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Novel Coronavirus COVID-19 (nCoV-2019)

Max Sterling said:
Are you serious?!?!??!! Mandatory vaccination over such a non-lethal virus for the vast majority of the population? Well I guess we now know that constant fearmongering from the media and government works extremely well to brainwash people and get them to do what you want.

We've already vaccinated most if not all long term care residents and many seniors and others in the general population and as a result deaths in Ontario are very low now. So as we keep vaccinating the elderly until most of them have gotten a shot, why would everyone else need to get a shot when they're barely affected after all this time?

And while everyone was so concentrated on covid deaths where to date about 7,300 people in Ontario have died from, we lose sight of the fact that 100,000+ people died in the same time period in the province. Namely why are we still so concerned about dying by covid when there's far more things that have killed people in the past year covering a far larger portion of the population? How about we stop worrying so much about dying by covid and worry more about all the damage we've done to ourselves for no good reason?
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You can go right ahead and talk to those getting admitted into ICU wards right now, in person, without a mask or any other PPE - and pick the ones with the variant as well, if you are that brave. Oh, and make sure you go and be with your loved ones after doing so as well.

AoD
 
Richard White said:
I realize that. I also have a College Diploma in Business and have worked very closely with small business owners for the pasts 15 years. With financial backers and some expertise it may work. It won't be easy but it is still better than the alternative.

I already have the business plan drafted up pending modifications post-covid.
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Good luck, I assume you will be offering a UT discount :->
 
Max Sterling said:
Are you serious?!?!??!! Mandatory vaccination over such a non-lethal virus for the vast majority of the population? Well I guess we now know that constant fearmongering from the media and government works extremely well to brainwash people and get them to do what you want.

We've already vaccinated most if not all long term care residents and many seniors and others in the general population and as a result deaths in Ontario are very low now. So as we keep vaccinating the elderly until most of them have gotten a shot, why would everyone else need to get a shot when they're barely affected after all this time?

And while everyone was so concentrated on covid deaths where to date about 7,300 people in Ontario have died from, we lose sight of the fact that 100,000+ people died in the same time period in the province. Namely why are we still so concerned about dying by covid when there's far more things that have killed people in the past year covering a far larger portion of the population? How about we stop worrying so much about dying by covid and worry more about all the damage we've done to ourselves for no good reason?
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You write quite well but clearly cannot read (or maybe understand). This from Star a few minutes ago .....

With Ontario set to go into a 28-day lockdown, new computer modelling of COVID-19 shows people who catch highly contagious new variants of the virus are twice as likely to end up in a hospital intensive care unit.

It is sweeping through some homes with a vengeance, said Steini Brown, head of the Dalla Lana School of Public Health at the University of Toronto and co-chair of the science table of experts advising Premier Doug Ford.

“Whole families are now showing up in intensive care,” he told a briefing Thursday before Ford announced full details of the lockdown to begin Saturday.

The risk of dying is 1.5 times higher with the dominant B.1.1.7 variant first identified in the United Kingdom, the odds of ending up on a ventilator are three times higher and the risks of transmitting it quickly to another person are 2.5 times higher.

“This COVID is killing faster and younger,” Brown added, noting more adults under 60 are ending up in hospital with it. “We cannot vaccinate fast enough.”

Hospitalizations in Ontario have surged by almost 42 per cent in the last two weeks, Brown said.

Chief medical officer Dr. David Williams said the average daily death rate has grown by almost 50 per cent to 16 people a day from 11 last week.

see: https://www.thestar.com/politics/pr...ford-prepares-for-province-wide-lockdown.html
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
What we need is mandatory vaccination - with exceptions only for valid medical conditions. No ifs, ands or buts.

AoD
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Without arguing against the efficacy of such an act...........

We already have a number of very serious conditions, for which we have vaccinations, none of which are mandatory.

There is no precedent for such an action.

Are you advocating the same action for Polio, Rubella, Measles, Mumps etc?
 
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Northern Light said:
Without arguing against the efficacy of such an act...........

We already have a number of very serious conditions, for which we have vaccinations, none of which are mandatory.

There is no precedent for such an action.

Are you advocating the same action for Polio, Rubella, Measles, Mumps etc?
Click to expand...

I don't have the slightest hesitation in advocating the same - especially if we are having an ongonig pandemic of these diseases. We know we had been having increasing number of measles outbreaks due to declining vaccination rates over the past decade or so.

AoD
 
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Max Sterling said:
Are you serious?!?!??!! Mandatory vaccination over such a non-lethal virus for the vast majority of the population? Well I guess we now know that constant fearmongering from the media and government works extremely well to brainwash people and get them to do what you want.

We've already vaccinated most if not all long term care residents and many seniors and others in the general population and as a result deaths in Ontario are very low now. So as we keep vaccinating the elderly until most of them have gotten a shot, why would everyone else need to get a shot when they're barely affected after all this time?

And while everyone was so concentrated on covid deaths where to date about 7,300 people in Ontario have died from, we lose sight of the fact that 100,000+ people died in the same time period in the province. Namely why are we still so concerned about dying by covid when there's far more things that have killed people in the past year covering a far larger portion of the population? How about we stop worrying so much about dying by covid and worry more about all the damage we've done to ourselves for no good reason?
Click to expand...

Normally I don't give the time of day to people who speak of fearmongering and brainwashing in relation to COVID, but for example, chickenpox is much less lethal, and yet the vaccine is mandatory for children to attend school in Ontario. Edit: actually the chickenpox vaccine isn't mandatory as such, but it can be included as part of the measles, mumps and rubella vaccine (which is mandatory).
 
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Took my parents to get vaccinated (Durham PHU). Huge sense of relief and gratitude that they were able to get vaccinated. Family in Portugal and Australia are waiting their turn or for spots to open up. Family in Macau have the vaccine available for a while, but are still hesitant.
 
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From:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1377595422156406789

In relation to the above, former Chief Planner for Toronto, Jennifer Keesmaat shares this thought.

1617300110673.png


I'm inclined to agree.
 
I tried watching Ford, but I cannot tolerate his insincere handwringing and his repeated complaints about how hard it is for him to do what he is doing today - which is to essentially reverse the idiotic decision to reopen that he himself made weeks ago against all scientific advice. If you can't emotionally handle your job, Doug, just resign.
 
Bayer said:
I tried watching Ford, but I cannot tolerate his insincere handwringing and his repeated complaints about how hard it is for him to do what he is doing today
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Yes
Bayer said:
- which is to essentially reverse the idiotic decision to reopen that he himself made weeks ago against all scientific advice. If you can't emotionally handle your job, Doug, just resign.
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I keep reviewing all the published evidence, I don't see any material link between the 'lockdown light' and better epidemiological results.

Vaccination aside (important point though it is); the failures in Ontario are about a lot of other things; I don't think one can say that Toronto having suffered the longest 'lockdown' on the continent benefited from same.

I have no time for anti-maskers, anti-vaxxers etc etc.

I'm all for good policy that protects the most people, practically.

But I don't see the evidence this policy works.

In fact, I see some evidence it makes it worse.

The more you diffuse people (by which I mean spread them out), the less transmission you get.

The more time spent outdoors, same.

Yet the focus has been on putting more people into less space, indoors (lockdown).

If the results were counter-intuitive, that would be one thing; but they aren't. Everything I see points to 'lockdown' producing a worse result.

****

LTCs aside, we never did expend the effort to move more things outdoors where practical. Be that school classes; or upending private golf clubs in favour of walking/biking/picnic space etc.

In the end, to me, neither fear, nor indifference should drive public policy; evidence should.
 
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