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TTC: Major Operational Issues (Various)

I would be interested to hear @smallspy 's take on measures that may mitigate some of the issues we've seen crop up on TTC the last few days.
Here goes.....

Icy rails, switch issues, snow accumulation, blowing snow.
All of these have been problematic, although to be honest the accumulation is the least so, although ends up causing the others....

First of all, there have been derailments at both Davisville and Wilson which have caused issues with getting equipment out into service. Derailment cleanup is even more hampered in the winter as there is a need to remove all of the snow from the affected area in order to properly inspect the location and to be able to affect whatever repairs are needed.

The Wilson one is particularly troublesome as the switches to/from the mainline at the south end of the yard have been problematic since their installation for the extension of service to Downsview. The north buildup (the access track built to Sheppard West several years ago) has helped this somewhat, but as designed and built it is impossible to get enough trains into service from it alone.

On top of that, the type of snow that we've gotten - coupled with the cold weather - has meant that it has been particularly prone to blowing. In normal circumstances this wouldn't be that big a deal, but when the accumulated snow reaches the bottom of the third rail it doesn't take long for it to cover it. This has been the problem with the open areas, particularly north of Eglinton West, north of Wilson, between Davisville and Eglinton and between Warden and Victoria Park.

Yes, the TTC has snow fighting equipment, and it does get used quite a bit, but these areas seem to be particularly troublesome.

We're not going to put all of Wilson Yard under a roof anytime soon; but are we utilizing heated switches on outside tracks? Do we have trains with plows on the front to remove excess snow from outdoor rails?
Heated switches? Yes, especially the most important mainline switches.

No, trains don't have plows but there are other ways to deal with that. The above-mentioned snow fighting equipment does good work of that when the accumulations get to be too much, but the easiest way is to simply run the service. A train every 5 minutes or so will go a long way to ensuring that the tracks stay clean and clear.

And in fact, that's what the TTC used to do. I don't know if they still do - I wonder if it was eliminated as a cost-cutting measure, or if it was felt that there was so much other work that needed to be done overnight that they've stopped doing it.

Another thing that they used to do when bad storms were forecast was to store trains in the tunnels between stations. They've done this on the YUS over the past several days, but that was out of necessity due to Wilson Yard being unavailable.

Do we (TTC) require or make use of third rail heaters?
No, but it should be something that they look into if they are not already. Certainly in the areas where blowing snow accumulation is the most troublesome.

Are there are any sensible ways short of roofing/walls to reduce blowing snow as an issue in yards?
I'm sure that there are some measures to help, such as such as the installation of windbreaks outside of and throughout the yard. They may only have a small effect, but several small effects can also add up to something greater.

Dan
 
ONDP promised to cover 50% of TTC operating cost.
This is such a terrible idea because of the long term consequences of having MPPs from everywhere in Ontario elected from whatever political party of the day taking control of the TTC.
Imagine some MPP from Haldimand in 2026 demanding the TTC cut service by 20%. This is literally what will happen in our current political environment.
Leave it directly to Toronto, and not to everyone outside of Toronto.
 
This is such a terrible idea because of the long term consequences of having MPPs from everywhere in Ontario elected from whatever political party of the day taking control of the TTC.
Imagine some MPP from Haldimand in 2026 demanding the TTC cut service by 20%. This is literally what will happen in our current political environment.
Leave it directly to Toronto, and not to everyone outside of Toronto.
No city can support their own transit systems without help from higher levels of govt.

Quebec subsidizes the STM. BC subsidizes Translink. Ontario subsidizes GO. They all have similar political dynamics vis a vis funding transit in economic centres vs other areas of province.

It's an interesting topic, and the FAO has studied it. http://fao-on.org/en/report/transit-subsidies-2024/
 
Go figure, the TTC still hasnt figured out to run trains properly during the winter months. No service from Woodbine to Kennedy so far this morning.

Side note, Line 1 has longer wait times still due to the Wilson Yard incident of a few days ago.

View attachment 631790
Go is also having issues, meanwhile every I know who drove to work was warm the whole way
 
No city can support their own transit systems without help from higher levels of govt.

Quebec subsidizes the STM. BC subsidizes Translink. Ontario subsidizes GO. They all have similar political dynamics vis a vis funding transit in economic centres vs other areas of province.

It's an interesting topic, and the FAO has studied it. http://fao-on.org/en/report/transit-subsidies-2024/

I hope you understand we have been through this scenario before, and its consequences were the Ontario elected government simply shut off the subsidy one day in 1997 and that was that.
This could totally happen again. The City actually did have to run it on their own. What you are saying no city could do, Toronto has literally been forced to do it.
 
I hope you understand we have been through this scenario before, and its consequences were the Ontario elected government simply shut off the subsidy one day in 1997 and that was that.
This could totally happen again. The City actually did have to run it on their own. What you are saying no city could do, Toronto has literally been forced to do it.
that's the problem, they are forced to do something they are not good at. to the extent every day people come to this forum to discuss the litany of issues across the system
 
To me it seems like you're conflating two different things. The TTC's snow response protocol, and to a larger degree all their management issues, don't really have anything to do with the city's subsidy of it and whether they are any good at it, apart from any concern about being able to afford potential equipment that could deal with the issues that crop up. I think that having a provincial subsidy would be beneficial (until you get another populist (unprintable) that asks why the rest of the province has to subsidize Toronto and cuts it), but it wouldn't help with their myriad operational issues.

Basically there is a lot of blame to go around.
 
that's the problem, they are forced to do something they are not good at. to the extent every day people come to this forum to discuss the litany of issues across the system
Are you talking about funding sources, or operational issues?
These are very different things being conflated here.

Back then in the 90's it was the fact the Province funded hundreds of millions to the TCC and then one day simply ghosted them and as a result there was a massive budget shortfall, not massive like $20 million as we talk about now, but $200 million, and the cuts to the service were extreme. A dozen whole routes were axed completely and service was dropped all over the city.

However, the current litany of issues people come here to discuss are generally not "service is suddenly cancelled" like before, it's that the system is run poorly without any care of the rider, and you could dump more money into this poorly run system but from experience that won't really make it any better. Structural change is needed at the CEO level down, and that has nothing to do with the amount Ontario government funding if it all goes into a giant sinkhole of "I don't care" from the top of the organisation.

We need stable funding, and the Ontario government of the 90's literally proved that their funding will not be stable to the extreme. It will change on the whim of whomever is the premier, so best do it ourselves and not let someone else decide.
 
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The funny thing is, she came to Toronto and did a splashy press conference to unveil her "Plan for Toronto" but their website only mentions their "Plan for SW Ontario and Niagara" and their "Plan for Northern Ontario". "We'll send your money to Toronto" is not good political messaging, even though it's actually Toronto subsidizing the rest of the province's public services and not vice versa.
 
Staging trains in the tunnel prevents overnight work, but at the cost of not having enough trains during the day, two or three days of missed maintenance is a small price to pay.

Also I think if they had run night trains through the open sections during the storm it would have mitigated these effects.

Basically comes down to lack of foresight and lack and total complacency.

Not sure how many diesel locomotives they have but they should have been ready to tow trains out of the yard.
 

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