VIA Rail

[steveintoronto]

The budget will have to say something about the infrastructure bank idea - again, if the Liberals are committed to this, they will want to announce some prime candidate projects.

I'll have more researched answers on your other points later, but this is a big one, and of course beyond the VIA HFR project, whether it will be folded into the Infrastructure file or not remains to be seen, they are parallel concepts, formerly known as PPP (P3 to Canadians) or PFI.

Toronto out front for headquarters of Canada’s new infrastructure bank

As the Liberal government takes steps to launch Canada’s new infrastructure bank, Toronto has emerged as the likely home for the bank’s headquarters, according to sources and industry observers.

“Choosing to set up the infrastructure bank in any location other than Toronto would be the first signal this is sinking into the political muck,” former federal cabinet Minister David Emerson told BNN in a phone interview. Emerson previously led the government’s transportation policy review, which explored issues such as the privatization of Canada’s airports.

Finance Minister Bill Morneau unveiled the government’s plan to create the infrastructure bank during last fall’s economic update, following a recommendation from his Advisory Council on Economic Growth. The bank is expected to help fund massive infrastructure projects in Canada by attracting large institutions from around the world as partner investors. Its goal is to leverage up to five dollars in private money for each dollar the federal government puts in.

Multiple sources tells BNN that in the months since Morneau’s announcement, a group that involves Infrastructure Canada and Finance Canada have been working on the potential framework for the bank, which will operate at arm’s length to the government – a similar operating structure to that of the Canada Pension Plan Investment Board. Those sources also said the bank may ultimately employ upwards of 50-100 people, a staffing level that would resemble what is typically seen at investment banks that focus on deal-making.

Brook Simpson, press secretary to Infrastructure Minister Amarjeet Sohi, told BNN that no decisions have been made yet on the bank’s structure, staffing, or location.

In recent weeks, infrastructure bank representatives have been meeting with potential investors and stakeholders to help raise awareness on the bank’s role. “The government deserves credit. They’ve been consulting with all the players, including the pension funds,” Mark Romoff, president and CEO of The Canadian Council for Public-Private Partnerships, told BNN in a phone interview. Romoff confirmed he has been included in the government’s outreach.
[...]
Industry observers fear locating the bank anywhere but Toronto would send the wrong message to potential investors about the bank’s independence. “If you’re living in North Dakota, you have to accept that New York is the finance capital of the United States. I think in Canada, we have to learn to do the same,” added Emerson. “Toronto is the centre of our financial industry. And any foreign investors who come to Canada to explore financings go to Toronto.”

Lou Serafini Jr., president and CEO of infrastructure investor Fengate Real Asset Investments, highlighted in an emailed statement to BNN that “many construction contractors and operators run their North American public-private partnership operations out of Toronto — these are companies who understand how public and private sector entities can work together seamlessly.”
[...]

http://www.bnn.ca/toronto-out-front-for-headquarters-of-canada-s-new-infrastructure-bank-1.685489

Needless to say, there's a subtext in there of 'Toronto or Elsewhere'. It's a long detailed article, had to dig deep to find this, the story is 5 days old, but not showing in the printed media yet.

I'd say the case for the Infrastructure Bank is very strong! The hedging appears to be on *how* they structure this, not if they do.

Interview vids at site linked. Credit to BNN for the article and vids. This is surprisingly good quality journalism and it shows in the excellent interview discussions.

 

[steveintoronto]

I am hopeful that the equipment purchase will still be on the agenda. It benefits two provinces, is likely to be aimed at the issues that Ottawa has with Bombardier - certainly a more palatable option than outright subsidy - and is likely cost-beneficial considering that the existing equipment is at end of life.

Further to my prior answer to this, more clarity here:

Wednesday, September 21, 2016
Via Rail prepares to order new trains
Written by Keith Barrow

CANADIAN inter-city passenger operator Via Rail is moving forward with preparations to procure a new fleet of bi-mode (diesel and electric) trains as part of its $C 4bn plan to upgrade the Toronto – Ottawa – Montreal corridor.

CEO Mr Yves Desjardins-Siciliano told IRJ at InnoTrans on September 21 that Via Rail is seeking to acquire a proven design that is “in production or in use today,” with the first trains due to enter service by 2020.

“We’re looking for an established solution that meets Canadian requirements and is capable of operating in temperatures of between -40 and +40oC,” Desjardins-Siciliano says.
Via Rail plans a minimum order for between 32 and 48 trains, providing a total 10,000-14,000 seats.

The Canadian government is expected to make a decision on the funding structure for the Toronto – Montreal project by March, which will determine the procurement timeline and fleet composition. Tendering could begin as early as March or April 2017.

