Rob Ford's Toronto

[inyyz]

So I was lucky enough to attend the Queen's Plate today. I saw Hazel McCallion
there, who, I understand, attends every year. It was so great to see her. You have to have huge respect for her, at her age, supporting events NEAR HER RIDING but hang on....isn't this in Robby's backyard? Didn't he promise to create a world class hotel/destination attached to or near Woodbine? Shouldn't he be there glad handing? Or was the buffet not big enough.......just sayin'...

 

[adma]

This is the kind of view that makes me find it very hard to believe the left will refrain from running a strong candidate, leaving the field open for Tory. For better or worse, there WILL be a left-wing candidate--I'd be very surprised if the large NDP contingent in the city would break with past practice in this regard. Let's not forget the left in Toronto didn't even get fully behind Miller (!) in 2003.

And let's *also* not forget that the *right* didn't get fully behind *Tory* in 2003.

And remember that the 2010 Ottawa mayoral race that saw Jim Watson trounce Larry O'Brien also had a "left-candidate"--Clive Doucet--and his rump of diehard votes didn't stand as an obstacle to Jim Watson...

 

[W. K. Lis]

There used to be a time where politicians would buy everyone near them a drink or a meal, if you voted for them. Today, that's frowned upon big time.

Of course, if you wanted them to do something for you, you had to "tip" them. Also, now frowned upon.

 

[ThinkRicky]

I will never vote for Tory not because he's a follower or because of his personality or because he's lost too many elections, but because he's right-wing. Many of you seem to be resigning yourselves to another right-wing mayor to avoid Ford, which is astonishing and depressing. Have you not heard about the multiple polls that indicated Chow would do better than Ford? Why do you think a left-wing candidate is so impossible to get elected? And even if Chow's election was unlikely, I'd never stoop to such a nadir of civic cynicism that I'd vote for a right-winger to avoid an ultra right-winger.

The Overton Window has been shifted so far to the right by monied interests over the past 40 years both here and in the US, that it's all but impossible to even mention legitimate left wing ideas like taxing the rich without being figuratively mocked off the stage by every mainstream (and therefore corperate) media outlet. Voting for "left wing" candidates these days is an excersize in damage control at best, because even though what we have to pick from is the best of a bad lot, they still mostly suck. Anybody with a serious compulsion and ability to change things for the better for most people simply isn't allowed near political office, because that's not what the 1% want.

I would love to see a candidate that I feel genuinely excited to vote for because of his or her's policies, but instead it seems we're condemned to a future where John Tory is appearently the best option just to prevent a comically worse guy from getting in.

 

[Peepers]

I am confused. Wouldn't this same description apply even more to Rob Ford? At least Tory held down very high level executive positions outside of the family business. Outside of his stint as City Councillor and a short stay at Deco, Rob has not, to my knowldege, held down anything else. I stand corrected.

John Tory got the top job at Rogers Cable because Ted Rogers was a very close family friend. He didn't last that long at Rogers and it seems to me that if John Tory had a great business acumen he would have gone on to be the CEO at another major company instead today he is hosting a radio show alongside a bunch of other flunkies.

John Tory seems to fail at everything he tries. He couldn't have been a very good lawyer or he would be running the family firm by now (at least the Ford Bros. seem to have done a good job keeping dads business thriving). In politics John Tory is a three-time loser. His radio show is a snooze-fest because Tory doesn't have a strong opinion on anything.

Considering the wealth and privilege that Tory was born into (he attended Upper Canada College) he really hasn't accomplished much on his own. I consider him to be nothing more than a socialite.

 

[Forgotten]

No one works harder than John Tory in a business, political or public charity environment, I admire these attributes to the point of being jealous of his efforts and abilities but not to the point of voting for him because of them. In balance he has never known poverty or been pressed to avoid it, he was born with the proverbial silver spoon in his mouth and was thus deprived of the struggle most of us have known and survived. He is much more personable than Bob, Jack and Justin but suffers from the same "insulated from us" attitude without realizing it, I can't vote for him because he doesn't know me or my thoughts on anything. For instance his thoughts on separate schools were so off the wall and yet he couldn't understand that, what's next?

Will I vote for Rob Ford again? I don't know, do you have a better candidate or does bashing him feel so good that you are not even looking?

John Tory doesn't smoke crack with crack dealers in crack houses.

 

[syn]

I definitely have to agree with VTB, but I have to add an important point. While Ford was born with a silver-spoon and has never felt poverty, he also possesses the ability to connect to the everyman in a way other politicians in Toronto have not been able to. It's the Ford Fests, the 311-esque phone calls, the radio shows, the personality that creates this sense that he's one of you- it's the same feeling you get when you learn that someone important has something deeply in common with you, i.e. a celebrity having the same hobby as you do. It's empowering to feeling that someone high up will deal with you problems, not a lowly clerk.

Does this really translate to any positive policy making? Not really- I haven't really seen any overhauls in city management (outside that foolish across-the-board cut), nor have I seen any official strides made in terms of efficiency or customer services. To Ford, the big city issues like transportation and poverty are all social engineering- he believes the city can be fixed one citizen/subway line at a time, or better yet, the problem will sort itself out, free-market style.

But to people who support Ford, this doesn't matter because their problems were solved; the rest of the workers who run the city, the clerks, bureaucrats, the planners, the garbage men, the utility workers; they are all grouped together as part of "the problem". None of their work means anything because to his supporters, Ford will be the hero who saves the day.

I'd believe that somone like Tory has a better grasp of the bigger issues facing Toronto from his term as head of Civic Action, but connecting to the people will be something that he'll will need to overcome. I'd hope he begins hosting a few festivals of his own.


Ford has been the primary one propagating and profiting from stoking the divisions in the city, it only suits him that some of the vitrol he spews out splashes back.

