TTC capital budget amendments (BD to East Mall study??)

[roch5220]

The only problem with East Mall is that it really isn't a destination.

I'm not in favor of any BD west extension because of $$$, however, it does make sense to built to Sherway.

Think about it this way, GO stations from Clarkson to Mimico have real parking issues, well, lack of parking. Having a huge underused during the day parking lot to act as west hub for both commutters who can park and ride is a huge benefit.

 

[doady]

Not necessarily. Private ROW along Hwy 427/West Mall could lead down to Sherway. Elimination of gridlock makes the reroute worthwhile.

No it doesn't.

 

[Degnaw]

I always thought they needed some LA-type freeway median LRT along the 427... it IS a pretty dense corridor.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

doady:

Relocating MT to East Mall makes no sense because there would be no connection to GO trains and buses.

Actually, I am curious to know what percentage of individuals who rode on MT use the Kipling GO. It would have made far more sense for most of them to use stations located in Sauga instead.

AoD

 

[doady]

Actually, I am curious to know what percentage of individuals who rode on MT use the Kipling GO. It would have made far more sense for most of them to use stations located in Sauga instead.

It is not the connection to the GO train that is important, it is that Kipling is supposed to be regional transit terminal. TTC subway and buses, MT buses, and GO train and buses all in one place for integrated transit.

 

[dashingdan]

If Sherway were to expand, I'm not 100% sure they WOULD add a store in there. There's already a lot of H&Ms in the West end. Close to Sherway are Yorkdale and Dufferin Mall, and in Mississauga there's Square One and Erin Mills, Brampton has Bramalea, and Oakville has Oakville Place. That's 6 other H&M stores in close proximity.

That said, chances are they would, just due to the demographics of the mall.

 

[adma]

None of those other outlets are particularly *close* close--you might as well argue that Sherway at large ought to shut down.

But again, it makes sense given the mall demographics--Sherway's definitely on that H&M-compat "fashion centre" trajectory, whereas today's version of the more mass-markety 80s fare has been relegated to the surrounding box developments (and the spirit of 70s Sherway--y'know, back when megamalls had a Loblaws and Dominion as well--has been shunted off to Dixie)

 

[roch5220]

That's 6 other H&M stores in close proximity.

Count, how many La Senzas are their in the PATH network?

I count 4, and another one in Eaton Centre. Its all about Traffic.

 

[socialwoe]

That said, chances are they would, just due to the demographics of the mall.

There'd be plenty of room for expansion towards the northwest side where the station would likely be located. Everywhere from the big-box stores on North Queen to the office buildings on Evans/West Mall could be intervenously linked. The biggest sell for the Sherway extension is the location, a relocated MT terminal would be no more out of the way from Bloor than the time regained from avoiding gridlock further north. Hwy 427 and the QEW only increase it's potential usefulness. Kiss 'n' Ride parking spaces alone would take 000s of cars off Toronto streets but add in RT to the airport/Woodbine/Humber College and the ridership would be limitless up there with Finch, Union, B&Y and St. Geogre .

 

[doady]

The biggest sell for the Sherway extension is the location, a relocated MT terminal would be no more out of the way from Bloor than the time regained from avoiding gridlock further north.

Avoiding gridlock (if it even exists in the first place) is a simple matter of using and enforcing the HOV lanes that already exist on Dundas. An MT terminal at Sherway is stupid idea that would not only make all the bus rides longer, but also the subway ride longer too.

 

[socialwoe]

Avoiding gridlock (if it even exists in the first place) is a simple matter of using and enforcing the HOV lanes that already exist on Dundas. An MT terminal at Sherway is stupid idea that would not only make all the bus rides longer, but also the subway ride longer too.

Have you rode on a bus during rush hour? It takes upwards of 30 mins just to get from Mill Rd to Islington Stn. The routes I normally take (3 Bloor, 26 Burnhamthrope) are so padantically long I feel like ripping my hair out everytime it stops. Once it took 3 hours for me to get from downtown to MCC. Routes like Dixie or the West Mall see such minimal traffic south of Dundas it'd be a no-brainer to expand the width a bit and reroute several buses.

