Sheppard Line 4 Subway Extension (Proposed)

[TransitBart]

The whole funding as we go issue is going to require a national discussion on taming health care costs. A PC win here will force the federal government back to the centre. With recent changes in taxation in the USA, major changes in personal and corporate rates are unlikly and perhaps unwise. The room to tax is at the VAT level and the 2 points vacated by the 'Harper government' -*spits nails* - are a space that each province and territory have room to maneuvre in.

The chickens are coming home to roost, even Alberta has huge fiscal challenges to deal with, and it wont' be long before the NDP in BC blows that province's finances to kingdom come too. AB will need the revenue to close a gaping budget hole. VAT/GST taxation does not affect the incentive to earn either personally or corporately.

I say restore the 2 points federally (ie. raise the GST rate from 5% to 7% again), and then return 1 point to each province in proportion to their dollar contribution, as long as it is earmarked uniquely for public transit in that province. Ongoing funding resolved. The other point can go to healthcare perhaps. Or - shocker - the deficit.

 

[Hopkins123]

Karen Stintz was a fantastic city builder. Look at all the transit she talked about building!

View attachment 145839

To wit, think of what could've been accomplished had Karen Stintz not had mayoral ambitions of her own and played her part as a loyal soldier:



See Tiger? The Fords have been consistent. Doug wants to fulfill Network 2011 as much as possible. I think you may be surprised what could happen if he's given the chance.

 

[Hopkins123]

City builders recognize you actually have to pay for this stuff. Ford’s talked good game about building transit, yet hasn’t produced a plan on how to build any of it.

Like the $333 million the Fords convinced the Feds to set aside for Sheppard Subway? Or the $670 million they secured from the Feds for SSE? Or the $910 million they raised through taxes for SSE?

To think what Doug can accomplish if he were to get control of the Provincial purse-strings?

 

[sixrings]

And people think lrt advocates can't compromise. The pro subway crowd wants a stop at everyone's doorstop.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Ha! Is this the 1960s when we built 25 subway stations in under five years?

I know everybody is clamoring to pat each other on the back and look back with rose-tinted glasses now that it's apparent to the world post-news conference that the Liberals are about to be taken behind the shed, but this takes the cake.

I wasn't counting only subway stations. I was talking subway, LRT, BRT, RER, everything. Transit doesn't revolve around Toronto's subways.

 

[OneCity]

Like the $333 million the Fords convinced the Feds to set aside for Sheppard Subway? Or the $670 million they secured from the Feds for SSE? Or the $910 million they raised through taxes for SSE?

To think what Doug can accomplish if he were to get control of the Provincial purse-strings?

This is a really big point. Some want to claim that Rob couldn't bring the subway to Scarborough, but he was stonewalled by a polarized outside Left council even when compromised with the Crosstown LRT to SCC. If the Conservatives happen to win and have a majority the SSE gets closer to being built with stops DRL gets closer and the Sheppard is under design. If they happen to win and have a minority it will be interesting to see how the Liberal cabinet works with them to move forward. All you can hope with the NDP is they don't try to resurrect Transit City and set the City back further in expansion.

 

[Amare]

Like the $333 million the Fords convinced the Feds to set aside for Sheppard Subway? Or the $670 million they secured from the Feds for SSE? Or the $910 million they raised through taxes for SSE?

You do realize that $333 million wouldn't even be enough to cover a 1-stop Sheppard extension to Consumers Road right? That $333 million sure looks good on paper, but when you take a look at it on the grand scheme of things (especially with how the previous Convservative government spread their commitments over a 8-10 year period, it's really a drop in the bucket and embarrassing).

 

[Streety McCarface]

I wasn't counting only subway stations. I was talking subway, LRT, BRT, RER, everything. Transit doesn't revolve around Toronto's subways.

I would argue that the majority of it does. Yes, you have the heavily used streetcar and bus networks, but they all feed into the subway and that's why our lines have such high ridership (comparable to that of NYC). Eglinton is making a huge mistake by not properly integrating surface transit into the line at many stations (ie Forest Hill/Chaplin (4 bus routes serving it), 7 if you throw in the 90, 13, and 61), Fairbank, Oakwood, O'Conner etc).

 

[pman]

And people think lrt advocates can't compromise. The pro subway crowd wants a stop at everyone's doorstop.

Only for folks in the suburbs. The Transit Equitymeter says downtown has enough subways.

 

[Hopkins123]

You do realize that $333 million wouldn't even be enough to cover a 1-stop Sheppard extension to Consumers Road right? That $333 million sure looks good on paper, but when you take a look at it on the grand scheme of things (especially with how the previous Convservative government spread their commitments over a 8-10 year period, it's really a drop in the bucket and embarrassing).

