isittimetomoveyet
Active Member
I've heard that during the Ontario-Quebec meetings this has been brought up. Has anyone read anything newsworthy?
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Rail: Ontario-Quebec High Speed Rail Study
- Thread starter isittimetomoveyet
- Start date
waterloowarrior
Senior Member
Quebec, Ontario firm on train line
Kevin Dougherty
The Gazette
Monday, June 02, 2008
QUEBEC - Quebec and Ontario are rebranding themselves as "Central Canada," with plans to work more closely together that include a Quebec City-to-Windsor high-speed train, as a green alternative to a new
highway 401 linking the two provinces.
"It's called Central Canada and its time for us to assert ourselves once again," said Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty at the end of thefirst-ever joint Quebec-Ontario cabinet meeting in the historic Château Frontenac Hotel.
The two premiers agreed to a followup joint-cabinet meeting in Toronto next year, as the two provinces continue dismantling barriers to trade and mobility, while working on greater sales of Quebec electricity to Ontario over a new 1,250-megawatt link to Hydro-Québec's generating grid and joint action to reduce greenhouse-gas emissions.
"I love the notion of the high-speed train," McGuinty told reporters."It also stitches together our country."
But while the two provinces, counting together for two-thirds of Canada's population and close to 60 per cent of it's economic output, want to work together more closely, they also recognize the federalgovernment has a role in the fast-rail link.
"We will need help from the federal government," McGuinty admitted.
Casting ahead 10 years, Premier Jean Charest, who invited McGuinty and about 14 of his ministers to meet with the Quebec cabinet, said his hopeis that Quebecers will gain an understand that federalism is not just about Quebec's relations with the federal government, but also "with the rest of the country, including our immediate neighbour and friend in Ontario."
Added, McGuinty: "Whenever Quebec and Ontario do things together, that stands to the benefit not only of our people but to the benefit of thecountry as a whole."
The two premiers and their ministers signed five agreements after their meeting. In addition to their commitment to a cap and trade plan to reduce the absolute quantity of greenhouse gas emissions in Central Canada, the provinces signed an agreement supporting Charest's proposalfor a Canada-European Union economic partnership, as well as agreementson energy, youth protection and travel exchanges and social services.
Charest explained that the importance of the two provinces agreeing on an economic partnership with Europe by recalling that last year in Davos when he broached the idea with Peter Mandelson, the European Union's
trade commissioner, Mandelson asked whether the provinces would sign on to such an agreement.
Charest said the federal government may have the power to sign international trade agreements, but, "They do not have the power to commit us in our own areas of jurisdiction."
kdougherty@thegazette.canwest.com
Kevin Dougherty
The Gazette
Monday, June 02, 2008
QUEBEC - Quebec and Ontario are rebranding themselves as "Central Canada," with plans to work more closely together that include a Quebec City-to-Windsor high-speed train, as a green alternative to a new
highway 401 linking the two provinces.
"It's called Central Canada and its time for us to assert ourselves once again," said Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty at the end of thefirst-ever joint Quebec-Ontario cabinet meeting in the historic Château Frontenac Hotel.
The two premiers agreed to a followup joint-cabinet meeting in Toronto next year, as the two provinces continue dismantling barriers to trade and mobility, while working on greater sales of Quebec electricity to Ontario over a new 1,250-megawatt link to Hydro-Québec's generating grid and joint action to reduce greenhouse-gas emissions.
"I love the notion of the high-speed train," McGuinty told reporters."It also stitches together our country."
But while the two provinces, counting together for two-thirds of Canada's population and close to 60 per cent of it's economic output, want to work together more closely, they also recognize the federalgovernment has a role in the fast-rail link.
"We will need help from the federal government," McGuinty admitted.
Casting ahead 10 years, Premier Jean Charest, who invited McGuinty and about 14 of his ministers to meet with the Quebec cabinet, said his hopeis that Quebecers will gain an understand that federalism is not just about Quebec's relations with the federal government, but also "with the rest of the country, including our immediate neighbour and friend in Ontario."
Added, McGuinty: "Whenever Quebec and Ontario do things together, that stands to the benefit not only of our people but to the benefit of thecountry as a whole."
The two premiers and their ministers signed five agreements after their meeting. In addition to their commitment to a cap and trade plan to reduce the absolute quantity of greenhouse gas emissions in Central Canada, the provinces signed an agreement supporting Charest's proposalfor a Canada-European Union economic partnership, as well as agreementson energy, youth protection and travel exchanges and social services.
Charest explained that the importance of the two provinces agreeing on an economic partnership with Europe by recalling that last year in Davos when he broached the idea with Peter Mandelson, the European Union's
trade commissioner, Mandelson asked whether the provinces would sign on to such an agreement.
Charest said the federal government may have the power to sign international trade agreements, but, "They do not have the power to commit us in our own areas of jurisdiction."
kdougherty@thegazette.canwest.com
AnarchoSocialist
Active Member
^Really it is pretty insignificant announcement. But at least the fact that the provinces seem to recognize they will have to be the ones to take the lead on this project is encouraging. At the very least Charest seems to have put the idea of a high-speed rail link with Boston behind him. Small steps, but at least the idea is gaining the momentum it needs.