In March this year the federal budget allocated Via Rail $C 7.7m in the current financial year to fund pre-procurement activities for new rolling stock, level crossing safety enhancements, and station security. This will enable Via Rail to take the rolling stock project to the Request for Proposals (RFQ) stage.

http://www.railjournal.com/index.php/north-america/via-rail-prepares-to-order-new-trains.html

I'm assured by someone close to the top that (gist) "We did receive presentations from a number of companies" (remember, this is for whole trainsets, not necessarily a single manufacturer, but a consortium could have presented a combination of one manufacturer's loco, and another's coaches, complete as a trainset) so seeing this as a perk for Bombardier might not be the case. That might yet happen though on HFR, especially if Caisse are involved as a major investor.

 

[Allandale25]

VIA might not be the operator but this is the closest thread I can think of for this story about a press conference today on Vancouver Island. Also, the VIA RDCs are in the article picture although may not be used.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...sportation-minister-to-unveil-plans-1.4017047

 

[robmausser]

VIA might not be the operator but this is the closest thread I can think of for this story about a press conference today on Vancouver Island. Also, the VIA RDCs are in the article picture although may not be used.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...sportation-minister-to-unveil-plans-1.4017047

VIA should have tacked on some orders for the Nippon Sharyo DMUs for the UPX and SMART trains https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nippon_Sharyo_DMU

They are FRA compliant, and have luggage areas, comfortable seating etc. I'm sure they could be built with stairs like all VIA cars have now for low platforms.

I could see these easily being used in areas like Vancouver Island, Sarnia train, the Halifax commuter train being touted, Sudbury to White River etc. Possibly even new lines like Calgary to Edmonton, etc. I could see VIA using a fleet of these for services outside the Corridor.

Maybe VIA can buy them from Metrolinx when they convert the UPX to electric. I've heard Metrolinx wants to buy new trainsets rather than convert the DMUs to electric.

 

[crs1026]

Not exactly the ground-breaking news that was hoped for, but maybe it's something positive .....

http://www.timescolonist.com/news/l...ord-victoria-commuter-rail-service-1.11324219
http://www.vicnews.com/news/415788244.html

- Paul

 

[steveintoronto]

VIA might not be the operator but this is the closest thread I can think of for this story about a press conference today on Vancouver Island. Also, the VIA RDCs are in the article picture although may not be used.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...sportation-minister-to-unveil-plans-1.4017047

Very similar to Halifax's situation, except that VIA pulled out in this instance, and ostensibly BC Transit will step in.

Bedford councillor calls for more transit investments
FRAM DINSHAW | STAFF REPORTER
Published March 8, 2017 - 6:09pm
[...]
The time is now, he said, as the Halifax Regional Municipality prepares its 2017-18 budget.

“I think we really need to start listening to the groups and the people who are saying we need bus rapid transit, we need rail, we need more park-and-rides to get people downtown and to Burnside,” said Outhit.

He envisions bus rapid transit servicing those neighbourhoods ferries and a proposed commuter rail can’t reach, such as Clayton Park and parts of Dartmouth.

Outhit told the Chronicle Herald that HRM is still in discussions with both VIA Rail and CN Rail regarding a commuter rail pilot project that would use existing railway lines for a passenger service connecting downtown with outlying neighbourhoods such as Bedford.

While a strong proponent of commuter rail, Outhit opposes a new light rail network proposed by the Building Owners and Managers Association of Nova Scotia. They are calling for electric trains to shuttle commuters between Halifax and outlying communities such as Enfield at an estimated cost of up to $3 billion.

Outhit said last year that a project of this scale could use existing rail beds but will require laying 70 kilometres of new railroad tracks.

But he warns that failing to upgrade transit infrastructure would spell a grim future for downtown Halifax: Building vacancy rates will spike as residents and businesses relocate to more easily-accessible areas, leaving the city core empty.
[...]

http://thechronicleherald.ca/novasc...councillor-calls-for-more-transit-investments

Echoes of Moose Rail and Ottawa with the "Building Owners and Managers Association of Nova Scotia" reference.

VIA should have tacked on some orders for the Nippon Sharyo DMUs for the UPX and SMART trains ...Maybe VIA can buy them from Metrolinx when they convert the UPX to electric. I've heard Metrolinx wants to buy new trainsets rather than convert the DMUs to electric.

The Sharyos are finished. Very overpriced, by a factor of two, and problematic. I doubt the resale market for UPX' ones is that good, unless Metrolinx take a beating on the price. With the apparent resurgence of commuter lines in Canada, look for TC to offer more waivers, just as the US is doing, to allow mixed light and heavy rail use for passenger, with temporal separation. That allows the purchase of much superior, lighter, cheaper and *in production* models of LRVs.

Not exactly the ground-breaking news that was hoped for, but maybe it's something positive

I think that looks more positive than the one story indicates. Excellent heads-up, btw.

