Rob Ford's Toronto

[DSCToronto]

I think the last change was in 2000. See: http://www.toronto.ca/wards/options2000.htm

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

The city wards are based on the provincial ridings, which in turn are based on the federal ridings, cut in half.

Unfortunately, the federal ridings give better representation to the rural population. The more urban the ridings, the larger the population base. The more rural the ridings, the smaller the population base. Suburban is the "happy" medium.

 

[Tee]

Run Robo Flop, runnnnnnnnnnnn.....THUD!!!

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/04/15/mayor-rob-ford-drops-f-bomb-after-walking-into-camera

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The city wards are based on the provincial ridings, which in turn are based on the federal ridings, cut in half.

Unfortunately, the federal ridings give better representation to the rural population. The more urban the ridings, the larger the population base. The more rural the ridings, the smaller the population base. Suburban is the "happy" medium.

Someone needs to fix this. You can't just underrepresent half the nation.

 

[BurlOak]

The city wards are based on the provincial ridings, which in turn are based on the federal ridings, cut in half.

Unfortunately, the federal ridings give better representation to the rural population. The more urban the ridings, the larger the population base. The more rural the ridings, the smaller the population base. Suburban is the "happy" medium.

I am not sure this is correct. In Toronto, most of the population growth occurred in 1 or 2 downtown ridings. When you look at which ridings had the largest population when they were redrawn, you would get the suburban ones like Oakville-Halton, Vaughan, Markham, etc.

I agree the rural ones have lower population. There was a thread about the redistribution that I could look up if I was more energetic.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

I think it's time to redraw the wards in Toronto. Denser areas are far underrepresented.

Downtown Toronto, the single most dense area in Toronto is represented by a SINGLE councillor. The same thing can be said about surrounding wards. At the same time, areas with lower population density in Western Etobicoke and Eastern Scarborough have greater political representation. This is clearly not a very fair or democratic system. The Downtown ward alone should have representation from at least two councillors. I would like to see legislation that would mandate that the drawing of wards be revisited every 20 years to solve this issue. If the Fords bring up the issue of the number of councillors, it would be a great time to bring this issue up.

Downtown (including Toronto Islands) is split with three City Councillors (should be four or five given the enormous workload IMO), Wards 20, 27 & 28

 

[historydude2012]

Downtown (including Toronto Islands) is split with three City Councillors (should be four or five given the enormous workload IMO), Wards 20, 27 & 28

Yea I mean I get from a representational standpoint why you could argue for needing more councillors, but having volunteered in a councillors office myself from my experience staff typically handle most problems not the actual councillor (especially since a lot of the time we directed these folks to 311). I can't speak for every councillor obviously though. I don't know if adding councillors is really needed from a workload standpoint.

 

[Peepers]

Run Robo Flop, runnnnnnnnnnnn.....THUD!!!

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/04/15/mayor-rob-ford-drops-f-bomb-after-walking-into-camera

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

Yea I mean I get from a representational standpoint why you could argue for needing more councillors, but having volunteered in a councillors office myself from my experience staff typically handle most problems not the actual councillor (especially since a lot of the time we directed these folks to 311). I can't speak for every councillor obviously though. I don't know if adding councillors is really needed from a workload standpoint.

They are well trained and well connected to deal with problems like "my streetlights are out", "I slipped & hurt myself on an icy sidewalk" & "the big pile of snow made by the snow plow still hasn't melted behind my building and it's May" (Kyle Rae gifted me with that classic!) and pass on the important issues & missed calls to the Councillor. The Councillor can't send one of his/her assistants to community meetings, ceremonies, public events, Council meetings, briefings with City Staff, City Planners or legal council - Vaughan, KWT and McConnell have a heck of a lot on their plates right now with so much happening in their wards. You'll never see one of those people shopping at a strip mall at 4:30 on a weekday afternoon near their home (had to get that in!).

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

They are well trained and well connected to deal with problems like "my streetlights are out", "I slipped & hurt myself on an icy sidewalk" & "the big pile of snow made by the snow plow still hasn't melted behind my building and it's May" (Kyle Rae gifted me with that classic!) and pass on the important issues & missed calls to the Councillor. The Councillor can't send one of his/her assistants to community meetings, ceremonies, public events, Council meetings, briefings with City Staff, City Planners or legal council - Vaughan, KWT and McConnell have a heck of a lot on their plates right now with so much happening in their wards. You'll never see one of those people shopping at a strip mall at 4:30 on a weekday afternoon near their home (had to get that in!).

Some of the councilors may actually READ the city reports, correspondence, and agreements they get. I'm sure they have staff who read the newspapers and blogs (like urbantoronto.ca), and cut & paste and pass the information onto the councilor.

