Toronto Municipal Election 2018: Mayor’s Race

[Midtown Urbanist]

I attended a Keesmaat talk today.

She said in response to a question that her 100,000 units of affordable housing is for the middle class.

That was quite a surprise. I don't think she misspoke either. I think she revealed how she is going to weasel her way out of her election promise if elected.

 

[SunriseChampion]

I attended a Keesmaat talk today.

She said in response to a question that her 100,000 units of affordable housing is for the middle class.

That was quite a surprise. I don't think she misspoke either. I think she revealed how she is going to weasel her way out of her election promise if elected.

Nice one. She's going to build me housing of decent size that doesn't cost a whole paycheque every month? Am I actually going to vote for her?

Too bad the numbers are still silly and delusional.

Wasn't her plan, all along, to have affordable housing built, not specifically for any specific wealth cohort?

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

Wasn't her plan, all along, to have affordable housing built, not specifically for any specific wealth cohort?

Indeed, she has never actually clarified affordable for whom.

I don't have a problem with it. The housing needs of the middle 60-70% of the populace is important too. But, a lot of the discussion and energy surrounding affordable housing from the left is referring to housing for lower income households.

 

[steveintoronto]

Wasn't her plan, all along, to have affordable housing built, not specifically for any specific wealth cohort?

Indeed. "Affordable" doesn't preclude anyone save those that still can't afford it, which will still be many. The figure she's using is "80%" of the regular price. I'll link and reference that later, I was reading extensively on it yesterday and today. And it is with private developers, but on land that the city and ostensibly province are holding, but not using.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Indeed, she has never actually clarified affordable for whom.

I don't have a problem with it. The housing needs of the middle 60-70% of the populace is important too. But, a lot of the discussion and energy surrounding affordable housing from the left is referring to housing for lower income households.

Poor people at least have the option (as shitty as it is) of getting subsidised housing. I have the option of moving to Guelph and commuting.

 

[steveintoronto]

But, a lot of the discussion and energy surrounding affordable housing from the left is referring to housing for lower income households.

How does that render her words weasel?

I think she revealed how she is going to weasel her way out of her election promise if elected.

I suggest you quote what you consider to be "weasel words".

You just don't like her, admit it. You were the one complaining about Matlow denying housing for (gist) 'people like me'. For the lowest income, the need is *rental housing*, something Keesmaat has addressed. I'll quote and link later.

Added as indicated above:

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/sta...een-torontos-two-main-mayoral-candidates.html

 

[steveintoronto]

Poor people at least have the option (as shitty as it is) of getting subsidised housing. I have the option of moving to Guelph and commuting.

lol...Guelph is a tighter rental market than Toronto! I returned after five years there as almost all affordable rent was basement apartments. And most of that was awful. I ended up crashing in my workshop/studio for years.

The UoG completely skews the rental availability. I was there just a few days back visiting...wait for it, developer and builder friends. And house prices are equal to Toronto ones now.

 

[SunriseChampion]

Indeed. "Affordable" doesn't preclude anyone save those that still can't afford it, which will still be many. The figure she's using is "80%" of the regular price. I'll link and reference that later, I was reading extensively on it yesterday and today. And it is with private developers, but on land that the city and ostensibly province are holding, but not using.

True word.

I could afford that.

I mean, I can afford things now, but like how much of my income am I supposed to be spending on a poorly renovated flat with a dodgy hot water situation?

 

[SunriseChampion]

lol...Guelph is a tighter rental market than Toronto! I returned after five years there as almost all affordable rent was basement apartments. And most of that was awful. I ended up crashing in my workshop/studio for years.

The UoG completely skews the rental availability. I was there just a few days back visiting...wait for it, developer and builder friends. And house prices are equal to Toronto ones now.

Halifax then. I don't know.

My options have become more and more limited. I can't afford condo rentals within 10km of downtown. I can't afford anything downtown. I can't afford a full 1-bed in Parkdale even, unless it's in a dodgy block.
Shitty 1-beds in Ajax are going for up to 1600 now.

I could commute 3 hours a day again like when I lived in Pickering, but then I may as well quit my job and go be the bum I was always meant to be. Ski all winter, climb all summer. Sit on a beach, drinking rum and writing.

Keesmaat, save me! ...or tell me stories about how you're going to save me.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

How does that render her words weasel?
I suggest you quote what you consider to be "weasel words".

You just don't like her, admit it. You were the one complaining about Matlow denying housing for (gist) 'people like me'. For the lowest income, the need is *rental housing*, something Keesmaat has addressed. I'll quote and link later.

Added as indicated above:
View attachment 158008
https://www.thestar.com/opinion/sta...een-torontos-two-main-mayoral-candidates.html

You need to stop making assumptions about people.

Weasel is used in the same way as you would for any politician making election promises that will be difficult to keep. I don't make exceptions for Keesmaat just because she is 'fine' or whatever other lewd comments that some people have suggested in this thread and elsewhere.

