Rob Ford's Toronto

[nfitz]

There's been no big news today on the Ford front so the inmates are feeling emboldened.

Ah, you forget the Star's report this morning on David Price and Mark Towhey and the video. It is amazing we've gone the rest of the day without anything new ... but for once Rob Ford is doing his job, and is sitting at the Executive Committee meeting, presumably with his new Chief of Staff nearby ... with no one left in the Mayor's Office who can speak on anything ...

 

[FutureBuilder]

The Globe is a National newspaper. The Toronto Star is a city paper, and as such is probably among the most respected in North America. So strange, the people who go on about the Toronto Star. I guess it's sort of like the teabaggers complaining about the New York Times. Some people just don't trust any paper you can't read easily on the bus.

I can't believe I've been following this thread for the last couple of weeks and this is the post that made me register and respond. Oh well. Some great info here, by the way. This thread is my new crack.

The New York Times IS a newspaper of record with excellent, world class reporters. They have some of the best in the world (the have Paul Krugman, who won a Nobel Prize, writing an article every week...who does the Star have?) You aren't comparing the Star to the NY Times, are you?


Funny, we've gone from "international reputation" to a "city paper"... "one of the best in North America". Soon we'll be down to the "most respect left leaning paper in Toronto". Well, it is more reputable than Now Magazine, so I'll give them that.

 

[Tulse]

The Star also conducted a top-notch and extremely lengthy investigation into the malfeasance at ORNGE, which embarrassed the Liberal government. It would be hard to call them toadies to the left (isn't rooting out government waste and corruption an obsession of the right, after all)?

 

[Roy G Biv]

Are you saying the Toronto Star is a "newspaper of record" with a stellar international "reputation"?

No. And it doesn't need to be. I do know that the two reporters are A+ and very well respected by their peers. Disagree? Editorials and columns are what separate the reputation of newspapers.... There is not much difference between beat writers at the Globe and Star.

Please do not confuse the Globe with the Star. As for Doug Ford, if the Globe said that the mayor's brother was into dealing recreational narcotics, they (the Globe) are a much more serious newspaper than the Star, and I don't think would fabricate such a story unless they had serious proof that could stand up in court (in case of a libel suit).

They have anonymous testimony. The Star has firsthand eye-witness accounts from their own reporters. The Star has a tighter story! The Globe pretty much expects to be sued....Stackhouse admitted as much. There is a reason they were never going to run the Doug Ford story.

 

[nfitz]

The New York Times IS a newspaper of record with excellent, world class reporters. They have some of the best in the world (the have Paul Krugman, who won a Nobel Prize, writing an article every week...who does the Star have?) You aren't comparing the Star to the NY Times, are you?

The New York Times is a national paper. It started out as a local, and morphed nationally. It's easy to find the New York Times in Chicago, LA, Vancouver ... pretty much anywhere. You can't find copies of the Star easily outside of Ontario. But you can find the Globe and Mail (which also morphed out of local papers) and the National Post across the nation.

Funny, we've gone from "international reputation" to a "city paper"... "one of the best in North America". Soon we'll be down to the "most respect left leaning paper in Toronto". Well, it is more reputable than Now Magazine, so I'll give them that.

The Star is a well respected non-national paper. As is the Vancouver Sun, Winnipeg Free Press, Ottawa Citizen, Montreal Gazette, etc. As was once the Toronto Telegram, Montreal Star, Ottawa Journal, etc.

 

[MetroMan]

This Hotz guy is an idiot. The last thing we need if for Ford nation to have "evidence" that the video was fake.

This is in fact what is already happening. People think this is the video and then cry that the whole thing was faked. It's really disheartening to realize that a large portion of the population has a terribly low IQ. People are so easily fooled.

 

[Electrify]

Even a video would not prove it was crack. It could be heroin, it could be marijuana, it could be tobacco. All a video would show is he's a liar and did in fact smoke (something) from a pipe, in the company of drug dealers. And he would have to go because of that... in disgrace.

A video would prove he's a lying dirtbag that smokes (something) in the company of drug dealers. Not necessarily crack.

And that he referred to his football team as "a bunch of fucking minorities."

I will say this though, earlier one asked if Ford was a liberal if we would be so determined to see his downfall. Personally, I hate to admit it, but chances are I would not - assuming he was competent. And yes, there is an argument that what one says or does in their private time is their business.

That said, Ford has spent his entire time in office being as polarizing as possible, not to mention holding transit back a decade by using the allure of subways as a red herring. Worst of all, his shallow propaganda continues to hold significant meaning to a sizable number of Torontonians.

While this video may not take his most loyal supporters out of denial, it will provide physical evidence of Ford's hypocrisy for everyone to see.

Finally, on a side note, other than maybe meth I cannot think of a worse drug for him to be recorded using! If he was caught smoking pot, most people would not care. Even cocaine would not look all that bad. But crack?! That drug is almost exclusive to street junkies and addicts.

 

[FutureBuilder]

No. And it doesn't need to be. I do know that the two reporters are A+ and very well respected by their peers. Disagree? Editorials and columns are what separate the reputation of newspapers.... There is not much difference between beat writers at the Globe and Star.