Does he really connect with the 'everyman' though? I suppose you could argue he does, but he seems to appeal to a specific type of voter. I know a few people who could qualify as 'everymen' that would never vote for him (I realize that's anecdotal).

As someone mentioned earlier in the thread, people see him as an anti-politician, even though he's about as politician as it gets. He does this well; the more bizarre, rude, unprofessional he is, the more his base admires him (which is incredibly depressing).

 

[Silence&Motion]

He connects to the exact same voters who have put Hazel McCallion and Mel Lastman in the mayor's office for decades. The people who want the garbage picked up, traffic flowing, taxes low, and other than that, for the government to stay out of their hair. They don't want to be bothered about things like "city building", transit networks, greenbelts, the homeless, or carbon footprints. (The people who look at the Ai Weiwei sculptures currently in NFS and think "how much did this cost??" and not "why can't we have sculptures like this on a permanent basis?")

Ford is just more extreme in his rhetoric than McCallion and Lastman because his supporters are forced to share the city with another group of voters who have a very different understanding of municipal governance.

 

[tiffer24]

True, we are stuck in a time in Toronto when we all want to know the cost of everything, but understand the value of nothing.

 

[MetroMan]

That's why I like Tory. Maybe I'm getting older but I don't consider myself to be as left as I was before. I want money to be spent but I want it to mean something. I want a progressive city and I want this city to grow and challenge itself to be the best city on earth to live. On the other hand, I see the value of rethinking how we spend our money. Why does it cost nearly $100k to put up a traffic light? Why do we pay people $100k a year to grumble at TTC passengers?

 

[syn]

He connects to the exact same voters who have put Hazel McCallion and Mel Lastman in the mayor's office for decades. The people who want the garbage picked up, traffic flowing, taxes low, and other than that, for the government to stay out of their hair. They don't want to be bothered about things like "city building", transit networks, greenbelts, the homeless, or carbon footprints. (The people who look at the Ai Weiwei sculptures currently in NFS and think "how much did this cost??" and not "why can't we have sculptures like this on a permanent basis?")

Ford is just more extreme in his rhetoric than McCallion and Lastman because his supporters are forced to share the city with another group of voters who have a very different understanding of municipal governance.

Can't disagree...it's just unfortunate that his base also values his idiocy.

 

[Silence&Motion]

That's why I like Tory. Maybe I'm getting older but I don't consider myself to be as left as I was before. I want money to be spent but I want it to mean something. I want a progressive city and I want this city to grow and challenge itself to be the best city on earth to live. On the other hand, I see the value of rethinking how we spend our money. Why does it cost nearly $100k to put up a traffic light? Why do we pay people $100k a year to grumble at TTC passengers?

But I think it's important to recognize that there are different political divides here. There's the divide we mostly talk about on UT: Fiscal conservatism vs. city building. People here tend to lean toward the city building side, but many also take the moderate position of wanting fiscally restrained city building initiatives (e.g. LRT over subway, public-private partnerships over exclusively public).

However, there's another political divide that doesn't get discussed very much here: pro-business vs. social justice. Should the city see its main priority as creating an attractive market for global investors and entrepreneurs, or should its main priority be ensuring equality when it comes to some basic rights and living standards? It's easy to say that we want both, but the two priorities are often in conflict. As someone who feels strongly about social justice, I wouldn't vote for Tory unless he supports things like the fair wage policy, priority neighbourhoods, or unionized labour.

 

[Tulse]

That's why I like Tory. [...] I want a progressive city and I want this city to grow and challenge itself to be the best city on earth to live. On the other hand, I see the value of rethinking how we spend our money.

Does Tory stand for that? Does he stand for anything? I honestly have no idea what a Tory platform would look like -- as I said earlier, he originally seemed to be a benign Red Tory backroom wheeler-dealer, but his most recent forays into actual politics have emphasized knee-jerk social conservatism and naive populism. I don't know that he actually has that much experience relevant to managing city budgets, nor that he actually is pushing a value-for-money agenda (as opposed to a simplistic "cut, baby, cut!" approach).

Tory seems to me to be all surface -- a guy who looks serious and wears a suit well, but who has no actual commitments.

 

[syn]

That's why I like Tory. Maybe I'm getting older but I don't consider myself to be as left as I was before. I want money to be spent but I want it to mean something. I want a progressive city and I want this city to grow and challenge itself to be the best city on earth to live. On the other hand, I see the value of rethinking how we spend our money. Why does it cost nearly $100k to put up a traffic light? Why do we pay people $100k a year to grumble at TTC passengers?

I've always felt this way. Finding value is incredibly important.

 

[Eug]

I had to share: I have a friend who is a Canadian (non-Torontonian) ex-pat living overseas. He emailed me today to say he wished Chris Farley were still alive, because then he could make a movie about our mayor.

As someone who feels strongly about social justice, I wouldn't vote for Tory unless he supports things like the fair wage policy, priority neighbourhoods, or unionized labour.

I think we need balance. I'm sure most would agree with fair wages but what is fair? For example, is a low end job fair at $22 per hour? Or is it only fair at $25? Is it fair at $30, or are people getting overpaid then? And in some jobs, the pay is the same between union and non-union, except that the non-union workers don't have to pay union dues, which are often hundreds of dollars per year. In addition, should people advance just because of seniority, or should people advance because of ability? I'm sure you've heard of the ubiquitous example of the crappy union worker who has been shuffled around from department to department because he's got seniority even though he's a total dolt. Not a bad person, but just ineffective.

The point here is that it's not a black-and-white argument. Either as a worker or a management type, I'd rather have a fair non-unionized environment than a stifling unionized environment, but a fair union structure is something that can help both.