Toronto 191 Bay | 301.74m | 64s | QuadReal | Hariri Pontarini

interchange42 said:
It can be, but it isn't here.

42
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I’m afraid this is going right over my head...

This doesn’t look like an antenna. It looks like an architectural feature of the tower. Unlike FCP’s that was bolted on after the fact. They were never part of the building’s design.

Therefore, this tower is 350m to me if that toothpick at the NYT tower counts.
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
Except the dimension that really mattered in this particular example is that it is a tower by Renzo Piano - that alone would have made it more desirable.

AoD
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+1, but if we’re going to have a Piano building, give me a Shard, which I think is far superior. Plus, no one will have to argue about spires and what not.

UrbanWarrior said:
Even if they added 6 floors to make it 70 storeys, that would make this beast around 325 meters to tip. Still, pretty impressive for a purely office tower outside of NYC and China even at 298, in this day and age.
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It is. In fact, I wouldn’t place money on seeing another fully-office building in North America exceeding the heights of 1WTC or Willis Tower in the next decade (maybe more?).
 
For me, The design is fine and hieght, spire and all is fine. A little un appealing for me is the lower portion with the peaked tops. Maybe make the different hieghts? More jumbled but in a much more dramatic way... if possible. Just me I’m sure.
 
Lenser said:
For what it's worth, I'd not like to see a Shard II in Toronto. It would be a little "me too" for my liking.
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Yes the Shard is pretty unique to London. I don't think it's the best location for anything neo-futurist like the Shard anyway, more sculptural buildings like that are much better served standing alone. I think we'll be seeing something more conventional as represented, especially given it's position amid tall staid International style towers.
 
Why is no one concerned about:

1. pulling down CCS and CC East? These are far from the worst piles in the city.
2. adding a building the size of First Canadian Place and the transit implications. Once, someone told me that 16,500 people worked in First Canadian Place. How Re this many more people going to get to work pre Relief Line?
3. the tightness of the ‘fit’ of something so massive directly north of and so close to Brookfield Place?
 
I'm finding it difficult to get excited about this to even the slightest degree. The design (at least in its current iteration) is, to me, lazy, uninspired, and unrefined, to say nothing of the fact that I had previously assumed HPA would be above plopping a superfluous and non-contextual spire atop one of its buildings. And at grade, the development's only redeeming quality is at best a cheap facsimile of the Hudson Yards shed.

I get that some folks get excited about height for height's sake, but other than the continued densification of the city (which I almost always take as a positive) and the addition of yet more office space, what exactly is worth celebrating here?
 
ADRM said:
I'm finding it difficult to get excited about this to even the slightest degree. The design (at least in its current iteration) is, to me, lazy, uninspired, and unrefined, to say nothing of the fact that I had previously assumed HPA would be above plopping a superfluous and non-contextual spire atop one of its buildings. And at grade, the development's only redeeming quality is at best a cheap facsimile of the Hudson Yards shed.

I get that some folks get excited about height for height's sake, but other than the continued densification of the city (which I almost always take as a positive) and the addition of yet more office space, what exactly is worth celebrating here?
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And aside from its replacing critical components of the original Commerce Court ensemble, hasn't anyone noticed how bloated and inappropriate it looks alongside CCN and CCW? It's like everyone's treating it as a standalone skyline object...
 
Yay, "new office space for the city"! Can't wait to tell all my friends!

When assessing this design, please do so in the following context:
- A+ location
- A+ money behind the development
- A+ rents to be charged
- A+ attention and buzz

Recognize that the factors at play are optimal for something world-class, so logically, this will be the best we can get in Toronto. Our ceiling is a tall-ish box who appears to have eaten too many Lindt truffles over the holidays and is now unable to zip up the dress she just bought at Winners.
 
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^ hilarious.

I won't miss the street killing wellington cc south. Nice architecture but helped kill a nearly dead street.

I will call David P (who is very tired no doubt) and tell him to fix the tower and streetscape ... lol. No worries. Happy New Year.
 
Roy G Biv said:
Yay, "new office space for the city"! Can't wait to tell all my friends!

When assessing this design, please do so in the following context:
- A+ location
- A+ money behind the development
- A+ rents to be charged
- A+ attention and buzz

Recognize that the factors at play are optimal for something world-class, so logically, this will be the best we can get in Toronto. Our ceiling is a tall-ish box who appears to have eaten too many Lindt truffles over the holidays and is now unable to zip up the dress she just bought at Winners.
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Savage. I love it.

You are totally right though. For the location, visibility, and value of this project, its design and execution are deplorable. I was excited to see this proposed at first, and while I am still happy that such a massive office space has been proposed in Toronto, I'm really seeing how wrong this proposal is now.



TransitBart said:
Why is no one concerned about:

1. pulling down CCS and CC East? These are far from the worst piles in the city.
2. adding a building the size of First Canadian Place and the transit implications. Once, someone told me that 16,500 people worked in First Canadian Place. How Re this many more people going to get to work pre Relief Line?
3. the tightness of the ‘fit’ of something so massive directly north of and so close to Brookfield Place?
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CC3 is nearly a million ft2 smaller than FCP, so it will not have the same impact. Regardless, the Relief Line should have been built 20 years ago, not 20 years from now. Any added impetus to expedite the construction of this line should be welcomed by all.
 
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ADRM said:
I'm finding it difficult to get excited about this to even the slightest degree. The design (at least in its current iteration) is, to me, lazy, uninspired, and unrefined, to say nothing of the fact that I had previously assumed HPA would be above plopping a superfluous and non-contextual spire atop one of its buildings. And at grade, the development's only redeeming quality is at best a cheap facsimile of the Hudson Yards shed.

I get that some folks get excited about height for height's sake, but other than the continued densification of the city (which I almost always take as a positive) and the addition of yet more office space, what exactly is worth celebrating here?
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I like the spire. Not so much a fan of the rest of things but I'm fine with a spire or two around here. They work well on things like the Times Tower and Bank of America so why not here? Remember, we were originally supposed to get one on Telus and that never materialized.

In any case, at this early stage, the thing that should matter the least is the damn spire.

3Dementia said:
^ hilarious.

I won't miss the street killing wellington cc south. Nice architecture but helped kill a nearly dead street.

I will call David P (who is very tired no doubt) and tell him to fix the tower and streetscape ... lol. No worries. Happy New Year.
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What makes you think David designed it?
 
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