September 11th: Real or Fraud?

[gristle]

And BTW Gristle you dodged so many of my questions it's not funny.. not to mention the fact that you contradicted your own logic.

Incorrect again Kamuix. You have contended throughout this thread that a conspiracy exists. You have asserted your belief in this conspiracy. However, you have failed at every request to provide any shred of actual proof in terms of evidence, timelines and players to support your assertion. You have finally admitted that you have no evidence whatsoever to support your claims. You simply believe in a conspiracy, but are incapable of understanding that this mere belief is utterly insufficient to "prove" your claim. It is merely an act of imagination no different from believing in ghosts or imaginary friends.

Did Gristle put you guys up to this? he dodged all my last questions & statements and hid behind a stupid one liner and comparing us to delusional people.

Yet more evidence of conspiratorial fears.

It's funny to me but makes me frustrated to how blind people can be.. It's shame how stupid you guys are going to feel when it becomes revealed that 911 was in fact a staged event.

What is funny is that you make a statement like this in total absence of any evidence to back up your claims. Your single-minded adherence to your unsupported belief comes off as delusional.

The facts are.. the 911 truth group is growing.. the false deceptions are being exposed faster then ever before and I take back what i said about 10 years from now.. can't see it being anymore then 2 before you guys are faced with the truth.

Attempting to hide your logical failings in some trumped-up belief of a majority point of view is merely an attempt to squeak your way out of the fact that you (and by extension, the entire supposed 911 "truth" movement) have no evidence to stand on. The age-old tactic of repeating your beliefs over and over is the only ploy you have left, and it is a worn-out tactic employed by all propagandists who wish to avoid addressing beliefs that are not supported by facts. You speak casually of "truth" but offer nothing to support a claim to such a concept. Your version of "truth" is quasi-religious in nature; it is belief that is not founded upon fact, but built upon a specific mindset that is tilted towards distrust and paranoia.

Might I remind you Kamuix, you make nothing more than hollow claims to truth because you admit to having no evidence of a conspiracy. The only conclusion that one can draw is that you do not understand the concept - even in the most general form, nor do you comprehend the idea that the claims you make require evidence in order to even be considered as a conspiracy. You appear to think that your beliefs and poorly-framed questions are all that is required to make such a claim. To say that this is incorrect is an understatement.

 

[urbandreamer]

After all planes were grounded on Sept 11, did any planes other than gov't related ones fly?

 

[kettal]

Katimux, ever heard of Occam's razor? It goes like this:

The simplest theory is usually the correct theory.

This holds true in all kinds of applications, in science, philosophy, criminology, and biology. It has been shown as valid all throughout history.

Any convoluted conspiracy involving missiles, mass executions, fake phone calls, secret government agencies installing explosives in buildings when nobody is looking, they're all ridiculously complex. The more complex something is, the less likely it is to be true.

 

[nfitz]

Clearly anyone suggesting that there was an American conspiracy behind 9/11 is mentally ill.

So really, is there any more point arguing with them here, than there is arguing with the mentally ill wandering around Nathan Phillip Square?

 

[Ramako]

Without even going into the details of the conspiracy theory, there's one thing I know. If the Bush administration was truly morally and ethically capable of committing such acts, then there's absolutely no reason why they wouldn't have also gone to the comparatively minor trouble of hiding some WMD's somewhere in Iraq, rather than letting themselves look like imbeciles.

 

[GenerationW]

Clearly anyone suggesting that there was an American conspiracy behind 9/11 is mentally ill.

This is breaking news -- merely suggesting a 9-11 conspiracy makes one mentally ill! Good thing I'm in the clear, but care to support that theory, doctor?

 

[Pretzel]

If anyone is interested, I just received an e-mail of a presentation that will be taking place at the U of T.

Did you know that World Trade Center 7 (WTC 7), a 47-story steel-frame building, half
the height of the towers and one block away, collapsed symmetrically, straight-down, at
free-fall speed, at 5:20 PM on 9/11/2001, into a pile of rubble no greater than 4 stories
high?
If you haven't heard of this unprecedented building collapse, or even if you have, then I
would encourage you to come to my presentation here in Toronto, Ontario:​

​

​

9/11, The Evidence, And the War in Afghanistan
Walter Hall, University of Toronto
90 Queen’s Park, Toronto, Ontario
Sunday, May 2, 2010, 7pm​

$15 general admission /

tickets online at uofttix.ca

​

​

This presentation is focused on reviewing data gathered by government reports, videos
of the collapses, and eye-witness accounts which have surfaced since 9/11/2001. To fully
understand what happened that day, and to prevent this kind of collapse from ever
happening again, we must have a full, unbiased, and vigorous examination of all the
evidence available.
I have studied these collapses for several years and along with ​

​

1000+ other

architects and engineers​

​

, have come to the conclusion that the official story and

investigation have ignored a great deal of evidence and left key questions unanswered.
We, the Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth, are calling for a new investigation. The
information that I have gathered in my years of studying these collapses, and which I will
be presenting, has led these engineers and architects to publicly sign a petition calling for a
new, fully funded, unimpeachable Congressional investigation with subpoena power.
In addition, the Ontario Association of Architects (OAA) confirmed that attendees of the
event will be able to count the time spent as Self-Directed learning under the ​

​

OAA’s

Continuing Education Program​

​

. OAA-licensed architects will be provided with a letter of

attendance at the door.
We hope you’ll join us for this presentation. Bring your tough questions (there will be
Q&A) and your friends. For most of us, it takes great courage to even consider this
evidence, and I applaud you for your willingness to keep an open mind while you evaluate it​

for yourself. It would be impossible for me to overstate the importance of doing so.

