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Roads: Ontario/GTA Highways Discussion

I remember reading in the Mississauga News about when they rebuilt the 427/Morningstar interchange (if that's what it was) so it must have been in the last 10-15 years.
 
I started driving in 2001, which explains the lack of knowledge regarding Morning Star and the 427.
 
nfitz said:
I think it was Morning Star ... wasn't that long ago ... I used to use427 it regularly in 1994 and there was no sign of construction back then. It can't have been more than 15 years ago. 407 construction was well underway back then ... so I'd think that it would be about the same time, or newer than 407 ... so relatively recently I'd think.

Was designed before 407 was constructed, when 427 was just an artery with traffic lights; and when demand was a lot lower. Needs widening. I'm aware of the 427 QEW to 401 studies, and the 407 to further north studies, but I'm not aware of the plans for this section.
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I remember that, before even I started driving. The traffic light only affected southbound 427 traffic. Those were the days when the 427 ended north of Finch and ended at Albion Road via a remaining section of Indian Line before the 407 was opened.

I also remember the left-turn traffic light for traffic from southbound 427 to eastbound 409 before the flyover was built. That affected northbound 427 and was the only traffic light between two 400 series highways.

As for annoying bottlenecks (apart from the 401 under the 427), one that really gets me is how the 401 collectors westbound go to 2 lanes under the Allen Road, this is after navigating all the traffic headed off on the 400 and again all the traffic headed to Yorkdale or Orfus Road clogging up the approach to the Dufferin/Yorkdale exit.
 
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The 427/Morningstar light was gone by at least 2000. I remember it but it was eliminated with a overpass around 2000. I didn't start driving regularly until around 1998 and can clearly remember not having to deal with it, so maybe it was even before 2000.

The bottleneck on the 427 northbound at that area is in part due to the traffic coming off of both the 401 and 409 to the 427 and the funky design of the 427 at Rexdale blvd. The 409 interchange adds it's own share of congestion but because the far right lane exits off to Rexdale blvd and a load of traffic is forced to merge into the middle lane in order to continue north, dumb design. Similarly to the ramp from east bound 407 to north bound 427 which simply ends just before the interchange with hwy 7 (which prior to last year was the terminus for the 427) a silly design forcing drivers to merge even if they are turning right. That land should become the far right lane for the ramp leading to hwy 7. Though North of Rexdale traffic flows pretty smoothly
 
Province puts brakes on controversial highway

A highway plan connecting the Niagara peninsula with the GTA, but possibly degrading part of the escarpment, will not proceed as planned.

The proposed 400-series highway, the so-called “asphalt arrow,†would have linked Niagara Falls to Hamilton via Burlington, and connect to highways 401, 403 or 407, providing an alternative to the QEW.

The province said a more focused analysis would be conducted in the future.

“We are not going to just assume we need to pave a mega highway through the escarpment,†said Kelly Baker, a transportation ministry spokesperson.

On Tuesday, Halton Regional chair Gary Carr expressed his pleasure that the Niagara-to-GTA corridor would not go forward.

“Together we have protected the Niagara Escarpment and our natural heritage for future generations to enjoy,†Carr said in a news release.

Proponents argued the highway would encourage job growth in the region. But critics, including community groups, environmentalists, Halton regional council and Burlington city council applauded the decision.
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http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...nce-puts-brakes-on-controversial-highway?bn=1
 
The next highway the NIMBYs want to block is the one suggested to start in north Milton and cut through Georgetown going east.

Blocking the escarpment one had some environmental merits, I think, but this one is pure NIMBY -- mostly existing residents blocking a highway that will support future expansion of their towns.

Counterproductive in the long run because these towns WILL expand and traffic will be terrible for everyone.
 
mattbg said:
The next highway the NIMBYs want to block is the one suggested to start in north Milton and cut through Georgetown going east.

Blocking the escarpment one had some environmental merits, I think, but this one is pure NIMBY -- mostly existing residents blocking a highway that will support future expansion of their towns.

Counterproductive in the long run because these towns WILL expand and traffic will be terrible for everyone.
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You know this one cuts through just as large of a swath of Niagara Escarpment as the Mid-Pen, right?
 
mattbg said:
Blocking the escarpment one had some environmental merits, I think, but this one is pure NIMBY -- mostly existing residents blocking a highway that will support future expansion of their towns.
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Why should they want future car-oriented expansion?

mattbg said:
Counterproductive in the long run because these towns WILL expand and traffic will be terrible for everyone.
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It's pretty silly to claim that the amount of expansion is not dependent on the construction of new highways.
 
I'm very glad to see the government pouring cold water on the Mid-Pen. I'm not against the idea of some road improvements, or even against some new intercity freeways. For me the killer was the north Burlington approach over the Escarpment. I would be more open to a Hamilton-Guelph/Kichener freeway for example. I'm not at all in favour of the so-called 413 through Georgetown either, that will be as destructive as the inner portion of the Mid-Pen.
 
