly-empty trains for a luxury service between Union Station and Pearson Airport. The Premier promised the trains would be running in time for the Pan-Am Games. This has nothing to do with GO improvements.

Mike Sullivan, Co-chair

Clean Train Coalition, Weston

Thoughts?

 

[ShonTron]

I've gone weary of Mike Sullivan and the Weston Sub crowd over the past two or three years, though I was entirely sympathetic to their concerns.

In the letter, Sullivan is right. The remaining Cabbageheads (of whom McNeil is class Valedictorian) are still doing the bait-and-switch. Though the "build nothing" was based, if I recall correctly, on the completion of West Toronto (which was a separate project) and Georgetown North. A single track from the passing track at Woodbine through to Rogers Road would, and could, accommodate hourly GO trains and some additional VIA service.

GO promised even in the original EA only some additional trains, they were not planning for hourly service, which really angered me - it was a plan to accommodate SNC Lavalin's private rail link with 60-year old RDCs. GO/Metrolinx is known for being secretive, hostile to opposition, and closed-minded, though we did see some signs of light here and there.

There's a lot of truth, way too much truth, to what Sullivan says.

 

[dunkalunk]

Better still, sneak in a quick jaunt east from the 403/6 jct. to Aldershot GO Station before reversing west to Mac, so there's Lakeshore West daytime train connectivity, too.

Yes!

If they can find a way to make the transfer at Aberfoyle timed, that would be even better, but I doubt that would be possible given traffic congestion issues. I would also personally skip the stop at Downtown Kitchener for speed reasons. GO already offers a stop here on route 25, as well as Coach Canada and Greyhound.

I do however see a potential competition issue arising with greyhound which already runs a route between downtown Kitchener, Downtown Guelph, and U of G

 

[vegeta_skyline]

Oh Vegeta......

The masses would like their GO insider's report, please.

Yes, please....

lol, well wish I could be of more assistance. But the flow of information, even on the inside has somewhat decreased.
What I do know is this; We've started to received the next batch of new units starting from 627. To my surprise according to a source, GO has ordered 30 more of the MP40 units (instead of 20 as was originally planned). Giving GO a total of 57 new units. The source added that this won't even be enough for all the future(relatively near-term i.e. within 5 years) service expansion plans and that GO will have to keep some of the old PH59 units. He didn't have many specifics on the time frames for the service increases though he mentioned that Niagara Falls service expansion will be one of the first(Monday-Friday rush hour service).

Otherwise in the last week the number of work gangs (on the lakeshore line) has increased dramatically and so track & platform work should accelerate. The third track from Port Credit to 9th Line is basically finished. Seems like they are now going to focus on finishing the track between 9th Line and Oakville. Once thats complete, the track will be ready to go.

The only service increase in the near term (April-May) that I've heard about is the return of the weekend Niagara Falls service. With a slight change, one train will leave Toronto for Niagara Falls on Friday night instead of Saturday morning.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

A letter to the editor from Monday's Georgetown Independent:



Thoughts?

Hmmm. So according to Mike's letter, the environmental impacts of running diesel trains isn't the issue. The issue is spending $$$ for "private interests" SNC Lavalin, interesting. Furthermore hasn't CTC's complaints caused GO/Metrolinx to implement more expensive options, including demainding that electrification happen now so that we can eliminate the pollution caused by diesel (yet I thought that's not an issue for Georgetown residents, as mentioned above).

Seems to me that Mike is cherry picking his issues to cater to the groups he's trying to convince to join his group.

 

[RedRocket191]

+1

After demanding no expansion of diesel trains, the message has become "you should be ashamed that Metrolinx is not expanding diesel trains".

It is correct to say that "no construction is required to bring all-day service to the Georgetown line". However, we have decided to do construction (be it WTD or GSSE) so that reality is no longer available to us.

I want all day service as much as everyone who uses the corridor, but I also know that there is a reason why my parents chose to rent a house for six months in 1994 while our current house was under construction - living in a construction site is no good for anyone involved.

If we're talking about a light remodelling (like laying a second track) then I would not support delaying the trains. But that's not quite what we're talking about - we're talking about a near-total teardown and rebuild.

I'm coming from this from a bit of a different perspective though....

 

[Jonny5]

.....and the final end of GO's Yonge Street bus.

People are up in arms about this per The Star

Riders pledge to drive as GO kills bus routes
March 11, 2010

Tess Kalinowski


While the Ontario government is investing billions in public transit, hundreds of York Region riders are accusing GO Transit of driving them back into their cars by cancelling two Newmarket bus routes.

Citing low ridership and the need to integrate with York Region's regular service and Viva express buses, GO will discontinue the 92B bus to York Mills on April 5, and the Newmarket-York University bus on April 26.

The move makes commutes longer and more expensive, said more than 200 GO riders who attended a meeting Tuesday with GO and York Region officials.

About 500 people ride the two Newmarket routes, which operate on weekdays. GO did not say how many riders are needed to make the routes viable.

Many of the riders the Star contacted Wednesday said they would rather drive than use York Region Transit buses, which they say are slower and more expensive.

Jennifer McCue said she'll have to drive because the local buses won't get her home in time for her to pick up her baby from daycare.

