Transit City Plan

[Dan416]

What they can do is push Eglinton back a few years and finish Sheppard and replacing the SRT first, since the SRT must be replaced NOW. After that they can get started on Eglinton. Easy-peasy.

 

[nfitz]

What they can do is push Eglinton back a few years and finish Sheppard and replacing the SRT first, since the SRT must be replaced NOW. After that they can get started on Eglinton. Easy-peasy.

A wise man once said that transit delayed is transit denied.

Besides, how would they spend the big money that is budgeted between now and 2015, as it would take 3 years or so to do the EA and design for either a Sheppard or Danforth extension ... yet Eglinton and the Sheppard East LRT are shovel ready.

Bottom line is I don't see how you kill the tunnelled section of the Eglinton LRT - even ignoring how difficult it would be to get the swing votes in City Council to kill it.

 

[GenerationW]

It wasn't visionary since it had come up before as a solution to overcrowding. It was however based deeply in reality. The reality that an extension of the Yonge line clearly adds new riders to an over-capacity route.

It was an extremely realistic reaction, but it was still a reaction to York Region rather than what it should have been -- a Toronto initiative.

If Miller was pushing hard for a Sheppard extension he must have realized something to change directions. The end result is that he came up with a plan based on reality in terms of transit needs across the city, the budget that would be available to build it over the next 10-15 years, and the capacity that would be required.

He didn't come up with anything, Giambrone did, and talked Miller into it. And now Miller's silence is deafening.

 

[jje1000]

Transit plan moving ahead on both sides
04 January 2011 05:58

Andrew Wallace/torstar news service file

Talks between the TTC and the province’s agency are proving fruitful enough that a compromise transit plan for Toronto should be ready by the end of January, both sides say.

And despite fears that Mayor Rob Ford’s focus on getting a subway into Scarborough will kill light-rail-based Transit City, signs point to a hybrid plan with at least the Eglinton crosstown LRT surviving, and Toronto paying a premium on the provincially-funded expansion to get more of it underground and away from road traffic.

“It’s premature to say we’ve arrived at a plan but we’re working toward that,” said TTC chair Karen Stintz.

Metrolinx CEO Bruce McCuaig made it clear the province remains committed to the Eglinton crosstown line, a cornerstone of the $8.15-billion Transit City plan that also includes Finch and Sheppard LRT lines and revitalization of the aging Scarborough RT.

Premier Dalton McGuinty and Metrolinx have told the city “it can be done,” Ford said last month.

http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/local/article/733615--transit-plan-moving-ahead-on-both-sides


Not the most legitimate or insightful piece of news, but it basically almost confirms that we'll be getting two lines out of the six-ish originally proposed.

As for Sheppard, we'll see if Ford goes with a separated LRT subway or a full-on subway. Either way, it means that if Ford's plans come to fruition, the central part of Eglinton should be the first to start as the rest of the plans will need to be reworked.

 

[MetroMan]

It's not a total disaster. We were going to get a city wide transit network appropriate for anticipated demand. Now we'll get an Eglinton line with more underground rail -- still excellent news. However, this has gone from a plan that addressed transit needs but also delivered a solution to social problems, to just a transit plan. That's good enough, I guess.

 

[GenerationW]

I'm not buying it. With Ottawa's funding dictating that something has to be built on Sheppard, and the need to replace the SRT soon (or so we're told), I can't see Ford making Eglinton his main or even secondary priority.

 

[jje1000]

It's not a plan. It's pandering. A transit plan should be all-encompassing, and should address all forms of transit all over the city.


Ford here has simply taken a chunk of a previous transit plan and claimed it as his own. He has not told us how public transit will improve for the rest of the suburbs. He hasn't told us how exactly he'll speed up commute times for drivers. He hasn't even addressed pedestrians or bicyclists.

 

[Voltz]

The part about Toronto having to pay a premium to upgrade to subways is a good sign, it means that Ford's plan is more likely to be shot down by council.

 

[MetroMan]

We haven't seen the full and final re-worked plan. Eglinton + Sheppard still doesn't address the cancelled contracts on the LRT buy.

It seems that McGuinty is telling Ford: you want to change the plan, you pay for the changes. It's fair and Ford has to put his (our) money where his mouth is... If he can't find the cash, then he has to shut up and let Transit City go ahead as planned. Toronto is getting this for free, if Ford wants to play he has to pay.

 

[superman]

Transit plan moving ahead on both sides
04 January 2011 05:58

Andrew Wallace/torstar news service file

Talks between the TTC and the province’s agency are proving fruitful enough that a compromise transit plan for Toronto should be ready by the end of January, both sides say.

And despite fears that Mayor Rob Ford’s focus on getting a subway into Scarborough will kill light-rail-based Transit City, signs point to a hybrid plan with at least the Eglinton crosstown LRT surviving, and Toronto paying a premium on the provincially-funded expansion to get more of it underground and away from road traffic.