ShonTron said:
I'm very glad to see the government pouring cold water on the Mid-Pen. I'm not against the idea of some road improvements, or even against some new intercity freeways. For me the killer was the north Burlington approach over the Escarpment. I would be more open to a Hamilton-Guelph/Kichener freeway for example. I'm not at all in favour of the so-called 413 through Georgetown either, that will be as destructive as the inner portion of the Mid-Pen.
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I agree with this. I would definitely support a Highway 406 from the 403 to the 401. Driving Highway 6 from Hamilton to the 401 is less than ideal. Too many cars for a 2/4 lane undivided highway.
 
My ideal route would be to take the existing Highway 6 expressway (Hanlon Parkway), extend it south from the 401 and parallel to the old Highway 52 alignment and have it terminate near the 403/52 Jerseyville interchange. Kitchener/Guelph to Hamilton needs a freeway stat.

Getting back to the Mid-Pen, I'd be open to an extension south of this 408 or 452 route to run towards Niagara, but not as a freeway. It would perhaps be as a resurrected Highway 53/ Highway 20 as a "poor man's" Mid Pen highway, with passing lanes and some upgraded treatments and a Welland-Niagara Falls quasi-expressway, diverting some traffic that doesn't need to be on the QEW off the QEW with minimal impacts. I'd like to see some imagination; I am sick and tired of the MTO's insistence on full 400-series grade freeway or nothing; there's lots of solutions in between. How about some more passing lanes where traffic is heavy, like Highway 10 north of Shelburne and Highway 12? Those are very frustrating drives.
 
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mpd618 said:
Why should they want future car-oriented expansion?
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Because the people of Georgetown have done nothing to alleviate car congestion. They don't even have a transit system and the town population actively rejects one to the extent that the mayor is now promising that "not to worry -- we don't have plans to build transit until 2031 and even then it'll only be very small".

Georgetown also has an annoying pretense of being a "small rural town". It is not. The construction of Georgetown South should have put a nail through that particular myth, but it won't go away.

Lake water is coming to Georgetown in future. It will be hooked up at the south end. The south end will then explode with development and the north end will have reclaimed water supply available for northern expansion. If they agree to siphon traffic onto existing highways at the present rate with their little one-lane roads coming out of town, maybe it won't be so bad. But I have a feeling they won't be content to do that quietly in order to keep the peace and quiet they are asking for.

It's pretty silly to claim that the amount of expansion is not dependent on the construction of new highways.
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Have you looked at the west end of the 401 lately? They built it, and they came... but they can barely leave these days.
 
Considering the deficit Ontario is facing, some of these projects are pretty ambitious.

My somewhat smaller ideas:
69/400: Finish the four lane section being constructed near highway 637 - it's due to open in 2012. Leave the rest of highway 69 intact for now, as the most dangerous/congested parts of 69 have been bypassed (Nobel and the S-curve at 637). Except for Point-au-Baril, there are almost no communities directly on 69 and traffic volumes do not warrant immediate construction.

400: Barrie to Toronto: another lane or 2 (maybe 1 general purpose + 1 HOV?) - the right of way exists and the older overpasses are being replaced, so it seems like a logical upgrade. It would be cheaper than acquiring land and building new sets of overpasses for a 410 extension.

417: Ottawa: Expansion to a consistent 8-lane cross section from Kanata to the Split (Ottawa Road 174) is about the best that can be done at a reasonable cost (limited right-of-way)
17/417: Arnprior - Renfrew: Extend highway 417 to highway 60 at Renfrew. Beyond that, traffic doesn't merit a four-lane divided highway yet, especially after Petawawa. Having driven 17/417 between Ottawa and Sudbury repeatedly, I can safely say that the terrain past Deep River is very unsuited to cheaply constructing a four-lane divided highway and there is minimal demand for such an endeavor. Although a divided, four-lane Trans Canada would be a boon to cross country travel, there is a reason it hasn't happened - it would cost $$$ and likely be very underused.

401: Windsor-Essex parkway + Detroit River International Crossing
Six lanes from Windsor to London
Eight lanes through London
Six lanes from London to K-W
Eight (or 10 ) lanes from K-W to 407 interchange
Collector-express from 407 interchange to 427
Try and reunite the two sections of Collector-Express (that would truly be a project for the ages)
Eight (preferably 10) lanes through Oshawa (is that possible?)

QEW (sort of): Twin Peace bridge (need the feds for that, I know)
Continue with 6- and 8-lane expansion through St. Catharines and Niagara region

7- Kitchener to Guelph: 4.5 lane cross section

I'm not too sure about any of the other highways - I'm just commenting on the ones I travel regularly.
 
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