"If you want to take transit you have to leave work early every day. Timing-wise, it just doesn't work," she said.

"I pay $180 per month to travel to and from work," said Nancy Andrews.

The cancellation drives her travel costs up to $271 per month, a 51 per cent increase.

York University student Francis Babu says he will probably drive to school rather than endure a commute made 90 minutes longer by the service cancellation.

The economic climate is forcing GO to make tough choices, said a spokesperson for the agency. However, "the motivation for no longer operating this service was not solely a cost-saving measure." It has always been a part of GO's plan to withdraw some services as local transit matures, said Vanessa Thomas.

YRT general manager Richard Leary said he was disappointed GO cancelled the routes on short notice, after running them for five years.

But YRT has capacity to carry those riders, and YRT staff are reviewing service to see whether there is a way to shave time off the existing routes, he said.

"I'm anxious to have these riders join our service," said Leary. "There's an opportunity there. If we can increase ridership, that's what we're all about. The best thing is that there's an outcry for more and better public transportation."

 

[DavidJamesTO]

I do however see a potential competition issue arising with greyhound which already runs a route between downtown Kitchener, Downtown Guelph, and U of G

You can get from Kitchener to U of Guelph now. Just change buses at the Aberfoyle Park-and-Ride. You'll be waiting a while, but it would work.

 

[unimaginative2]

From the sounds of it, there's a complete disconnect between GO and Metrolinx about what to do on Georgetown (and the other corridors). Gary McNeil and friends are obsessed with the idea of GO as a straight commuter service and are utterly convinced that any expansion beyond that mandate or their existing service area is doomed to failure. They fought the Peterborough and Waterloo Region buses kicking and screaming, declaring that nobody would ride them. They've been leaving people on the platforms they're so busy. Likewise Gary McNeil has been constantly publicly contradicting the Metrolinx plans for Georgetown in an effort to maintain a very limited (i.e. poor) service. I really think that putting GO (an admirably run organization for its current purpose) in charge of regional rail is like putting Milton Transit in charge of running the Yonge subway. Their institutional mindset is not suited to it no matter how competent they may be.

What frightens me is that they will build out the full EA study 8-track main and then GO will refuse to run anything but a ten-car diesel train of bilevels every couple hours.

I'm quite sympathetic to the Weston people since they got on their electrification campaign. I think it was a wonderful, unique opportunity to get electrification in our lifetime. If they don't do it now, they're not going to do it for decades--i.e. when the new diesel rolling stock they're about to buy wears out. We also have the most transit-friendly provincial government in history and that's not going to last forever.

 

[ShonTron]

From the sounds of it, there's a complete disconnect between GO and Metrolinx about what to do on Georgetown (and the other corridors). Gary McNeil and friends are obsessed with the idea of GO as a straight commuter service and are utterly convinced that any expansion beyond that mandate or their existing service area is doomed to failure.

...

I'm quite sympathetic to the Weston people since they got on their electrification campaign. I think it was a wonderful, unique opportunity to get electrification in our lifetime. If they don't do it now, they're not going to do it for decades--i.e. when the new diesel rolling stock they're about to buy wears out. We also have the most transit-friendly provincial government in history and that's not going to last forever.

Absolutely - until GO is rid of their 1995-2005 Gordon Chong-era stock of management, regional transit is a tough sell.

For all the criticisms towards Weston (and there are some very valid faults), they are up against GO Transit, who, as Unimaginative points out, often need to be dragged kicking and screaming by others into doing anything progressive.

What Unimaginative mentioned as frightening - running 10-12 car monster trains every few hours off-peak - is exactly the McNeil brand of thought.

 

[Dan416]

From the sounds of it, there's a complete disconnect between GO and Metrolinx about what to do on Georgetown (and the other corridors). Gary McNeil and friends are obsessed with the idea of GO as a straight commuter service and are utterly convinced that any expansion beyond that mandate or their existing service area is doomed to failure. They fought the Peterborough and Waterloo Region buses kicking and screaming, declaring that nobody would ride them. They've been leaving people on the platforms they're so busy. Likewise Gary McNeil has been constantly publicly contradicting the Metrolinx plans for Georgetown in an effort to maintain a very limited (i.e. poor) service. I really think that putting GO (an admirably run organization for its current purpose) in charge of regional rail is like putting Milton Transit in charge of running the Yonge subway. Their institutional mindset is not suited to it no matter how competent they may be.

What frightens me is that they will build out the full EA study 8-track main and then GO will refuse to run anything but a ten-car diesel train of bilevels every couple hours.

I'm quite sympathetic to the Weston people since they got on their electrification campaign. I think it was a wonderful, unique opportunity to get electrification in our lifetime. If they don't do it now, they're not going to do it for decades--i.e. when the new diesel rolling stock they're about to buy wears out. We also have the most transit-friendly provincial government in history and that's not going to last forever.

I'm just curious, but you say the Peterborough and Waterloo services are "leaving people on the platforms they're so busy"? Is this a fact? Any data to back it up? If the services are popular, wouldn't GO want to increase service.

And why would GO be all about these capital/infrastructure projects when it won't run the actual services?