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Roads: Gardiner Expressway

Watching Kathleen Wynne crumble feels like slow motion, because we saw Dalton do it several years ago, and its exactly the same thing. No principle or idea too good to sell out, grasping at the next election.

That said, if this causes the Gardiner East boondoggle to crumble too, fine.
 
CapitalSeven said:
Watching Kathleen Wynne crumble feels like slow motion, because we saw Dalton do it several years ago, and its exactly the same thing.
Click to expand...

And look how badly it turned out for him!

Anyways, it seems like the provincial government is gonna provide transit funding similar to what the tolls would've yielded.
 
44 North said:
Wait, what the hell. The toll was a very reasonable $2-3, had significant support, was on City expwys, and wasn't going to be implemented for years. How can she do this?
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I gave Tory rare credit for doing something good and brave, even if it was politically calculated. But I shake my head at all the jubilant excitement that took place when this was first announced:

"EXCELLENT NEWS! $300 million a year will be able to fund incredible investments in the TTC. Downtown Relief Line may just one day get built."

"This is the best news I've read in a long time. This $2 toll could build the entire Relief Line (from Dundas West to Don Mills), complete Crosstown West and East, SmartTrack and build waterfront transit, if the funds were generated over 30 years with 50% of the cost paid by the other levels of government. This has potential to be absolutely transformative for our city. If Tory pushes this through, and if he supports the right project, he'll have won my vote come 2018."

"We'll finally have continual funds to build rapid transit expansion for our city. This means that our future transit debates shouldn't be as hung up on by questions on how we'll pay for it."'
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^ Needless to day, I hope they're feeling pretty good tonight.

I warned people not to get too excited too early. The fact that it was planned to start in 2024 - after several municipal and provincial elections - that alone was a near guarantee for failure. I pointed out that the money (which was really not that much) is only enough to pay for the Gardiner - which they quietly announced that same day that the cost had gone up by another billions dollars. Not until we are well into the 2030s would these tolls have funded transit in a major way, which is quite a long time from now isn't it? So no, this does NOT pay for the "entire relief line", you gullible fools. No, this does NOT make our transit dreams come true. And of course, this needed approval from the hated premier who somehow thinks she still has a chance to win an election. Even the NDP opposes it, and the Cons promised to repeal the tolls if elected. I still had some hope that the mayor could convince Wynne to support this, but alas even that was not to be.

So with that, the idea of road tolls in Toronto is dead for at least another generation. Regardless of what is announced tomorrow, this is very disappointing.
 
Last edited:
Don't worry. The Gardiner hybrid is safe. Patrick Brown will divert resources by cancelling all lrt lines and divert the funds to this project.
 
amnesiajune said:
Anyways, it seems like the provincial government is gonna provide transit funding similar to what the tolls would've yielded.
Click to expand...
More like very much on the low end of what the tolls would've yielded, and after the 2018 provincial election when Wynne will likely not be in office anyway. Those promises are meaningless.
 
Received a Notice of Submission of Environmental Assessment.

Gardiner Expressway and Lake Shore Boulevard East Reconfiguration Environmental Assessment and Integrated Urban Design Study

f655790d-8f47-4d45-b193-e8c664830337.jpg


The City of Toronto and Waterfront Toronto have completed the environmental assessment for the Gardiner Expressway and Lake Shore Boulevard East Reconfiguration Environmental Assessment and Integrated Urban Design Study (Gardiner EA). As required under section 6.2(1) of the Environmental Assessment Act (Act) and according to the Terms of Reference approved by the Minister of the Environment and Climate Change on November 30, 2009, the Gardiner EA has been submitted to the Ministry of the Environment and Climate Change (MOECC) for review and approval.

The proposed Gardiner EA project involves changes to the existing Gardiner Expressway and Lake Shore Boulevard from approximately Lower Jarvis Street to just east of the Don Valley Parkway at Logan Avenue. The City of Toronto Council endorsed the ‘Hybrid Alternative Design Three’ option as the preferred alternative design for the project. It includes the removal of the existing Gardiner-DVP connection and rebuilding of the connection along an alignment closer to the rail corridor. The preferred alternative design also requires the lengthening of the Metrolinx Don River/DVP rail bridge, removal of the Logan Street ramps and the addition of two ramps in Keating Channel Precinct.

As required under the Act, the Gardiner EA will be available for public review and comment from January 27, 2017 to March 17, 2017.

A hard copy of the Gardiner EA can be viewed at the MOECC (135 St. Clair Avenue West, 1st Floor), Toronto City Hall Library (100 Queen Street West, Main Floor), Waterfront Toronto (20 Bay Street, Suite 1310), during regular business hours. An electronic copy of the Gardiner EA can also be viewed on the Gardiner East website at: www.gardinereast.ca/participate.
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See link.
​
 
amnesiajune said:
And look how badly it turned out for him!

Anyways, it seems like the provincial government is gonna provide transit funding similar to what the tolls would've yielded.
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Not nearly as much and how is that amount (from gas revenues) accountable?
 
Neil said:
So, no QEW HOT lanes as well? ;)
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Not really a common opinion to those that matter to the Liberal party.

The Gardiner/DVP tolls are not seen in the same negative light as HOT lanes by that group. I'm glad its cancelled because it slightly hinders the lower income class from accessing the core. Wynne is glad because it grabs votes from the 905 and listens to those that provide financial support to her campaign. Whereas the HOT lanes are seen more as a benefit to those business folks who have access.

These Liberals are amazing at pulling the right strings to get votes leading into the election. They have a good grasp on the voting base and amongst the never ending scandals I would never count them out.
 
Palma said:
Plus these people can afford to drive cars and use the Gardiner or DVP for travelling some distance and pay for gas! I say they should take down the Gardiner. Can the province stop that?
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John Tory and any other Politician that wants to be Mayor in this City will stop that idea. Aside from select areas of the City we don't have the infrastructure to support such radical ideas at this time
 
OneCity said:
Aside from select areas of the City we don't have the infrastructure to support such radical ideas at this time
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It's also just not a realistic proposal. Gardiner East traffic is roughly the same as inbound traffic for the entire downtown core (north of the railway, west of the Don River, east of Bathurst, south of Dupont. Even with a four-lane boulevard replacing it, downtown streets would be swamped with traffic.

https://www1.toronto.ca/city_of_toronto/city_planning/home/files/pdf/cordon_count_2006.pdf
http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2014/pw/bgrd/backgroundfile-67146.pdf
 
amnesiajune said:
It's also just not a realistic proposal. Gardiner East traffic is roughly the same as inbound traffic for the entire downtown core (north of the railway, west of the Don River, east of Bathurst, south of Dupont. Even with a four-lane boulevard replacing it, downtown streets would be swamped with traffic.

https://www1.toronto.ca/city_of_toronto/city_planning/home/files/pdf/cordon_count_2006.pdf
http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2014/pw/bgrd/backgroundfile-67146.pdf
Click to expand...

That report is a decade old and takes into account data from as far back as 1985.

I haven't seen a shred of actually decent evidence that suggest replacing the Gardiner East with a boulevard would significantly add to traffic delays, and that report sure as hell is not that.
 
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