 

[jamincan]

I make a real presumption here that perhaps the younger posters could put more perspective on: My feeling is that anyone riding as expensive a machine as shown in the Brightline pic (that's about a C$3,000 machine or more) should know how to pop-off the front wheel!

Someone with a half-decent bike like that is probably not leaving it on a bike rack in a train like that either.

Time to disassemble and re-assemble a quality machine with quick-release wheels and in and out of a carry-bag? Fifteen minutes approx. with both wheels off, few minutes if just the front wheel.

Most bike bags require more disassembly than just wheels. At a bare-minimum, in addition to the wheels, you're also looking at removing the pedals and the handle-bars. I suppose you could remove the wheels, handlebars and pedals, and then reinstall them again in 15 minutes with practice, but it's not exactly a straightforward or easy task for your average person.

 

[steveintoronto]

Excellent post! You've done this, and you raise some critical points.

Someone with a half-decent bike like that is probably not leaving it on a bike rack in a train like that either.

Absolutely agreed! Even in a travel bag, you want that bag tethered by a lock to something, the lock preferably being looped through the frame so it can't be torn out of the bag.

Even on GO trains, I pop my front wheel off, turn handlebars sideways, slip the machine and front wheel *behind* the post next to the seats under the stairs to keep it out of the way (room there for two partially disassembled quality machines, actually, both being minimized in size and safer ) and lock it/them to the post, even though regs state not to. I've never had a problem with GO staff or security, because of the way it's done, their concern is tanks interfering with passenger flow.

Most bike bags require more disassembly than just wheels. At a bare-minimum, in addition to the wheels, you're also looking at removing the pedals and the handle-bars. I suppose you could remove the wheels, handlebars and pedals, and then reinstall them again in 15 minutes with practice, but it's not exactly a straightforward or easy task for your average person.

And some even have a pocket sewn in to detach the rear derailleur and sit it in so it doesn't get brutalized. If you have a very top-end machine with delicate rear derailleur, it's a good practice. In my case, I'm set-up for touring, so have heavier wheels (although still very light compared to most, Mavic rims, Specialized hubs, etc) and a good run-of-the-mill quality Suntour dérailleur on the rear (I'm old school, pre-index, original equip was Mavic and Simplex, still have the classic Simplex shifters reverse resistance clutch type, so things are a lot more rugged).

My mention of the bag was over-the-top for being forced into using one for carry-on, as is done on TGV, Eurostar, Amtrak Acela, etc. The answer is to do as Brightline are doing, and damn the bags, just more stuff to carry, but I do carry tools for distance. My major point was to pop-off the front-wheel, and it allows much less height to stand it vertically, and by allowing the bars to flip sideways, takes up far less space laterally. There's no reason that can't be accommodated on VIA's new rolling stock....but *without a doubt*....lock it to the rack! There is an onus to share the space for other cyclists with the limited provision for bike storage.

Btw: I ride an Argos Renovated 531 Reynolds, bought it second hand and forlorn in Taunton, UK, still with all the original Mavic group on it, for 120 Pounds! I had to replace headset, some other things, but in amazing shape. Renovated '74 according to the fork shaft. Possibly Falcon or Holdsworth originally. I tripleized BB and spread the rear cluster to maximize gear ratios for touring. Just breaking in new leather saddle now. Not too bad so far. Great post. Let's do some miles!

 

[muller877]

Even on GO trains, I pop my front wheel off, turn handlebars sideways, slip the machine and front wheel *behind* the post next to the seats under the stairs to keep it out of the way (room there for two partially disassembled quality machines, actually, both being minimized in size and safer ) and lock it/them to the post, even though regs state not to. I've never had a problem with GO staff or security, because of the way it's done, their concern is tanks interfering with passenger flow.

GO staff have to keep the path clear in case of an emergency. In case of fire/smoke your bike may be accidentally knocked into the main walkway which could cause a significant delay in evacuating the train (and even worse...it's locked so not easily moved out of the way during the panic).

I would recommend that you do not lock it and follow the GO safety regulation for the sake of others on the train.

 

[robmausser]

The Sharyos are finished. Very overpriced, by a factor of two, and problematic. I doubt the resale market for UPX' ones is that good, unless Metrolinx take a beating on the price.

More the reason for VIA to scoop them up at a deal.

 

[44 North]

VIA should have tacked on some orders for the Nippon Sharyo DMUs for the UPX and SMART trains https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nippon_Sharyo_DMU

They are FRA compliant, and have luggage areas, comfortable seating etc. I'm sure they could be built with stairs like all VIA cars have now for low platforms.

I could see these easily being used in areas like Vancouver Island, Sarnia train, the Halifax commuter train being touted, Sudbury to White River etc. Possibly even new lines like Calgary to Edmonton, etc. I could see VIA using a fleet of these for services outside the Corridor.

