SmartTrack (Proposed)

[crs1026]

The danger is that Trudeau and/or Mulcair might wade in and promise to fund some other new idea for transit in the area - likely even flimsier and less thought-out than Smarttrack was when Tory first proposed it. We don't need more new ideas, we're confused enough with the ones we have. And then Wynne, to support the federal Liberals, has to distance herself from Smarttrack.

If Harper's popularity remains low, and he is defeated, then Trudeau/Mulcair are left having to stand by their new idea - it would be too embarassing to reverse themselves and agree to the idea that is linked to Harper - and then we have a transit plan that was built in haste that no one saw coming. And a needless disconnect between themselves and Tory.

At best it means we will get GO-RER and not Smarttrack.

- Paul

 

[wopchop]

It's funny, because if you actually look at the Spring Budget (see link to National Post article) regarding the 'Public Transit Fund', it lists the funding as follows;

2017-2018 - $250M
2018-2019 - $500M
2019-2020 - $1.0B
and $1.0B/year thereafter.

If my math is correct, that means $2.6 billion dollars isn't actually available until the 2020-2021 budget.

 

[mdrejhon]

Harper will either be defeated in October, or else he'll be hamstrung by a minority against a Liberal/NDP coalition. Either way, this particular bundle of cash isn't coming in reality any time soon.

I have a feeling that SmartTrack funding isn't going away because it's essentially GO RER.... Provided Tory still pushes it through. Tory's supposedly good at negotiating with any color (red, orange, blue).

Anything GO-RER style probably qualifies for some federal funding boost (whatever it becomes) as part of transit funding expansions offered at the federal level. Liberals and NDP are currently far more pro-transit than the Conservatives are, so the funding may actually be increased, with some conditions (e.g. RER expansions, chop the Eglinton spur, Brampton RER station, Pearson RER station, etc.) ... All the other good SmartTrack elements would be kept and still be funded 3-way (federal-provincial-municipal).

The funding mix suggested by
- Provincial: Their 1/3rd is the existing electricifation plan of GO RER
- Muncipal/Federal: Their respective 1/3rd is funding the infill stations, better integration with TTC, and the Eglinton spur.

The Ontario budget already suggests that this is actually the case (Ontario Budget, "TABLE 1.2 GO Transit Rail Service Improvements", Chart 1.9 considers SmartTrack 'enhancements' above-and-beyond existing GO RER plan, is funded by City/Federal, labelled as "Partner Funding")

So the provincial gets to spend the same money doing what they were doing anyway (electricifation, electric train sets, etc), but the SmartTrack add-ons are the expensive Eglinton spur (not efficient use of money), infill stations (great idea), TTC integration (great idea).

Documents, including like this City of Toronto workplan and this Ontario budget, is suggesting hints of some sanity is proceeding with SmartTrack. The plan is study the Eglinton feasibility separately and possibly modify that, even while proceeding with the rest of the "thing" (SmartTrack or GO RER or whatever they call it). It even considers integration of the existing Bramalea-Unionville GO RER plan and the SmartTrack GO RER plan -- (So this will also cover the topic, such as sending every other SmartTrack down the spur versus Bramalea, or some other solution that supports both routes). Behind the scenes, there is more sanity it seems.

Hopefully Tory can agree to chopping the Eglinton spur, since we can install so many more stations with ECLRT. Use this transit funding to enhance RER or divert expensive Eglinton spur funding (The SmartTrack Eglinton spur would be likely approx $3bn) to DRL and ECLRT extension.

 

[Adjei]

Actually I think if we take the numbers quoted in this non-announcement announcement and use them for further discussion about federal funding, or if we even consider that politicians have decided ST is in an apparent "advanced stage" of planning relative to the DRL, then we set two very dangerous precedents.

1) That the PM of this country can swoop in, wave a magic wand, and decide what transit to build, regardless of whatever is going on with the nuts-and-bolts planning process, which has barely begun let alone decided on ST as a worthwhile plan,
and
2) That our votes can be bought by shiny toys waved in front of us in election season.

Of course it's not like these precedents haven't been set already, but why extend them? Why continue to give politicians this power over transit?

This "announcement" should be completely ignored like the waste of airtime it is.

We need to take the power away from politicians.

Unfortunately the media doesn't grasp that they are perpetuating this problem by spreading this "news" around.

How is Harper deciding what transit is being built? He is only promising to fund what transit Toronto city council is pushing. Do you think if the relief line was being pushed by Toronto city council and the mayor as much as Smart Track is it wouldn't receive funding? Is not like Harper is coming here and bringing forth a new transit line.

