Hamilton Hamilton Line B LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx

Zuh? Hamilton doesn't even seem to want Rapid Transit, and they get the cheque - Waterloo Region would happily take it for Stage II funding!

I couldn't actually find any specific mention of pushing through funding for the Hamilton LRT on Del Duca's twitter feed - where did you see that?
 
This is where Metrolinx lack of leadership really shines through. Instead of listening to the confused politicians over at Hamilton's City Hall, they should just take the lead and tell them what form of transit they will receive. Hamilton is incapable of making realistic decisions when it comes to transit, and since the province already has an idea of what they want to see they should have just told the city what they want to see happen with the money the are giving them
 
Amare said:
This is where Metrolinx lack of leadership really shines through. Instead of listening to the confused politicians over at Hamilton's City Hall, they should just take the lead and tell them what form of transit they will receive. Hamilton is incapable of making realistic decisions when it comes to transit, and since the province already has an idea of what they want to see they should have just told the city what they want to see happen with the money the are giving them
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It's not the role of Metrolinx role to make decisions for any municipality. If the people of Hamilton don't want LRT then why should Metrolinx force it upon them? Makes no sense.
 
doady said:
It's not the role of Metrolinx role to make decisions for any municipality. If the people of Hamilton don't want LRT then why should Metrolinx force it upon them? Makes no sense.
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It may "make no sense" but ironically that was part of the reason why Metrolinx was formed. To gather the opinion of what cities wanted and needed, and make a decision on funding based off of that. But Metrolinx has transformed drastically back from the days where mayors actually had a voice on the board. The reason why a lot of the projects that are proposed are never built is because Metrolinx dittles its responsibilities and allow cities to bicker between projects that they want to see built. This has been seen numerous times with Toronto, and now with Hamilton.
 
Hamiltonian here.
Not force the LRT, but an offer of the LRT should be made.

TL;DR: Two words: Scarborough LRT.
I feel we're more likely than Scarborough to get LRT built get it built, if the province makes a full offer in the first place.

Amare said:
This is where Metrolinx lack of leadership really shines through. Instead of listening to the confused politicians over at Hamilton's City Hall, they should just take the lead and tell them what form of transit they will receive. Hamilton is incapable of making realistic decisions when it comes to transit, and since the province already has an idea of what they want to see they should have just told the city what they want to see happen with the money the are giving them
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The Hamilton politicians are generally in favour of LRT, but they are more "confused" than they were before. I remember when it was near-unamious a few years ago, but now it's all so muddied up with just a bit over 50% of the politicians. Imagine an 80%-90% consensus falling gradually to something like 60% with enough politicans wanting to sabotage the LRT. And consider that there's also a lot of "old boys club" mentality in the Hamilton City Hall, too. We've got a Lower City versus Mountain mentality, which is like a smaller version of the "416 versus 905" mentality. Nearly the whole Lower City wants the LRT, but a lot of the Mountain don't want us to get an LRT, which is kind of absurd, IMHO, since they are next to get the LRT (A-line after the B-line, in the proposed "BLAST" network).

doady said:
It's not the role of Metrolinx role to make decisions for any municipality. If the people of Hamilton don't want LRT then why should Metrolinx force it upon them? Makes no sense.
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A lot of people in Hamilton want LRT, but a lot of people do not. It's inaccurate to say "people of Hamilton don't want LRT". It's not quite that simple, doady...

Remember Brampton too... they have been bickering a little over LRT too, not wanting it to go down their historical district. Likewise, a lot of Toronto didn't want to get Scarborough, nor Toronto wanted Ontario to pay for Transit City. And Ontario offered Hurontario anyway.

Also, in the last election (happened just a mere few months ago) we had a chance to vote the LRT completely out, but we voted for a pro-LRT mayor, combined with a few councillors that are having second thoughts.

My opinion is the province should make an actual offer to Hamilton the LRT (fully funded like Hurontario and ECLRT), and let the politicans fight it over. I would say not to let current Hamilton bickering cause province to decide to not make any offer of LRT in the very first place; I assure you that, as Hamiltonians - if offered -- I still think we're far more likely to proceed with getting this LRT built than Scarborough, despite our occasional disaster of a city council (depending on what's going on, and to give credit, some councillors are truly really good at trying their best).
 
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WislaHD said:
What's the precedent for Metrolinx going forward with a project distinct from the wishes or distractions of municipal governments?
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Brampton section of Hurontario
Transit City
Scarborough LRT
Finch West LRT
Sheppard LRT

Our Hamilton politics, while a circus at times, isn't Rob Ford.

Admittedly, with the exception of Brampton (and their bickering TODAY of whether they want THEIR section of Hurontario), some of that happened AFTER Rob Ford came to city hall. However, our Hamilton mayor who we voted for a few months ago, is actually very pro-LRT. Also, the ward I live in (ward 3, councillor Michael Green) is also quite pro-LRT. It's just that the council is quite a bit more confused than earlier, but the council is still roughly 50% to 2/3rds pro-LRT, probably more than 2/3rds LRT when you include the fencesitters (the type of "The LRT is a great idea, but we need bus improvements first"). Also, Toronto wasn't exactly a unamious chorous when Transit City got approved.

