VIA Rail

[Northern Light]

*Strong nod at the disclaimer In my signature, in case it’s not obvious enough that I write solely on behalf of myself*


Excellent, though slightly bitter, summary, which resonates with my also “European af” perspective, though as a German less from a “victim solidarisation” than a “the only way to regain trust is to unconditionally reconciliate” angle...

I saw today this no less excellent article in The Globe&Mail, which goes really in-depth to explain the underlying issues of self-representation when it comes to First Nations:

As I said, highly recommended read:

Beyond bloodlines: How the Wet’suwet’en hereditary system at the heart of the Coastal GasLink conflict works

Wet’suwet’en Nation hereditary chiefs say pipelines cannot be built through their territory without their consent. Their governance system is complex and rooted in cultural traditions. But there are disagreements over how it works and who benefits

www.theglobeandmail.com

Second the recommended reading.

Completely separate from the merits of the pipeline in question; or demonstration tactics, is who exactly is entitled to represent whom? The piece is a good explainer of how complex the answer to that question may be; when those being represented may not agree themselves.

 

[SunriseChampion]

I absolutely get that history is not in our favour, but we have to find a way to reconcile the past and move forward at the same time. Strangling the very economy we all (they and we) depend on isn't it.

I'm afraid that that's exactly it. The only way to get capitalists to listen to anything is to cut off their ability to make the amounts of money they are involved with grow.

I mean sorry it has to be this way, but I didn't invent greed.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Excellent, though slightly bitter, summary, which resonates with my also “European af” perspective, though as a German less from a “victim solidarisation” than a “the only way to regain trust is to unconditionally reconciliate” angle...

Funny story....my family is half Sudeten German and half Bohemian so I come from both sides, so to speak. The Germanisation of the Czech lands started over a thousand years ago and culminated in, at first, the public execution of the Czech and Moravian nobles who were descendants of the founders of the people, way back in the middle of the last millenium and then later the Nazi invasion. It's been good times for a while over there. I can entirely understand how indigenous people here must feel. Other parallels might include the fact that the Czech language was not taught in schools and that German was the lingua franca of business and the courts, etc.
The Slovaks had it even worse. They weren't much more than slaves under the thumb of the Hungarians for hundreds of years.

As for me being bitter......?
That's just the result of my life course from the last 15 years, nbd.

I saw today this no less excellent article in The Globe&Mail, which goes really in-depth to explain the underlying issues of self-representation when it comes to First Nations:

As I said, highly recommended read:

Beyond bloodlines: How the Wet’suwet’en hereditary system at the heart of the Coastal GasLink conflict works

Wet’suwet’en Nation hereditary chiefs say pipelines cannot be built through their territory without their consent. Their governance system is complex and rooted in cultural traditions. But there are disagreements over how it works and who benefits

www.theglobeandmail.com

Excellent! Thanks for posting that.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Also, I'd like to just say that I agree that there are indeed people who just like to stir shit and will protest at the slightest perceived grievance, offence, etc.

Duly understood. However, I think this is an important issue to stand up for and I fully support the protesters and have even thought of joining those from Tyendinaga as I was born in Belleville and have friends who are members of the Mohawk Nation.

 

[crs1026]

^I would like to see Reconciliation succeed, and sooner than later, but it’s immaterial to me how the Indigenous people organize their government or who they put forward as their representatives. That’s theirs to figure out, and not really any of my business. What matters is that there has to be clarity. The ceded-nonceded issue is a complication to the pipeline proposal that may bear on the solution, but without clarity about who can speak for Indigenous people, and who can commit First Nations’ yea or nay, no solution will be workable.

There is never a bright line that separates protest as a symbollic event or rallying point from protest which becomes a pressure tactic. Once it becomes a pressure tactic, it invites retaliation and escalation. At some point protesters have to show restraint otherwise there is more incentive to apply counter pressure than to work thing out through dialog. It’s a slippery slope. I’m feeling that the sustained blockage of the rail network has reached that zone of excessiveness.

Complete unanimity just isn’t a feature of “Colonial” government. We routinely have laws enacted by a majority vote of legislators, where the vote may be 51-49, and the popular support for that 51% may be anything but unanimous. There are always dissenters. That’s why governance is so frequently hierarchical.

- Paul

 

[lenaitch]

*Strong nod at the disclaimer In my signature, in case it’s not obvious enough that I write solely on behalf of myself*


Excellent, though slightly bitter, summary, which resonates with my also “European af” perspective, though as a German less from a “victim solidarisation” than a “the only way to regain trust is to unconditionally reconciliate” angle...

I saw today this no less excellent article in The Globe&Mail, which goes really in-depth to explain the underlying issues of self-representation when it comes to First Nations:

As I said, highly recommended read:

Beyond bloodlines: How the Wet’suwet’en hereditary system at the heart of the Coastal GasLink conflict works

Wet’suwet’en Nation hereditary chiefs say pipelines cannot be built through their territory without their consent. Their governance system is complex and rooted in cultural traditions. But there are disagreements over how it works and who benefits

www.theglobeandmail.com

Interesting analysis - thanks for posting. I noted that, at one point in a dispute over who gets 'chief' status, they resorted to the court system.

Regardless, interesting discussion but we seem to be getting way into the weeds in a thread about VIA Rail.

 

[Allandale25]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1228071577968922625

 

[jje1000]

Cool story, but unceded land is unceded land. Not that those that ceded land with all the scam treaties are doing any better, mind.