 

[andrewpmk]

If SmartTrack is built it will not go on Eglinton. The study is proposing an alternative route that goes further north and goes to Pearson Airport and Airport Corporate Centre. This will end up replacing the UP Express and the provincial government will have the embarrassment of the $456 million spent on it being wasted, but otherwise seems like a pretty sensible plan.

 

[Adjei]

If SmartTrack is built it will not go on Eglinton. The study is proposing an alternative route that goes further north and goes to Pearson Airport and Airport Corporate Centre. This will end up replacing the UP Express and the provincial government will have the embarrassment of the $456 million spent on it being wasted, but otherwise seems like a pretty sensible plan.

And how do you know the alternative route will be chosen instead of a continuation of the Eglinton LRT? Or do you have the results of the study already?

 

[minilude]

I would rather see other party to dedicate this 2.6 billion to DRL/Richmond Hill Go flooding mitigation/Yonge North extension as a central corridor development package.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Assuming that the NDP gets in, the Conservative "promise" will not happen. See link.

 

[CDL.TO]

I have a modest proposal: I want to start up two community groups.

Group #1 - Save our SmartTrack

This group will publicly advocate in favour of SmartTrack, stating that they support the project because of the use of proper community engagement in the planning process to refine the route and station locations, its complete fare integration with the TTC, the fact that every 15 minutes is just a baseline and will run more frequently much of the time.

Group #2 - Steamed over SmartTrack

This group will publicly oppose SmartTrack, stating that they disagree with the project due to the politicized process used to determine the route and station locations, the lack of full fare integration with the TTC, and the fact that the 15-minute frequency is too low.

With both a carrot and a stick hopefully the amorphous blob of a concept which is SmartTrack can be moulded into something that actually lives up to its potential.

(H/T ShonTron for pointing out how so many community groups use SOS as their name.)

 

[Palma]

And how do you know the alternative route will be chosen instead of a continuation of the Eglinton LRT? Or do you have the results of the study already?

If SmartTrack is built it will not go on Eglinton. The study is proposing an alternative route that goes further north and goes to Pearson Airport and Airport Corporate Centre. This will end up replacing the UP Express and the provincial government will have the embarrassment of the $456 million spent on it being wasted, but otherwise seems like a pretty sensible plan.

I am a bit lost in these lines. Since UP line exists, can they not just build SmartTrack to Union and have it connect to UP so its one continuous line all the way to the airport. That would mean a good potion of SmartTrack is done and they would need to complete the portion from Union to wherever its going to start.

 

[andrewpmk]

The SmartTrack study is studying an alternative route that would build a spur going south from the Kitchener line to Pearson and Airport Corporate Centre. The Eglinton route is not feasible. This route would have to go underground and would cost several billion dollars. It does not admit that the UP Express will be removed if this is built but this is obvious. The UP Express spur cannot accommodate regular GO trains so it will have to be replaced.

 

[Tuscani01]

The SmartTrack study is studying an alternative route that would build a spur going south from the Kitchener line to Pearson and Airport Corporate Centre. The Eglinton route is not feasible. This route would have to go underground and would cost several billion dollars. It does not admit that the UP Express will be removed if this is built but this is obvious. The UP Express spur cannot accommodate regular GO trains so it will have to be replaced.

But why would regular GO trains be using the airport spur?

 

[Towered]

LOL!! What a joke - Harper is nothing but a cynical snake oil salesman showing how desperate he is for Toronto region votes. I get the impression so far that the majority of people aren't stupid enough to fall for this empty gesture. I'd love to see SmartTrack and tons of other transit projects built, especially the DRL which remains the single greatest priority for Toronto, but those Conservatives are not the ones to do it, and whoever believes that they are is a fool. That party just needs to be booted out already. I'd be happy with a federal Liberal, NDP, or Liberal-NDP coalition.

 

[Tuscani01]

I wonder who Ford Nation will band around for the Federal election. Steve is supporting their enemy's plan now... can't go voting for a Tory supporter, can they?

 

[TOareaFan]

It's funny, because if you actually look at the Spring Budget (see link to National Post article) regarding the 'Public Transit Fund', it lists the funding as follows;

2017-2018 - $250M
2018-2019 - $500M
2019-2020 - $1.0B
and $1.0B/year thereafter.

If my math is correct, that means $2.6 billion dollars isn't actually available until the 2020-2021 budget.

How long will it take to build? Last time I checked, the Provincial government doesn't have $16B lying around either....but we believe them when they promise to spend it.....and they haven't yet identified where it all might come from.