Toronto Yonge Sheppard Centre Renovations and Expansion | 123.13m | 35s | RioCan | BDP Quadrangle

Amare said:
There are only 2 things that would really help NYCC: One is when the downtown core proper finally caps out of available office space (which wont be happening anytime in the near future) or the second is when Toronto transit finally completely bursts from it seams and cant handle the immense load of commuters coming into the downtown core. The 2nd scenario is much more likely to happen first before the 1st.

Currently, firms are flocking to the downtown core and the only thing that would even give them a second thought is if they see that their employees are unable to commute to get into work. Only then would they start considering secondary nodes like Midtown and NYCC.
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Problem is that NYCC will be even more difficult to commute to work on.

at the end of the day most peak period travel capacity growth over the next little while will come in the form of GO expansion - which services downtown. The DRL seems to (finally) be the next project on the docket as well, which also increases downtown transit access significantly.

At the end of the day downtown is so attractive for employers as it is the only place in the GTA that is accessible to 100% of the metro's labour pool. If you locate your office at NYCC you are restricting employee access to Toronto, York, eastern Durham, and western Peel. A lot of the GTA is too far and difficult of a commute to access it. If you locate in downtown, employees can come from Hamilton or Barrie or Bowmanville - the entire GTA is accessible within an hour or so.

One thing that may help is the Yonge north subway extension. It will improve transit access to the area, opening up a bit of a larger employment pool and hopefully marginally improving the attractiveness of it for companies.
 
^I couldnt agree more with all that. In general, one would think that a Yonge North subway extension would help kick start some office growth but i dont think even that would help much as long as the core remains as attractive as it is. As odd as it sounds, I think a Sheppard subway extending through to STC would be much more of a catalyst to growth for both NYCC and STC as it would open up a whole new employment pool. However that's just beating a dead issue at this point.

There is so much potential for NYCC, it's just unfortunate and frustrating that it hasnt been reached.
 
I think NYCC has potential but it's a few decades from now ... and by then any remaining sites for viable office development will be gone ...

As you all point out, there is huge demand for being downtown for various reasons that have been discussed to death ...


But of course some firms don't see the large premium (office space rent) worthwhile for various reasons ... then in addition, there are already some established nodes in a given industry (e.g. big-tech in Markham ... I use "big" here to denote, typically, large american tech companies (e.g. IBM / ...) where there are already plenty of workers who live in the area).

So this leaves NYCC (and to a certain degree Yonge and Eglinton / St. Clair) in the middle ground ... rents are still quite costly (less downtown) but more than Markham / VCC / ...

The other big element is my earlier point, most of the companies that have located in NYCC in the past (finance / media / ...) also locate downtown i.e. it's fairly natural for them to want to locate downtown.


I haven't seen recent figures yet but I expect increasing vacancy rates in NYCC, there are a handful of firms that have (or are in the process) of relocating downtown.



Best bet for landlords is to reduce rent, and try to market to different industries
 
innsertnamehere said:
Problem is that NYCC will be even more difficult to commute to work on.

at the end of the day most peak period travel capacity growth over the next little while will come in the form of GO expansion - which services downtown. The DRL seems to (finally) be the next project on the docket as well, which also increases downtown transit access significantly.

At the end of the day downtown is so attractive for employers as it is the only place in the GTA that is accessible to 100% of the metro's labour pool. If you locate your office at NYCC you are restricting employee access to Toronto, York, eastern Durham, and western Peel. A lot of the GTA is too far and difficult of a commute to access it. If you locate in downtown, employees can come from Hamilton or Barrie or Bowmanville - the entire GTA is accessible within an hour or so.

One thing that may help is the Yonge north subway extension. It will improve transit access to the area, opening up a bit of a larger employment pool and hopefully marginally improving the attractiveness of it for companies.
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The only thing NYCC has is the 401, and that is not a reliable route. Sheppard is too short, and Yonge trains end at Finch. Now had that GO ALRT been built, NYCC would have similar advantage as downtown, commute-wise.
 
11th said:
The only thing NYCC has is the 401, and that is not a reliable route. Sheppard is too short, and Yonge trains end at Finch. Now had that GO ALRT been built, NYCC would have similar advantage as downtown, commute-wise.
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Agreeing with 11th,...