​

 

[urbandreamer]

I heard that 911 happened to make money. Surely Porsche benefited?

 

[Josef]

Fraud.

 

[nfitz]

This is breaking news -- merely suggesting a 9-11 conspiracy makes one mentally ill! Good thing I'm in the clear, but care to support that theory, doctor?

Can you think of another possible explanation? Well, I guess one could be an Al Qaeda supporter ...

 

[urbandreamer]

I love that tired accusation: Al Qaeda supporter! Lol. If people knew what that actually meant....

 

[GenerationW]

$15 general admission /

Do it for free you scam artists!!

It's a conspiracy, I tell you!

Can you think of another possible explanation?

Being sad and lonely comes to mind.

 

[gei]

Is Elvis really dead?

 

[PinkLucy]

No, he is alive and living in seclusion with JFK

 

[Kamuix]

Incorrect again Kamuix. You have contended throughout this thread that a conspiracy exists. You have asserted your belief in this conspiracy. However, you have failed at every request to provide any shred of actual proof in terms of evidence, timelines and players to support your assertion. You have finally admitted that you have no evidence whatsoever to support your claims. You simply believe in a conspiracy, but are incapable of understanding that this mere belief is utterly insufficient to "prove" your claim. It is merely an act of imagination no different from believing in ghosts or imaginary friends.

'

Hahaha.. You keep dodging me though.. I clearly said when i "admitted" that i admit specifically that i don't have the time to gather the evidence in the way that you demand, you took that and turned it into me admitting that i haven't seen more then enough evidence to know. Actually i guess i haven't seen the rock solid evidence that you would demand.. but heres the things.. Neither sides of the story have shown this rock solid evidence that you demand. Now when it comes to the establishment and you read a report about how they explain how the fires could cause the WTC collapse etc.. Do you just consider that to be rock solid evidence because it's an official report? Seriously answer this question this time. I see exactly what you're saying. but it still seems you put to much trust in the establishment.

Attempting to hide your logical failings in some trumped-up belief of a majority point of view is merely an attempt to squeak your way out of the fact that you (and by extension, the entire supposed 911 "truth" movement) have no evidence to stand on. The age-old tactic of repeating your beliefs over and over is the only ploy you have left, and it is a worn-out tactic employed by all propagandists who wish to avoid addressing beliefs that are not supported by facts. You speak casually of "truth" but offer nothing to support a claim to such a concept. Your version of "truth" is quasi-religious in nature; it is belief that is not founded upon fact, but built upon a specific mindset that is tilted towards distrust and paranoia.

What about all the architects and engineers? the victims coming out against it? I like how you can just so easily label them as delusional.. It's that easy for you to ignore what's happening around you. Why do you keep dodging my points? Quit using that stupid point "You don't show evidence" against me, that's all you have. I've already said over 10 times that I'm not here to try and get you to believe what i believe. All I'm asking is that you consider the possibility. Yet you keep attacking me with the same stupid point as you re-word it differently in each paragraph. You never answered me when i asked "Do you believe the official story/report. And to say that these conspiracies aren't based on facts when YOU know nothing about it either. You obviously consider the official report to be rock solid evidence.

Might I remind you Kamuix, you make nothing more than hollow claims to truth because you admit to having no evidence of a conspiracy. The only conclusion that one can draw is that you do not understand the concept - even in the most general form, nor do you comprehend the idea that the claims you make require evidence in order to even be considered as a conspiracy. You appear to think that your beliefs and poorly-framed questions are all that is required to make such a claim. To say that this is incorrect is an understatement.

This is the fourth time in that one post that you've used the same stupid point against me. Why should i have to prove to you that it's a conspiracy? I don't care if i made the assertion. You appear to be rejecting the whole conspiracy because i personally can't prove it to you right now. You so easily reject things you weren't conditioned to believe so you'll never know the meaning or understand the concept of open mindedness. It's obviously too late for someone like you to wake up. How about this.. keep believing what you believe and we'll just wait and see how things go.

The simplest theory is usually the correct theory.

That may apply if it was actually an honest theory.. but it's obvious that's there's a hell of a lot more to it then just and if it was a setup obviously that wouldn't apply. So that's it? rejected because of that logic? nice. It's easy to reject things that sound crazy at first when it doubt & before and without doing research. And also these aren't just theories. Nothing about this 9/11 movement & whatnot revolves around theories.. Research!