Sherway, much like STC or Fairview is a superlative end-route for a subway line, nowhere in the Six-Points area is there enough vacant land to support a new terminal let alone one that combines the QEW, Brown's Line/427, Queensway transit, housing and amenities (hospital, mall, offices) on site. Only favorable transit options can pull Six-Points out of it's dilapadated state and forcing people to walk in a half-km from a bridge to access Dundas or Cloverdale is not the answer.

Finally I thought the goal of MT riders was to get onto the subway quickly. Subways transport larger amounts of people in a nano-fraction of the time a regular service bus trapped in bumper-bumper traffic would, who cares if the ride's longer.
How is getting the systems closer together even via a less than 5 min add-on to get from Kipling to Sherway a bad thing? The no. of people who use on-street MT within Toronto is very slim and would be far better off using 111, 112, 48, 49, 50.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

"Having a huge underused during the day parking lot to act as west hub for both commutters who can park and ride is a huge benefit."

I don't think Sherway would appreciate 3000 or 4000 people leaving their cars there all day without shopping. They'd build a parking structure like Fairview.

 

[drum118]

How is getting the systems closer together even via a less than 5 min add-on to get from Kipling to Sherway a bad thing? The no. of people who use on-street MT within Toronto is very slim and would be far better off using 111, 112, 48, 49, 50.

You should ride MT 3 on TTC 49 and MT 26/20 on TTC 50 to see how many people get on/off along TTC routes.

All 3 MT routes can offer better service than TTC can now. MT needs to upgrade these routes, but the infighting is causing problems for MT riders with poor service.

Business case see TTC walking away from #50 with $1.2 million in operating saving cost and have 3 buses that can be use else where when MT takes over this routes. TTC riders would see no different using MT in place of TTC other than better service both at peak and off peak compare to what they see today.

Running #26 and #20 to Kipling will add 5 minutes to MT riders travel time at best time. At peak time, it will be higher and depends on what is taking place on 427 in the first place.

Running all MT to Sherway is off the wall and defeat the idea of transit that service riders. It is a waste of riders times as well resources.

Even if a subway was built to East Mall, you still need to run MT #20/26 to Islington along Burnhamthorpe Rd as it has the shortest traveling time route. 1/1c carry a large number of riders (some where around 400) who work around the Islington Station area. Numbers come from TTC.

As for traveling time, I know this for a fact as I have time study this area. Even #206 should run along the full length of Burnhamthorpe and picking up TTC riders at East and West Mall.

How many cars use Dundas and Burnhamthorpe that come from 905 compare to transit? It is easy to get rid of transit than traffic. Then how many are 416?

All 3 TTC routes need to be merge with MT to provide a seamless service for riders.

Then there are no less than 7 routes going into York that should be done the same way.

It a waste of money to build the plan new terminal at Kipling as there is no room for anyone to expand 10-15 years from now. It better to spent good money building a new Cloverdale terminal to support MT, TTC, GO and BT as well support the new housing development plan for this area.

Sad point, this extension ranks #4 at best for any expansion where is should be #2 after SRT conversion to subway.

The point you should ask yourself, are you prepared to spent an extra of 10 to 30 minutes a day of travel time for another white elephant at Sherway? If you have to do this every day, you would change your tune.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

If the subway's extended and some kind of basic fare integration scheme was worked up, MT buses should just run straight to whichever subway stop's closest/easiest to get to.

 

[drum118]

If the subway's extended and some kind of basic fare integration scheme was worked up, MT buses should just run straight to whichever subway stop's closest/easiest to get to.

MT 3 to Kipling is the closest/easiest.

MT 20, 26 and 206 to Islington closest/easiest going to it. Leaving it as is is further and hardier. If MT operates like TTC 50, will be closest/easiest.

1 or 1C to Islington just to service the workers in this area.

The shortest route for all other routes is to Islington along Burnhamthorpe. Going to Cloverdale, it will be a saw off. Going to Kipling will add time going to it, but will be 2.35 minute shorter going the other way along Dundas.