I'm pretty sure if I'm recalling it correctly that the $333 million was based on 3rd/3rd/3rd deal wherein the Province and the City would put up matching funding commitments. That would have gotten us a lot further than Consumers Rd. $1 billion in 2008 dollars would have likely gotten us all the way to Warden, if not further.

 

[Hopkins123]

The point I'm trying to make is that in the midst of tabloid scandals, the Fords still managed to forge enough of a consensus to secure almost $2 billion in new funding for Scarborough. And this was prior to the Trudeau era's Infrastructure Fund.

Now carrying over the Brown era's $5 billion transit fund, on top of the Wynne Liberals' $9 billion already set aside for Toronto transit; Ford is advancing a $14 billion transit plan that is good for constituents all over Toronto, not just downtown. Investing every last cent into a DRL is useless to someone if it still takes them over a hour by bus to get to it. Extending the subway system into the northeast, means as little as 10 minute bus rides to the nearest subway stop. Equity for all.

But fear not anti-Fords, based on 2014 and this campaign's rhetoric a DRL is still a priority for the PCs, even though you'll never vote for them. They just also want to advance the Crosstown fully grade-separated from the airport to UTSC and finish what we started on Sheppard many moons ago. I also find the Hwy 27 rapid transit line intriguing, but I digress.

 

[BurlOak]

The point I'm trying to make is that in the midst of tabloid scandals, the Fords still managed to forge enough of a consensus to secure almost $2 billion in new funding for Scarborough. And this was prior to the Trudeau era's Infrastructure Fund.

Now carrying over the Brown era's $5 billion transit fund, on top of the Wynne Liberals' $9 billion already set aside for Toronto transit; Ford is advancing a $14 billion transit plan that is good for constituents all over Toronto, not just downtown. Investing every last cent into a DRL is useless to someone if it still takes them over a hour by bus to get to it. Extending the subway system into the northeast, means as little as 10 minute bus rides to the nearest subway stop. Equity for all.

But fear not anti-Fords, based on 2014 and this campaign's rhetoric a DRL is still a priority for the PCs, even though you'll never vote for them. They just also want to advance the Crosstown fully grade-separated from the airport to UTSC and finish what we started on Sheppard many moons ago. I also find the Hwy 27 rapid transit line intriguing, but I digress.

There was also the $2.5B that was secured (partly for Scarborough) from Harper for the SmartTrack.

 

[Hopkins123]

There was also the $2.5B that was secured (partly for Scarborough) from Harper for the SmartTrack.

Yikes! I forgot about that. So $16.5 billion.

That's enough to at least get us well along completing SSE to McCowan-Sheppard with 4 stops, DRL from Science Centre to Dundas West or preferably Keele (some stops may have to be roughed-in at a later date though), and Sheppard Subway from Don Mills to Scarborough Centre.

 

[W. K. Lis]

I would argue that the majority of it does. Yes, you have the heavily used streetcar and bus networks, but they all feed into the subway and that's why our lines have such high ridership (comparable to that of NYC). Eglinton is making a huge mistake by not properly integrating surface transit into the line at many stations (ie Forest Hill/Chaplin (4 bus routes serving it), 7 if you throw in the 90, 13, and 61), Fairbank, Oakwood, O'Conner etc).

Like College, Dundas, Queen, King, St. Andrew, St. Patrick, and Queens Park stations on Line 1 not being "properly integrated"?

 

[JSF-1]

The point I'm trying to make is that in the midst of tabloid scandals, the Fords still managed to forge enough of a consensus to secure almost $2 billion in new funding for Scarborough. And this was prior to the Trudeau era's Infrastructure Fund.

Now carrying over the Brown era's $5 billion transit fund, on top of the Wynne Liberals' $9 billion already set aside for Toronto transit; Ford is advancing a $14 billion transit plan that is good for constituents all over Toronto, not just downtown. Investing every last cent into a DRL is useless to someone if it still takes them over a hour by bus to get to it. Extending the subway system into the northeast, means as little as 10 minute bus rides to the nearest subway stop. Equity for all.

But fear not anti-Fords, based on 2014 and this campaign's rhetoric a DRL is still a priority for the PCs, even though you'll never vote for them. They just also want to advance the Crosstown fully grade-separated from the airport to UTSC and finish what we started on Sheppard many moons ago. I also find the Hwy 27 rapid transit line intriguing, but I digress.

As long as its elevated its fine. Building the EELRT and EWLRT fully underground would be a colossal waste of cash. Underground should only be done when absolutely necessary (i.e all the current underground parts plus Pearson).