They have anonymous testimony. The Star has firsthand eye-witness accounts from their own reporters. The Star has a tighter story! The Globe pretty much expects to be sued....Stackhouse admitted as much. There is a reason they were never going to run the Doug Ford story.

I don't think that is the case. They have first hand testimony from people that bought/sold drugs during that time. Something like 10 different people.

The Globe will not be sued. Doug Ford even said it would be pointless (something along the lines of the Globe having rich, powerful owners, these law suits take a lot of time, and cost a lot of money). Trust me, if you said I dealt drugs I would sue you, no matter what.

And I don't disagree the Star reporters are more than likely telling the truth. However, if they were sued and couldn't produce the tape, what do you think the outcome would be in court?

I just wish if the tape exists it it shown on national tv and we put all this crap to rest.

 

[Blovertis]

Actually no it is not. The Globe is considered the ONLY "newspaper of record" in Canada.

The Star, as I said, is a joke. It is not known internationally, nor have I EVER seen it quoted in a foreign country (other media). Breaking a story about a potential crack head mayor is exactly what I said.... tabloid.

I know hardcore Toronto Star readers are thick, but come one.

I know it must hurt to see your hero going down -- why else would you (and others) be putting so much effort into shooting the messenger?

Whether the Star is the "newspaper of record" is entirely beside the point. It has a long-established reputation for credibility and has been on a bit of a roll over the last five years. I wonder if you were calling it "tabloid" when it was breaking stories on eHealth and the cost overruns at the TDSB? We wouldn't even know about the ORNGE fiasco if it wasn't for the investigative reporting by Kevin Donovan (who BTW also viewed the Ford crack video).

 

[Torontovibe]

Given the severity of the claims I don't think any normal person would make it up. However, to be 100% certain I'd need to see a video. If they find it, the mayor is gone in disgrace. If it never is shown to the public, and never surfaces, we're stuck with him until the next election or he decides to resign.

If it exists, I'd really like to see it.

If the video shows up, how is the mayor gone? Ford has no shame and he will just refuse to resign. There is nothing that can be done to remove him from office. He will not resign on his own, it's not in his nature. Sadly, we are stuck with Ford until the next election, either way.

 

[OSS 117]

The New York Times IS a newspaper of record with excellent, world class reporters. They have some of the best in the world (the have Paul Krugman, who won a Nobel Prize, writing an article every week...who does the Star have?) You aren't comparing the Star to the NY Times, are you?


Funny, we've gone from "international reputation" to a "city paper"... "one of the best in North America". Soon we'll be down to the "most respect left leaning paper in Toronto". Well, it is more reputable than Now Magazine, so I'll give them that.

I'm not making any sort of qualitative judgment. it's called the TORONTO Star. Toronto is a city, therefore it's a city paper. The Globe And Mail is a national paper. It's not surprising that outside the country you might see more references to a paper serving all of Canada than to one dedicated to it's home city. And I wasn't comparing the Star to the New York Times except in the sense that both seem to summon up a knee-jerk hatred in conservatives.

 

[FutureBuilder]

I know it must hurt to see your hero going down -- why else would you (and others) be putting so much effort into shooting the messenger?

Whether the Star is the "newspaper of record" is entirely beside the point. It has a long-established reputation for credibility and has been on a bit of a roll over the last five years. I wonder if you were calling it "tabloid" when it was breaking stories on eHealth and the cost overruns at the TDSB? We wouldn't even know about the ORNGE fiasco if it wasn't for the investigative reporting by Kevin Donovan (who BTW also viewed the Ford crack video).

Rob Ford my hero? LOL Right, because you've known me for how long?

My point is simple, and I keep repeating it: when you say someone smoked crack, you cannot prove it by saying "I saw the video". We need to see the actual video.

 

[FutureBuilder]

If the video shows up, how is the mayor gone? Ford has no shame and he will just refuse to resign. There is nothing that can be done to remove him from office. He will not resign on his own, it's not in his nature. Sadly, we are stuck with Ford until the next election, either way.

Shame or no shame, if a video comes out he is gone. I think (but I may be wrong) the Premier has the ability to call an election. If he didn't step down, there would be an election, and there is no way he would win.

 

[OSS 117]

I don't think that is the case. They have first hand testimony from people that bought/sold drugs during that time. Something like 10 different people.

The Globe will not be sued. Doug Ford even said it would be pointless (something along the lines of the Globe having rich, powerful owners, these law suits take a lot of time, and cost a lot of money). Trust me, if you said I dealt drugs I would sue you, no matter what.

And I don't disagree the Star reporters are more than likely telling the truth. However, if they were sued and couldn't produce the tape, what do you think the outcome would be in court?

I just wish if the tape exists it it shown on national tv and we put all this crap to rest.

If the tape doesn't appear, the Star would only have to worry if they referenced sources that don't exist. As it is, their story revolves around two reporters giving eyewitness testimony about what they saw, and at no point did they say it was Rob Ford, only that it appeared to be Rob Ford. They're in no danger whatsoever.

 

[Blovertis]

My point is simple, and I keep repeating it: when you say someone smoked crack, you cannot prove it by saying "I saw the video". We need to see the actual video.

Well, I haven't seen the video of Luka Magnotta dismembering his victim... but I'm fairly confident the cops got the right man.