 

[steveintoronto]

Guelph is doing what Keesmaat is proposing though. I had linked and discussed it prior, but here it is again: (there's new stories on this, the project is going ahead, albeit the MoE requires 'building on slab' due to the metal contaminants, something I studied while in Guelph. The MoE has a 'short' timeline to expedite the use of brownfields for resuse, sometimes requiring no residential first floor, no basement and special requirements for the land adjacent if children will be playing there.

This is something Keesmaat would know the details of, and something I'll supply from records if challenged.
https://www.guelphtoday.com/local-n...e-shovels-in-the-ground-in-three-years-821349

 

[steveintoronto]

You need to stop making assumptions about people.

lol...you mean as you're doing about Keesmaat? You need to start supplying links or references for your claims.

Keesmaat is far from perfect, but she just might be the best bet we have for progressive change. If you think she's making "weasel words" then quote them.

wea·sel words
noun

1. words or statements that are intentionally ambiguous or misleading.

[...]
In her first official platform announcement since entering the mayoral race, Jennifer Keesmaat said Tuesday that the city needs to be more bold when it comes to the issue and pledged to have more “high quality” affordable housing built within the next 10 years.

“That’s high quality housing for young people, for families, also for seniors, for the people over the course of their entire lifetime,” Keesmaat said at the Charles Hastings Co-op on Elm Street.

Keesmaat said her plan would also see more city-owned lands unlocked for affordable housing, and the use of federal funds to keep those rentals affordable.

She said nearly half of all Torontonians are renters, and questioned whether housing has improved under during the tenure of Mayor John Tory.

“In the last four years under John Tory, has housing affordability gotten better for you and your family or has it gotten worse?” Keesmaat questioned.

In a release, her campaign team pointed out that an estimated 250,000 Torontonians can barely make their monthly rent. Also, almost half are spending more than 30 per cent of their household income on rent. [...]

https://toronto.citynews.ca/2018/08/07/keesmaat-affordable-housing-platform/

I don't make exceptions for Keesmaat just because she is 'fine' or whatever other lewd comments that some people have suggested in this thread and elsewhere.

Apparently there's some language difficulties at play....Just produce quotes.

Here's the definition for "Affordable Housing" from CMHC:

What is affordable housing?
In Canada, housing is considered “affordable” if it costs less than 30% of a household’s before-tax income. Many people think the term “affordable housing” refers only to rental housing that is subsidized by the government. In reality, it’s a very broad term that can include housing provided by the private, public and non-profit sectors. It also includes all forms of housing tenure : rental, ownership and co-operative ownership, as well as temporary and permanent housing.

And further to above:

Investment in Affordable Housing program
The Investment in Affordable Housing (IAH) began in 2011. Under the IAH, the federal government is investing over $238 million annually, through March 2019, to help Canadians in housing need.

Under bilateral agreements with CMHC, the provinces and territories match the federal investments with contributions of their own. As housing needs vary across Canada, the provinces and territories are responsible for deciding how best to use that funding. They have the flexibility to invest in a range of affordable housing programs and to choose how they’re delivered. [...]

https://www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/deve...nformation/about-affordable-housing-in-canada

 

[Videodrome]

Do you think that poll with Goldy getting 6% was an outlier or accurate information regarding voter intention?

 

[steveintoronto]

Do you think that poll with Goldy getting 6% was an outlier or accurate information regarding voter intention?

It's a good question, because the next question is going to be: "Now that Ford has embraced Goldy, will her poll numbers increase, and Tory's drop?"

Doug Ford and Faith Goldy — what’s wrong with this picture?
By MARTIN REGG COHNOntario Politics Columnist
Mon., Sept. 24, 2018
https://www.thestar.com/politics/political-opinion/2018/09/24/whats-wrong-with-this-picture.html

 

[jje1000]

Do you think that poll with Goldy getting 6% was an outlier or accurate information regarding voter intention?

I think the 'Shy Conservative' effect might be at play here- the real numbers could be downplayed, as people don't want to publicly admit they support someone as radical as Goldy. Also considering that Ford has not renounced his ties with Goldy, I wouldn't be surprised if he quietly throws his support behind her over an 'elitist' like Tory (though I doubt he would mind having Tory to push around).

Also interesting that Tory seems to be avoiding all one-on-one debates with Keesmaat:

Tory to miss transit activists’ debate to attend cocktail fundraiser

Toronto Mayor John Tory plans to opt out of a municipal election debate organized by a transit-advocacy group this week and instead attend a campaign cocktail fundraiser at a private golf club – amid tensions over just who should be invited to debate whom.

That event was designed so that Mr. Tory would face off with former chief planner Jennifer Keesmaat, his leading rival, in a one-on-one contest. Its moderator is Globe and Mail columnist Marcus Gee.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/can...tivists-debate-to-attend-cocktail-fundraiser/