Not sure why land that is unceded and therefore belongs to the Wet'suw'eten is even in play here. What, because Indian Act-imposed "chiefs" that are nonesuch by those peoples' traditional ways (but I guess the whole residential school genocide ploy didn't work, so let's get 'em somehow) signed agreements that no one is able to see and most deffo include bribes?
CGL was given opportunity to revise their plans back in 2014 when they were talking to the hereditary chiefs and didn't want to budge on their proposed route, likely for financial reasons. So, a private company's finances are to trump the sovereign rights of a nation? Cool story, tell it again.

This place is a mess. Any honourable people would honour treaties they sign and would recognise the inherent sovereignty of those on unceded land.

Why anyone would expect these people to play by the rules set out by those same people who don't follow their own treaty obligations and laws with respect to sovereign nations on this land is beyond me.

It's long past time that non-indigenous people wake up and realise the absolute shitshow that was imposed on these people and that the bare minimum of a start to fixing it is to honour the treaties and respect the sovereignty over unceded land that nations hold.

It's very, very simple if we could all just get our heads out of our economic arseholes for a minute and stop counting pennies.

I'm European af, but I get it. Maybe because my people were until about 30 years ago subjugated by outsiders for the better part of the last half millenium so I know what it's like to have others show up, scam you out of what is yours and tell you it's for your own good. I mean....that's basically what the Warsaw Pact invasion of Czechoslovakia was actually, come to think of it. "We're doing this for your own good....trust us...."

TBH, I think the discussion regarding the current VIA blockage should revolve around the Tyendinaga Mohawks, who are bound by a treaty.

BC's unceeded territories are an entirely separate mess from the treaty nations, and needs a separate pair of gloves to handle- I understand solidarity and all that, but mixing the two together results in a complicated morass.

And then there's the whole issue of Tides, US geopolitics, and the Supranational NGOs, which muddy up the waters even more...

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/anti-pipeline-american-funding-protest-conspiracy-theory-1.4987202

And the whole chief system is yet another mess that's layered on top:

'We’ve got a real divide in the community:’ Wet’suwet’en Nation in turmoil - APTN News

The battle over the CGL pipeline in B.C. both on social media and in the press is dividing the Wet’suwet’en Nation some members say.

aptnnews.ca

 

[SunriseChampion]

Regardless, interesting discussion but we seem to be getting way into the weeds in a thread about VIA Rail.

Yeah, sorry, I do that a lot. ?

I was actually wanting to start a thread on the issue of the protests but came upon this first and it all came out.

Also wanted to point out that real change doesn't come about by sitting at home and writing letters. Never has, never will.

Anyway, carry on. <3

 

[SunriseChampion]

TBH, I think the discussion regarding the current VIA blockage should revolve around the Tyendinaga Mohawks, who are bound by a treaty.

The Crown is bound by the same treaties and have been found to be in violation of their own terms all over the map. So I'm not sure why the down-trodden side should follow the law to the letter whilst the rule-writers absolve themselves of all responsibility for their part.

BC's unceeded territories are an entirely separate mess from the treaty nations, and needs a separate pair of gloves to handle- I understand solidarity and all that, but mixing the two together results in a complicated morass.

I'm not exactly sure why anyone should sit by and let the government dictate to another nation what is and isn't their right. The elected band council over there is an imposition on a sovereing nation through the Indian Act. This is some Tibet is now a part of China type shit. Good on the Mohawks for standing up to the powers that be to support those whose sovereign rights have been abused.

And the whole chief system is yet another mess that's layered on top:

'We’ve got a real divide in the community:’ Wet’suwet’en Nation in turmoil - APTN News

The battle over the CGL pipeline in B.C. both on social media and in the press is dividing the Wet’suwet’en Nation some members say.

aptnnews.ca

Yeah, that needs to be sorted out for sure.


It's clear that we're taking reconciliation about as seriously as we're taking climate change. A lot of talk and empty gestures coupled with an aversion to real change.

Anyway, how 'bout that VIA Rail eh? Shut down now in its entirety.

 

[Urban Sky]

I went downstairs to Gare Centrale this afternoon and to my surprise it wasn't filled with angry stranded passengers (even the staff was surprised):

 

[mdrejhon]

I had a train trip affected this week, too.

Got a full refund in 10 seconds simply by clicking "Cancel Ticket" at viarail website.

5-stars for easy 1-click refund, VIA made it preemptively fast for money to reappear in your bank account or credit card.
1-star for inconvenience though, but no complaints about refund process.

(full instant refund on a nonrefundable ticket....step away from the phone call and just log into VIA website....and click the easy refund button)

 

[bgb_ca]

Figures. I was booked to go from kw to London tomorrow afternoon on VIA. Good thing I saw this news before I left work so I was able to rebook on Greyhound.

I was able to cancel my via booking online, just waiting for my refund to reappear on my card.

I wonder how many people this screwed over, either because they are now stuck somewhere because their train was forced to stop in a different city/connection canceled, or those that were traveling that don't have a easy way to finish their trip/can't afford a ticket via bus/plane/taxi/uber/etc.

As far as I'm concerned, these protestors are going to lose a lot of sympathy because of this, especially once the cargo delays start catching up and people start running out of supplies that are normally delivered by train.

 

[Urban Sky]

I had a train trip affected this week, too.

Got a full refund in 10 seconds simply by clicking "Cancel Ticket" at viarail website.

5-stars for easy 1-click refund, VIA made it preemptively fast for money to reappear in your bank account or credit card.
1-star for inconvenience though, but no complaints about refund process.

(full instant refund on a nonrefundable ticket....step away from the phone call and just log into VIA website....and click the easy refund button)

Thank you for your feedback and I’m glad that you could obtain (or at least request) your refund without having to waste your own time and that of the agent and other customers calling...!

 

[p_xavier]

So it means I can't get to my house from work today unless I pay 200$ for a cab. Guess I'll have to try to enjoy urban living this weekend.