182236

GO-ing "Back To The Future" - in 1980's Premier Davis PC Government proposed GO ALRT (Government of Ontario - Advanced Light Rail Transit) - enlarged version of UTDC vehicles used on Scarborough RT system but with:
- better electric motors producing top speed of 120km/h (70km/hr average) - competitive to highway travel time!
- pantograph overhead wire system instead of troublesome 3rd track as on Scarborough RT
- clean electric power VS today's diesel burning GO trains
- using "Off-The-Rack" standard gauge tracks (NOT stupid "Custom-Tailored" TTC gauge)
- articulated (accordion) connection between cars (now on new subway, new streetcars & elongated buses)
- utilize platform barriers (TTC still don't have!)
- utilize Automatic Train Control (again, TTC still don't have (late & overbudget),...35 years later)
- can operate with 2 minutes between trains (like subway) VS 20 minute between GO trains now
- Southern east-west line utilize rail corridor like today's GO train routes
- Northern east-west line through Hydro Corridor from Pickering to Oakville (mainly on ground but elevated over intersecting roadways) right through Willowdale's Finch
182234

Hydro Corridor! Allowing more office workers to access Willowdale as easy as Union Station downtown! More office towers would have been built in North York Centre Secondary Plan area instead of Vertical Sleeping Community (60+ condo tower VS 1 office tower in last 20 years)

While following short-term (4-month) Premier Miller PC government shelved GO-ALRT & its Northern route through North York Centre around 1985. Premier Peterson Liberal government killed GO-ALRT & Northern route by favouring the huge bi-level trains system you see today (basically, Office development in North York pipeline continue until Nestle Canada building phase 1 completed in 1994, then dried up,...).

https://www.blogto.com/city/2014/07/that_time_go_transit_almost_went_electric/
NOTE: Ontario government's UTDC was sold to Lavalin in 1986 then returned and sold to Bombardier in 1991 then sold to SNC, now part of SNC-Lavalin
en.wikipedia.org

Urban Transportation Development Corporation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
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It would look much better with only the lower signage for Sweet Jesus and Blaze Pizza. Repeating the sign 2 feet away is redundant and clutters the facade.
 
isaidso said:
It would look much better with only the lower signage for Sweet Jesus and Blaze Pizza. Repeating the sign 2 feet away is redundant and clutters the facade.
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It would also be great if you could get into Blaze from the mall. Not sure about the other places, but I think both Five Guys and Blaze are only accessible from outside. I had high hopes for the reno and refresh of this mall, but it seems there is very little to draw people in, and even less to make them stay for a while.
 
isaidso said:
It would look much better with only the lower signage for Sweet Jesus and Blaze Pizza. Repeating the sign 2 feet away is redundant and clutters the facade.
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The signs are facing different directions, and are intended for different viewers. The upper sign is meant to be seen from the street and across Yonge. The lower sign is meant for people already on the east side of Yonge, who might not be able to see the upper sign, such as those coming out of the Yonge-Sheppard Centre.
 
NorthYorkEd said:
It would also be great if you could get into Blaze from the mall. Not sure about the other places, but I think both Five Guys and Blaze are only accessible from outside. I had high hopes for the reno and refresh of this mall, but it seems there is very little to draw people in, and even less to make them stay for a while.
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I work at Flock and I'm making the move to the new Sheppard location. I was talking to a guy from corporate the other day and he was mentioning that the new location will have a mall entrance, one of the only restaurants on that stretch that will if I'm not mistaken. Also, they're applying for an LLBO and are opening up on the 27th of May.
 
Mansker said:
The signs are facing different directions, and are intended for different viewers. The upper sign is meant to be seen from the street and across Yonge. The lower sign is meant for people already on the east side of Yonge, who might not be able to see the upper sign, such as those coming out of the Yonge-Sheppard Centre.
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I'm aware of that but it looks terrible.
 
Mansker said:
The signs are facing different directions, and are intended for different viewers. The upper sign is meant to be seen from the street and across Yonge. The lower sign is meant for people already on the east side of Yonge, who might not be able to see the upper sign, such as those coming out of the Yonge-Sheppard Centre.
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Perhaps they're trying to avoid design mistakes made by the Eaton Centre. Mall access kills the street. I'd rather have a dead mall than a dead street. Can they not reconfigure the mall so that there's another store that's mall facing? It's the only way to have a decent end result for both.
 
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