Edit: I think the best sign for this project will be when you see the issue of freight companies in urban corridors dealt with (since between the cities much of it is likely to be a new right of way), and when an arangement/truce/hardline stance is reached with the airlines. That still seems a couple years off but with AMT, and especially GO, pushing for aggressive expansion at least one of the two issues is likely to be addressed seriously in the coming year, if not the coming months given the elevated attention to transit expansion as of late.
Edit: I think the best sign for this project will be when you see the issue of freight companies in urban corridors dealt with (since between the cities much of it is likely to be a new right of way), and when an arangement/truce/hardline stance is reached with the airlines. That still seems a couple years off but with AMT, and especially GO, pushing for aggressive expansion at least one of the two issues is likely to be addressed seriously in the coming year, if not the coming months given the elevated attention to transit expansion as of late.
Hipster Duck
Senior Member
Hey Anarcho,
Long time no see - welcome back to the forum. I never got the connection between Montreal and Boston. Is there a psychological link between these two cities that I don't understand? "Visit Montreal" ads seem to be plastered all over Boston.
Long time no see - welcome back to the forum. I never got the connection between Montreal and Boston. Is there a psychological link between these two cities that I don't understand? "Visit Montreal" ads seem to be plastered all over Boston.
unimaginative2
Senior Member
There is a strong historical connection between Montreal and Boston. There is also a substantial French Canadian community in Boston.
Hipster Duck
Senior Member
Yeah, but historical ties hardly justify high speed rail links.
unimaginative2
Senior Member
I agree completely. While it might be justified in the long term, it's way way down on the priority list when compared with Quebec-Windsor.
AnarchoSocialist
Active Member
^Imaginative pretty much summed up the connections well. Culturally its a nice daydream, economically it makes no sense. Much of the idea also came before Sept. 11 so with ever increasing border and immigration restrictions and challenges the idea is even less feasible than before. Not too mention the fact that only 5% of the line is in Quebec, the rest being in VT, NH, and MA, so funding issues has also been a big problem for the line. Cool and fun idea, but very low priority indeed.
RedRocket191
Senior Member
If they want to build a line to Boston, then go right ahead I say. But since only 5% of the line will be in Quebec, they shouldn't have to pay any more than 5% of the cost. I fully agree that isn't not a high priority, but I would like to hope that they won't pass up quick wins in favour of waiting indefinitely for super projects to get full funding.
Of course, everyone has a different definition of what a quick win is...
Of course, everyone has a different definition of what a quick win is...
ShonTron
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Actually, if they do build it, I would say that Quebec should put in more than 5% of the cost, as they'll get more than 5% of the benefit. There would possibly be a stop in Longueil as well.
How many stops would there be for a high-speed line in Vermont?
Perhaps Burlington. Montpelier/Barre ("urban" population of about 14,000) hardly makes sense.
New Hampshire, likewise. Manchester is the only city of any significance in that state on a Montreal-Boston route for high-speed rail.
While I'm sure there's some market for a Montreal-Boston high speed line, there's nothing in between to build enough of a market at this time. Trust me, I've driven it. Montreal-New York makes more sense, at least there's the sizable Albany-Schenectady-Troy region and a strong demand on the southern Empire Corridor.
How many stops would there be for a high-speed line in Vermont?
Perhaps Burlington. Montpelier/Barre ("urban" population of about 14,000) hardly makes sense.
New Hampshire, likewise. Manchester is the only city of any significance in that state on a Montreal-Boston route for high-speed rail.
While I'm sure there's some market for a Montreal-Boston high speed line, there's nothing in between to build enough of a market at this time. Trust me, I've driven it. Montreal-New York makes more sense, at least there's the sizable Albany-Schenectady-Troy region and a strong demand on the southern Empire Corridor.
AnarchoSocialist
Active Member
RedRocket makes a good point. If by some outside chance funding for rail projects in the US suddenly became available and there was a strong interest from that side to make investments that could make a Montreal-Boston line possible, then it would be an opportunity that should not be overlooked and considered seriously. I agree with Sean that Quebec should pay more than 5% since it will gain a great deal more than that in benefits. Even if they were required to pay 20% then it might not be a bad deal for them (sort of an arbitrary percentage but seems a good estimate of a maximum level of investment that Quebec should make in such a line).
I can understand choosing a line to Boston over New York though. Boston is closer and if there were a high speed connection between New York and Boston (such as an Accela type line, though I would hope in the future they will opt for something a little more advanced and reliable) then it would work well as a starting point into the heart of the eastern seaboard megalopolis region.
I can understand choosing a line to Boston over New York though. Boston is closer and if there were a high speed connection between New York and Boston (such as an Accela type line, though I would hope in the future they will opt for something a little more advanced and reliable) then it would work well as a starting point into the heart of the eastern seaboard megalopolis region.
Dan416
Senior Member
I have a friend who lives in Boston and he keeps dreaming of a day when Montreal and Boston are linked by rail. It doesn't even have to be high-speed.
khris
Senior Member
They mention in the article about it being a green alternative, however according to the article posted earlier in this thread, the type of train is the diesel run high speed trains.
How is that a green alternative. The green alternative would be using a TGV like train which runs on hydro-electricity.
How is that a green alternative. The green alternative would be using a TGV like train which runs on hydro-electricity.
RedRocket191
Senior Member
It's greener when you compare it to the alternative of having X many cars on the highway.
Dan416
Senior Member
Gotta start somewhere.