Maybe VIA can buy them from Metrolinx when they convert the UPX to electric. I've heard Metrolinx wants to buy new trainsets rather than convert the DMUs to electric.

That'd be alright. Doing milk runs to smaller communities and whatnot. I had this template already made so for fun I thought I'd try Via's colour scheme.

 

[nfitz]

Well you hope for that. What you'll probably get is more like this:

 

[44 North]

Well you hope for that. What you'll probably get is more like this:

Haha, I'd love to ride something like that.

 

[steveintoronto]

Bear in mind that UPX only has 18 of the Sharyos, they are mechanically problematic, they are high platform, and the assembly line is torn down. The most likely candidate to buy them if they become available is SMART, but there's *still* no definitive date for Metrolinx to electrify the line allowing them to be replaced.

Just in discussion on exactly this point with a friend, and he writes:
[Are you sure that those train sets can be boarded by passengers from platforms which are essentially at track level? Building high-level platforms is dramatically easier if the operator also owns the ROW, as is the case with the UP Express (via Metrolinx), but not with VIA (at least not for any of the corridors you've mentioned). Also, keep in mind that VIA cannot acquire any new rolling stock without the approval and funding from its shareholder and that buying up a fleet which has been designed for a completely different client, region and service is not automatically a smart move, even if you manage to secure a deep discount from the initial price.]

UPDATE: Nippon Sharyo lays off 100 more workers in Illinois | Trains ...
trn.trains.com › News › News Wire
Jan 23, 2017 - 30, 2017, if Nippon Sharyo is unable to deliver on the contract. ... in Japan, and has also produced equipment for Sonoma-Marin Area Rail Transit ... previous layoffs in 2015 and 2016 to the bilevel cars' mechanical problems.
SMART | Systemic Failure
https://systemicfailure.wordpress.com/tag/smart/
Dec 30, 2016 - SMART blames its staffing problems on the high-cost of living. ... Indiana, and on September 14 met with Cummins, carbuilder Nippon Sharyo ...
SMART isn't in operation yet, but already has major engine problems ...
https://systemicfailure.wordpress.com/.../smart-isnt-in-operation-yet-but-already-has-...
Oct 15, 2016 - Back in 2009, SMART came up with a bonehead plan to use ... and on September 14 met with Cummins, carbuilder Nippon Sharyo and SCOA.
SMART train is on hold till 2017 - PressReader
https://www.pressreader.com/usa/san-francisco-chronicle-late.../282007556914774
Oct 15, 2016 - SMART train is on hold till 2017. Problems delay North Bay rail ... The manufacturer, Nippon Sharyo of Japan, will begin replacing the engines ...Cummins working with two companies over faulty engine reports
www.therepublic.com/.../cummins_working_with_two_companies_over_faulty_engine_...
Oct 21, 2016 - Cummins is working with two of its customers over engine problems ... supplied for the Sonoma Marin Area Retail Transit District (SMART) in California. ... with Cummins officials, train car builder Nippon Sharyo and Sumitomo.

If VIA were to buy something to replace their already overhauled RDCs, it wouldn't be the Sharyo DMUs.

Edit to Add: Here's the lesson to be learned and for Transport Canada to get off their zorry azzes and do as the FRA is in the US, the very agency TC states they need to copy, until it comes to modernizing regulations: (The US is well behind the rest of the world, but well ahead of Canada)

SMART isn’t in operation yet, but already has major engine problems
October 15, 2016 by Drunk Engineer

Back in 2009, SMART came up with a bonehead plan to use custom-design rolling stock — a decision heavily criticized in this blog. And here we are six years later, and they are still struggling to get something working:

On September 7, 2016, SMART was notified by SCOA [Sumitomo Corporation of America] that the failure was due to an underlying design flaw in the engine’s crankshaft. Responding to this news, SMART’s Vehicle Maintenance Superintendent, supported by LTK vehicle engineers, travelled to the Cummins Engine facility in Seymour, Indiana, and on September 14 met with Cummins, carbuilder Nippon Sharyo and SCOA. At the meeting it was agreed that the engines would be rebuilt with a new crankshaft designed for the life of the engine, as soon as possible.

So now all the engines will need to be scrapped, and the train design re-tested. The SMART staff is now (very optimistically I think) saying the line won’t open until at least Spring 2017. The previous opening date was supposed to be the end 2016 (which had already been pushed back 2 years due to other issues).

Remember: the whole rationale for using custom FRA-compliant rolling stock was that it would take “too long” to get regulatory approval for off-the-shelf European DMUs.

https://systemicfailure.wordpress.c...on-yet-but-already-has-major-engine-problems/

 

[ShonTron]

I think we're tired of hearing about Steve's high end machine. Keep it on topic, everyone, while I do a little pruning.