“It’s premature to say we’ve arrived at a plan but we’re working toward that,†said TTC chair Karen Stintz.

Metrolinx CEO Bruce McCuaig made it clear the province remains committed to the Eglinton crosstown line, a cornerstone of the $8.15-billion Transit City plan that also includes Finch and Sheppard LRT lines and revitalization of the aging Scarborough RT.

Premier Dalton McGuinty and Metrolinx have told the city “it can be done,†Ford said last month.

http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/local/article/733615--transit-plan-moving-ahead-on-both-sides


Not the most legitimate or insightful piece of news, but it basically almost confirms that we'll be getting two lines out of the six-ish originally proposed.

As for Sheppard, we'll see if Ford goes with a separated LRT subway or a full-on subway. Either way, it means that if Ford's plans come to fruition, the central part of Eglinton should be the first to start as the rest of the plans will need to be reworked.

Looks like the plan will include:
- SRT conversion and extension (don't see that dying as the useful life comes to an end)
- Some kind of grade separated Sheppard line
- Eglinton line with somewhat more grade separation

This only at the expense of the Finch line...

I think this is a pretty good compromise... Provides higher order transit, but not just limited to a few km of subway - and also using Eglinton's case showing that LRT can work in Toronto (and for the pro-LRT people, show that there is future possibilities with Jane and Don Mills)

I think if we're keeping score on what we're trading off for, we're losing 1 at-grade LRT line for 3 new higher-order LRT lines than we would have gotten under Transit City.

As for Jane and Don Mills, it didn't seem likely it was going to happen in the next decade or anything, plus it wasn't funded, so I don't think we're really losing those - a future LRT friendly mayor will be here to push it a decade from now.

 

[jeffreym]

Phew. At least we don't lose anything important. Unless you live along Finch or commute along it. Ah well, who cares. As long as we can get to STC a touch faster! As long as you live near one of the six new stations of course. Otherwise you'd be rather screwed since there probably won't be much bus service left. Oh well.

 

[nfitz]

As long as we can get to STC a touch faster! As long as you live near one of the six new stations of course.

Or don't live/work near the 4 or 5 existing stations we will be getting rid of ...

 

[Solid Snake]

signs point to a hybrid plan with at least the Eglinton Crosstown LRT surviving, and Toronto paying a premium on the provincially funded expansion to get more of it underground and otherwise away from road traffic.

That's good news. Hopefully it will be at least from Jane to Don Mills.

Eleven kilometres of the line are to be underground, he added, so “it actually reflects the mayors’ interest as well in terms of getting transit off of roads and underground.”

Like I said earlier, something had to give and it would have been hard to justify his opposition to this project.

Ford has said his top priority is extending the Sheppard subway with more subway, not an LRT, to connect it to Scarborough Town Centre, and he’s willing to put all other transit projects on hold to accomplish it.
Premier Dalton McGuinty and Metrolinx have told the city “it can be done,” Ford said last month

SELRT is dead. Coming from the premier's mouth, Sheppard subway will happen...

From my point of view that's a win-win situation here. Eglinton will happen and Sheppard. Combined with the Spadina extension, Toronto could have close to 100 KM of Rapid Transit.

 

[taal]

That's good news. Hopefully it will be at least from Jane to Don Mills.



Like I said earlier, something had to give and it would have been hard to justify his opposition to this project.



SELRT is dead. Coming from the premier's mouth, Sheppard subway will happen...

From my point of view that's a win-win situation here. Eglinton will happen and Sheppard. Combined with the Spadina extension, Toronto could have close to 100 KM of Rapid Transit.

I really wouldn't jump to that conclusion quite yet as ..... it doesn't make any sense ...

Not in the sense it's a bad idea, simply that there's absolutely no way there is money for that whatsoever. You can't build sheppard east 100% as a subway (not even sure if the extension to the university line would fit) and on top of that Eglinton. I don't even think there's enough money for Sheppard as planned even with the cancellation of Eglinton.

Something doesn't add up yet - it may be something along the lines that the city needs to fund Eglinton on it's own and you can rest assured Ford will not be fitting that bill anytime soon.

So put another way - we'll indeed have both Eglinton and Sheppard - but it'd be like Sheppard now (next 5-10 years) and Eglinton planed for the far out future (along with the DRL and the Yonge extension).

I just don't see how it'll add up any other way. Heck even if sheppard stays an LRT - but underground (which would be fine in Ford's book - he probably would have no idea what the difference was anyway) - although that implies a transfer is needed at Don Mills - I still don't think there's enough money for both (not by a long shot I'd guess).

Something has to give.

 

[GraphicMatt]

I'm thinking B-D to STC, a very short Sheppard subway extension (to VP?) and the Eglinton LRT entirely as planned, except maybe with some small alterations (Richview corridor or whatever).