 

[DSCToronto]

Some of the councilors may actually READ the city reports, correspondence, and agreements they get. I'm sure they have staff who read the newspapers and blogs (like urbantoronto.ca), and cut & paste and pass the information onto the councilor.

I live in Ward 28 and must say that Pam McConnell and her staff work very hard and have very long hours. I do not always agree with how she deals with things but one cannot fault her or her staff for lack of effort. Pam herself is constantly popping up at community meetings, festivities and events and she clearly knows her Ward very well and her staff are also well informed of the problems and opportunities in her Ward and how best to solve problems. That is, in fact, part of the problem as Councillors in Toronto - compared to those in the thre other Cities in which I have lived - seem to have to spend far too much time dealing with minor problems -e.g. driveways, litter, signs and potholes - and thus have less to spend on things such as long-term planning and 'city building'. Now that the City's 311 service is up and running and seems to be pretty efficient this may encourage citizens to use it before 'calling my Councillor' . Councillors like the Fords who love to solve minor problems (but seem uninterested in or unaware of the larger issues) will not like this; Councillors like Pam McConnell, Adam Vaughn and a few others who see the 'big picture' may have more time to study it. If Councillors and their staff could get away from solving these minor - but important - local problems then the number of Councillors could probably be reduced and those who remained could devote more time to the larger issues.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

This has went straight into my GIF folder!

As a side note, why does Rob Ford walk like a penguin? The man is always waddling his way around city hall.

 

[CDL.TO]

I think it's time to redraw the wards in Toronto. Denser areas are far underrepresented.

Take a look at the population density vs. the number of wards

Downtown Toronto, the single most dense area in Toronto is represented by a SINGLE councillor. The same thing can be said about surrounding wards. At the same time, areas with lower population density in Western Etobicoke and Eastern Scarborough have greater political representation. This is clearly not a very fair or democratic system. The Downtown ward alone should have representation from at least two councillors. I would like to see legislation that would mandate that the drawing of wards be revisited every 20 years to solve this issue. If the Fords bring up the issue of the number of councillors, it would be a great time to bring this issue up.

Sorry to break it to you, but your description of both maps are wrong.

The top map is population + EMPLOYMENT density. Employment isn't relevant to discussions about representation.

The bottom map is out of date (13 years old?) and doesn't reflect the current boundaries.

 

[ShonTron]

The city wards are based on the provincial ridings, which in turn are based on the federal ridings, cut in half.

Unfortunately, the federal ridings give better representation to the rural population. The more urban the ridings, the larger the population base. The more rural the ridings, the smaller the population base. Suburban is the "happy" medium.

Nope doesn't quite work that way. Certainly not in the GTA where the central suburban ring riding are the least proportionally represented. Brampton West, the most populated riding in Canada, is at 204,146 in 2011, nearly more than double the average. But redistribution will fix this (for now) and the only ridings with substantial over-representation in Ontario are the North, and I'm okay with that. There's a case for geographic size and relative remoteness factoring in to the formula.

Sorry to break it to you, but your description of both maps are wrong.

The top map is population + EMPLOYMENT density. Employment isn't relevant to discussions about representation.

The bottom map is out of date (13 years old?) and doesn't reflect the current boundaries.

Blast from the past! That map is based on the old provincial ridings (before the Harris government cut the number of seats from 130 to 103 for the 1999 provincial and 2000 municipal elections). Each of those wards had two councillors, except East York, which had three (since it was underrepresented). Having two councillor positions for the same area made for some strange bedfellows. In that first 1997 election, get this, Frances Nunziata ran on a centre-left campaign and was friendly with the David Miller campaign who was running for a council seat in the same election.

 

[nfitz]

The city wards are based on the provincial ridings, which in turn are based on the federal ridings, cut in half.

They were. however the 22 federal ridings and provincial ridings were adjusted a decade ago after the 2001 census (resulting in 22.5 ridings). The city wards are still based on the 1991 census. So anywhere that has seen significant growth in population since 1991, is grossly under-represented.

With the new federal adjustment based on the 2011 census, the number of riding in Toronto will increase from 22.5 (Pickering—Scarborough East is about 50% in Toronto) to 25. If we were to use the traditional 1 riding = 2 wards system, we would have increased to 45 councillors for the 2003 or 2006 election, and would have 50 councillors for the 2014 election.

The distribution would have changed too (assuming the general community council areas remain unchanged, and the proposed new distribution is unchanged).

Area	1997	2006	2014
Etobicoke/York	11	11	11
North York	11	11	13
Scarborough	10	11	12
Toronto-East York	12	12	14
TOTAL	44	45	50

Ref 1, Ref 2, Ref 3