If Ontario offers both the LRT and bus improvement money (may be unlikely, as there may not be enough left in the budget), this throws our 905 equivalent (Hamilton Mountain) a bus-improvement bone while satisfying the 416 equivalent (Hamilton Lower City) with the LRT. This will placate a few mountain councillors. Our mayor was frustrated that council approved expanding the request by about one-third more, from 800M to about 1.1B to include LRT+bus improvements, because it makes the LRT offer from Ontario that much less likely. But if Ontario is feeling unexpectedly generous (which I hope), the Hamilton LRT is very likely up and running by 2025, despite some bickering within our city. Consequently, Ontario is forced to play coy and call it "Rapid Transit". Placating our equivalent of 416-and-905 will be a lot easier than placating Toronto's 416-and-905 simultaneously -- it's only about $300M extra.

Ontario knows this, I think, and if there's not enough budget, then a phased offer might be possible (e.g. funds for bus, followed by funds for LRT later). This won't make everyone happy, but I would recommend Hamilton take that offer even if it means a few years longer wait for our LRT. This is the best outcome, and I hope this is what happens.

Give Ontario a chance to offer the LRT, let our city commit.
 
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7 hours ago | Vote0 0
Province set to unveil LRT game-changer for Hamilton

Funding commitment is imminent, sources say, as minister Del Duca prepares to visit city

B821960664Z.1_20150513212214_000_G1C1FTQLA.3_Content.jpg

LRT

City of HamiltonSources at both levels of government say a transit funding commitment for Hamilton is imminent — perhaps as early as next week — but hinges on overcoming serious logistical hurdles.

Hamilton SpectatorBy Matthew Van Dongen
The province is close to announcing a game-changing commitment to light rail transit in Hamilton, The Spectator has learned.
Sources at both levels of government say a transit funding commitment is imminent — perhaps as early as next week — but hinges on overcoming serious logistical hurdles.
A spokesperson for Transportation Minister Steven Del Duca wouldn't comment on the specific timing or substance of the anticipated announcement, but promised the minister "will be in the city in the coming weeks to discuss what Ontario's … transit and transportation infrastructure plan means for the residents of Hamilton."
The province wants to green-light part or all of the city's requested $811-million LRT line — but potentially deal-breaking details still need to be nailed down, said sources who didn't want to be identified due to the sensitivity of the discussions.
A transit garage and GO expansion have also been discussed as additional or alternative announcements. If all goes well, a visit is expected any time between next week and early June.
Premier Kathleen Wynne raised eyebrows when she spoke in the legislature about the importance of working with Hamilton to "build that LRT."
She later corrected the record to say she meant "rapid transit."
The city asked for both $811 million for LRT and $302 million for express buses and a maintenance facility in advance of the provincial budget.
Sources say a critical question is whether there's enough cash to build LRT all the way from McMaster University to Eastgate Square — especially given the province is insisting on a spur-line connecting to at least one GO station.
It's not clear how much money the province has to spare for Hamilton after recently committing more than $15 billion to GO electrification and LRT in Mississauga.
But the $811-million LRT estimate is based on 2011 dollars and city staff have warned each year of delay could add two per cent to the total capital cost. The provincial budget suggests Hamilton's transit cash won't be doled out before 2018 and the city still needs years of design work on LRT.
Early documents for the city's LRT project estimated a build from McMaster to Ottawa Street, by comparison, would cost closer to $550 million.
Another issue is whether the HSR or Metrolinx should run the LRT line along the Main-King-Queenston corridor, by far the biggest revenue producer among city transit routes.
The city's bus request, meanwhile, may not easily fit under the mandate of the province's 10-year, $16-billion rapid transit funding plan, but sources said a transit maintenance facility hasn't been ruled out.
It's also possible a timing or funding announcement on extending GO train service to the east city will be included in the minister's visit.
Metrolinx has previously confirmed a ballpark cost of about $150 million to extend GO Train service and build a new station near Centennial Parkway.
It's uncertain how an increasingly skeptical and divided council will react to a long-sought cash commitment to LRT, on a modified route or not. Several current councillors campaigned against light rail in the recent municipal election.
The city has also committed to letting a citizen panel study rapid transit and related area rating issues this year.


mvandongen@thespec.com
905-526-3241 | @Mattatthespec

http://www.thespec.com/news-story/5616879-province-set-to-unveil-lrt-game-changer-for-hamilton/
 
Very good that LRT is staying on the table, even if it is bumped forward a few years years.

I anticipate Ontario was waiting on clarity on multiple fronts (construction delays, projects, City Council bickering) to get an announcement package together for Hamilton, which may include one or more of:

-- Getting a little more clarity from City Council
-- West Harbour GO information (James Street North), possibly opening dates
-- GO expansions such as Confederation GO, and future increases in GO service
-- Hamilton LRT
-- Bus expansions, hopefully enough to satisfy Mountain needs

Should be very interesting! It may not be enough, little too late for some, but there should be nuggets of pleasant surprises to maintain good politics and make at least a number of firm commitments on some fronts!
 
What I find most interesting is that the article specifically mentions a spur line to serve a GO station. I'm guessing this is in reference to a line up James Street to West Harbour GO station? Or would it be a spur to Hunter Street? Is this new information?
 
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Hunter is the one claimed to be getting allday service (hourly, presumably due to CP limits), so if there is a spur, it might be maybe a Hurontario-style Mississauga loop. Hunter is only three blocks away!
 
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