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Rob Ford's Toronto

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I don't mean this post to sound optimistic, because it's not, but...


...there is something so wrong with this whole scenario and I can't help but think that there is an awful lot we don't know about what's going on.

Some things that still stand out to me:

- The "disconnect" between the OPP and TPS. A public pissing match between cops? A bunch of orchestrated "sources" on the same day, and then a spokesperson or two on random radio shows?

I just don't -- I don't know. I don't love authority or police forces, I just find it so insanely difficult to believe that they're rolling over on each other like that. Even between forces. I know a few cops, and if you're a cop that's pretty much the worst thing you can do -- make another cop look bad, stupid or roll on them.

Also -- again I come back to the fact that it's extortion, extortion, extortion. I just can't believe that they kicked up all this dust and didn't find Ford with his finger in any other pies. It's mind boggling to me. Like Jimmi T said, I had always assumed that extortion was the starting point but it ends somewhere else.

If this were the case, I am 100% sure there would be NO leaks to that effect. That evidence would stay with Giroux, 1 crown, 1 judge, full stop.

Maybe I'm just delusional from rage still, but... I don't know. Damnit.
 
sno man said:
still there
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Yes. You can use this link:

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Also, Ford is going to mess up again soon. With the ITO releases and all of this going down, he's going to be a pariah for even street level dealers. Guessing the "Fucking Idiot" isn't welcome at Elena's right now. But an addict gotta addict, which means he's going to be erratic.
 
Jimmi T said:
Regardless of whether or not he ends up being charged, if this investigation is only about whether or not Ford encouraged Sandro to make threatening calls I don't think cops are using their resources wisely. There are much more important cases Giroux could be focusing on. I've always suspected there was something bigger at play here but that's looking less and less to be the case.
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Indeed, particularly as a) there is simply no way the police will ever uncover what was exchanged in that phone call and b) Ford might simply have said, "They're trying to peddle that video. Get it back any way you can." Which also wouldn't stand up in any court as incitement to extortion. If the entire case rests on that call, well, good luck TPS!
 
If Det. Giroux/ TPS is using Brazen 2 as a heatsink to deflect from a another spinoff investigation that includes trafficking and organized crime and actually comes up with charges, I will personally lead the petition to have Union Station (sorry DMW), my second born child, a sports arena of his choice and the next new species of dinosaur or sea creature named after him.
 
retailestate said:
I'd settle for 30 days in jail for contempt of court LOL
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Can't happen for refusing to speak to police, even when under arrest.

If supoenaed as a witness at Lisi's preliminary, he would have three options: (1) testify; (2) testify and invoke the protection of the Canada Evidence Act against his testimony being used against him in another case (a bit like the US 'Fifth Amendment" but far from exactly the same, as it only gives protection against future use of the testimony, not a right to decline to testify); or (3) refuse to testify. The last option could lead to a conviction for contempt.
 
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Bennett000 said:
My disdain for the Fords is pretty consuming, to the point where I've had multiple dreams about yelling at them, and to the point where just about every single person I know in real life has told me to shut up about it. I didn't get out to protest, and it wasn't because I don't care that much, it was because I love work more than I despise the Fords, and I don't miss work for anything. Also the Fords are really only part of this problem, all of the people that still do not realize the Fords are lying ignoramuses are a huge part of the problem. This problem is much bigger than Toronto, as was recently demonstrated by the US's House committee on science/space/technology.

Ford lies about everything, from his broken campaign promises, to his "open book" of a personal life; yet people still call him honest. How do we effectively protest that?
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you know people dont support ford because they like him. They support ford because they hate you.
 
kevinsp8 said:
There are ways it could be not extortion. But think about it. The video per se has no value to Ford.
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No, but it has value to whoever holds the video. And this value is not necessarily as an effective extortion tool.

Here's one possibility: You're a member of a criminal enterprise running guns and drugs. The legal consequences of such are relatively severe. Such that you'd likely go to great lengths to avoid them. Into your orbit stumbles a certain drunken mayor. You get him on tape behaving in a shocking fashion. Should the day ever come when you are raided, arrested or what have you. such a recording might be revealed to your attorney and used as a bargaining chip in proceedings going forward. All handled by august members of the crown. Thus, it's not blackmail or extortion, it's insurance. As an alternative , this seems at least plausible.
 
hper said:
No, but it has value to whoever holds the video. And this value is not necessarily as an effective extortion tool.

Here's one possibility: You're a member of a criminal enterprise running guns and drugs. The legal consequences of such are relatively severe. Such that you'd likely go to great lengths to avoid them. Into your orbit stumbles a certain drunken mayor. You get him on tape behaving in a shocking fashion. Should the day ever come when you are raided, arrested or what have you. such a recording might be revealed to your attorney and used as a bargaining chip in proceedings going forward. All handled by august members of the crown. Thus, it's not blackmail or extortion, it's insurance. As an alternative , this seems at least plausible.
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No, it's not plausible at all, unless you have a 13 year old's understanding of the world based on watching too many PG crime movies. No one would care if such a video existed and any lawyer who brought it forward would immediately be the subject of a complaint to the Law Society and suspended, if not disbarred. The video has no value at all as a bargaining chip, except with respect to Rob Ford and politics.
 
Dubster said:
Indeed, particularly as a) there is simply no way the police will ever uncover what was exchanged in that phone call and b) Ford might simply have said, "They're trying to peddle that video. Get it back any way you can." Which also wouldn't stand up in any court as incitement to extortion. If the entire case rests on that call, well, good luck TPS!
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Actually, if Rob said that to Lisi he probably could be charged. You don't need to prove that Ford knew about Lisi's exact methods, only that he could have reasonably known that Lisi would have gone too far. And given Lisi's character, that wouldn't be a difficult case to make. The challenge is in proving that Rob didn't just say "grab me a couple double downs from KFC and 80 timbits, k?"
 
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