TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

[Towered]

60 cars is better than nothing, also worth noting that it's 1/3rd of the money for 60 new cars. Presumably they're hoping the Province and Feds put in an additional 1/3rd each.

But as always, the city is just being reactive, not proactive. We need to be ordering way more cars than that if we are actually planning for the future.

Well of course. Those extra 60 should be on the road right now. By the time they arrive (which, knowing how things work around here, will be 2030 at the earliest), we'll probably need another 60 at minimum.

Also, in what universe does the TTC think Thug Ford can be convinced to spent money on streetcars?

 

[Voltz]

Isn't 60 cars all that can fit in existing yard space?

 

[TossYourJacket]

Isn't 60 cars all that can fit in existing yard space?

I believe so. The whole streetcar situation has been so badly mishandled for years it's going to take a ton of money to fix it. Which the city refuses to raise enough revenue to do, and which Ford will never give to the city.

 

[Towered]

60 cars is better than nothing, also worth noting that it's 1/3rd of the money for 60 new cars. Presumably they're hoping the Province and Feds put in an additional 1/3rd each.

But as always, the city is just being reactive, not proactive. We need to be ordering way more cars than that if we are actually planning for the future.

Well of course. Those extra 60 should be on the road right now. By the time they arrive (which, knowing how things work around here, will be 2030 at the earliest), we'll probably need another 60 at minimum.

Also, in what universe does the TTC think Thug Ford can be convinced to spent money on streetcars?

 

[bbdfollower]

Isn't 60 cars all that can fit in existing yard space?

In the report it mentions that they could fit the 60 additional streetcars within the existing yard space, but at 'crush load', which is not efficient, so they would need to still invest 85M to build out new storage tracking at Hillcrest.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Well of course. Those extra 60 should be on the road right now. By the time they arrive (which, knowing how things work around here, will be 2030 at the earliest), we'll probably need another 60 at minimum.

Also, in what universe does the TTC think Thug Ford can be convinced to spent money on streetcars?

According to the report, those 60 additional streetcars are needed immediately. Which means Bombardier.

That leaves another 40+ for the Portlands and other streetcar expansion. Which could be any manufacturer.

 

[Richard White]

According to the report, those 60 additional streetcars are needed immediately. Which means Bombardier.

That leaves another 40+ for the Portlands and other streetcar expansion. Which could be any manufacturer.

Hmm.. where is Metrowagonmash when you need them.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Queens Park needs to wake the hell up and show some leadership with regards to the growth of the City of Toronto and Downtown in particular. Their leadership has been totally absent. Nothing I’ve seen from either the Liberals or Conservatives give me any indication that either party gives half a damn about the issues this growth is imposing on the city.

 

[drum118]

According to the report, those 60 additional streetcars are needed immediately. Which means Bombardier.

That leaves another 40+ for the Portlands and other streetcar expansion. Which could be any manufacturer.

Forget Portland until 2040 as TTC wants to bus the area until the ridership is there for streetcars that is opposite to have High Order Transit there once the first 2 towers are built. Waterfront Toronto wants to tell people you don't need a car to live here when these towers are built. No extra streetcars for the QQE extension until 2030, if then considering it was to be in operation now.

What I said in 2005 and since then is now biting the ass of both TTC and the City now not only having more cars, but putting all your eggs in one basket that will be muss at the end going with one supplier. If TTC had gone with the 1:1 replacement as call for, we would be looking at another 48 cars by September this year. We would still need to order more cars as the 252 still wouldn't meet TTC needs today or down the road.

Just because it being recommended doesn't mean will see cars from BBD this year as BBD has to go back to its supplier change to see when they could start shipping parts. Then You got the issue of the frames to be made in Quebec who are current making frames for Metrolinx and Edmonton LRV's, with Metrolinx having a stronger clause for failing to meet delivery schedule and higher penalty cost for failing to meet the schedule. You also got TTC cars being ship there to have welds fix as well.

TTC needs to order 30 42 meter cars to be use on 501, 504 and 510 as part of the 60 car order?? Had to wait 23 minutes for an eastbound 501 at Dufferin St today around 11 am today and not the first long gap in service. Peak to crush load and well over TTC standards for ridership. Go off and the shelter time said car due and next car in 18 minutes. Think what it will be once the increase of headway takes place.

With merger talks going on and does happen, what may happen to TTC order. Do a fresh slate and tender the order of 60 that I have being calling for since 2014, with an option of 40+ regardless it will be a few years before we see someone else car.

Very concern on the low operational failure rate and what does it cover that not in BBD failure rate?

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

In the report it mentions that they could fit the 60 additional streetcars within the existing yard space, but at 'crush load', which is not efficient, so they would need to still invest 85M to build out new storage tracking at Hillcrest.

How often are all the streetcars in the yards? Ther are at least a few out during the night and the bulk of them during the day.

 

[jje1000]

So not just streetcars- a welcome change from the service status quo that we've been experiencing for awhile. Hopefully the city and Unifor can make a good case to the feds, if not the province.

Toronto’s transit agency has unveiled its pitch for about $4.2 billion in new city spending over the next 10 years to improve the backbone of the city’s subway system and buy hundreds of vehicles, including a new batch of streetcars, to meet growing ridership demand.

The plan, which is being backed by Mayor John Tory, increases the 2020-29 transit capital plan to $11.9 billion, but will require additional funding from other levels of government. Among the shortfalls, Wednesday’s plan calls for nearly 1,600 new buses, 80 subway trains and 60 new streetcars but earmarks city money for only one-third of these vehicles.

TTC wants to spend $4.2-billion to improve subway, buy new buses and streetcars

Derailment on Wednesday left riders attempting to cram onto shuttle buses

www.theglobeandmail.com

 

[drum118]

Well of course. Those extra 60 should be on the road right now. By the time they arrive (which, knowing how things work around here, will be 2030 at the earliest), we'll probably need another 60 at minimum.

Also, in what universe does the TTC think Thug Ford can be convinced to spent money on streetcars?

How can they be on the road now when 4603 hasn't been off loaded yet. 4563 would be the last car.

Can see the Fed's helping, but not Ford.

The City had to pickup 66% on the current order.

 

[drum118]

4601 is now tracking

 

[Towered]

Forget Portland until 2040 as TTC wants to bus the area until the ridership is there for streetcars that is opposite to have High Order Transit there once the first 2 towers are built. Waterfront Toronto wants to tell people you don't need a car to live here when these towers are built. No extra streetcars for the QQE extension until 2030, if then considering it was to be in operation now.

The streetcar extensions should be built in advance of the private development. That's how we used to build transit, and how many places still do. In Vienna they built a subway extension (elevated even) and a streetcar network extension to an empty field just a few years ago to support the creation of a massive new neighbourhood built from scratch.

 

[robmausser]

According to the report, those 60 additional streetcars are needed immediately. Which means Bombardier.

That leaves another 40+ for the Portlands and other streetcar expansion. Which could be any manufacturer.

They should be Bombardier regardless. While the situation was sour at first, they did almost meet the only deadline that the TTC actually imposed; the dec19th 2019 deadline, by a month. And all of the kinks have been worked out.

As much as people don't like the emotional cost of continuing to support someone that "slighted" you, its in the best interest.

Emotions aside, there are teething issues with ALL new rail projects. We incur the risk of having just as many issues with a different trainset than the Flexity for the new order.

We know this system, its been tested to work on our rails, its reasonably reliable. The kinks have all been worked out.

Lets stop acting like grumpy children who want to see the CEO's of Bombardier spanked on their bums, and do whats best for this city. Which is to order 60+ more of the proven technology we know works, and has already been tested to work on our streets.