Neptis' Review of Metrolinx's Big Move

[ShonTron]

The problem with Oakwood, Chaplin, Leslie, Avenue is that they will be like Castle frank. Low Ridership after 3 years. There is nothing wrong with running the 61 to Y+E when they reopen the bus terminal. Leslie should not have a stop at all either, it's just creating a traffic mess. I think part of the criticism of Eglinton is the lack of extension. Eglinton is great if you live in the former city of york or old Toronto. I think if Eglinton West was being build right now people would have the same criticisms of stops like Scarlett Road for example.

Sigh. Castle Frank is not the example you are looking for. If you said Chester or Christie, you might have more of a point.

Castle Frank: http://goo.gl/maps/Pwx9Y. Terminus of two secondary bus routes and nearly zero walk-in traffic (made worse by the fact the only entrance is opposite where people live). Still, Castle Frank isn't a waste of a stop.

Avenue Road: http://goo.gl/maps/gyDVV. Area served by three bus routes (one primary, 24-hour route, two secondary routes) with moderate walk-up traffic due to commerical and residential uses (some low and mid-rise apartments within a 5 minute walk) surrounding it.

Chaplin: http://goo.gl/maps/reIA8. Area is mostly residential, with multiple midrise rental buildings, high school is within 5 minute walk. Area served by three bus routes (one primary, 24-hour route the 32, one secondary route, the 14, one teritary route, the 33)

Oakwood: http://goo.gl/maps/rUlpL. Commerical strip with low and mid rise apartment buildings in area, residential beyond. Two major bus routes (63, 32). The old Volvo dealership, car wash/Amco station at Alameda are two immediately obvious areas for redevelopment.

Leslie is the only one that shouldn't have a stop of the four.

I don't understand why suddenly the knives here at UT are out for useful stops on a funded and under construction transit line because some transit consultant put out a report with many factual and argumentative flaws. I only remember the Leslie/Don Mills mess being a hot topic here. It's not as if cutting Oakwood or Avenue Road will get money spent elsewhere.

 

[salsa]

Leslie is the only one that shouldn't have a stop of the four.

What do you think of Ferrand station?

 

[ShonTron]

What do you think of Ferrand station?

I'm opposed, but this is mainly because it's part of the Leaside/Leslie/Don Mills clusterfudge. Don Mills should have been the end of the fully grade separated section, the tail tracks to allow scheduled short turns here won't be here (instead at Laird), even though this - and Mount Dennis - will have the most bus feeder traffic and the maxiumum capacity is needed between these two points. If Don Mills was built right, there wouldn't be room for Ferrand (even though it will likely get decent walk-up traffic). Both Leslie and Ferrand should have been dropped with a fully separated Mount Dennis-Don Mills alignment.

 

[Johnny Au]

The old Volvo dealership at Eglinton and Oakwood is slated to become a condo, further justifying an Oakwood station.

 

[sixrings]

The problem with Oakwood, Chaplin, Leslie, Avenue is that they will be like Castle frank. Low Ridership after 3 years. There is nothing wrong with running the 61 to Y+E when they reopen the bus terminal. Leslie should not have a stop at all either, it's just creating a traffic mess. I think part of the criticism of Eglinton is the lack of extension. Eglinton is great if you live in the former city of york or old Toronto. I think if Eglinton West was being build right now people would have the same criticisms of stops like Scarlett Road for example.

How many busses go into Yonge and Eglinton? I'm imagining the day when the DRL is finished and in theory gets us to lawrence. If that were to happen I'd imagine that the lawrence east bus would end at Lawrence and the DRL. The Leslie bus will end at laird. There will no longer be a Eglinton bus. Why would they keep the bus terminal there. No other major hub has a bus terminal under it. And wouldn't the bus terminal land be in 20 years in the perfect area to build either a office or a condominium? By then we will be building 100 floor buildings.

 

[Electrify]

Chaplin: http://goo.gl/maps/reIA8. Area is mostly residential, with multiple midrise rental buildings, high school is within 5 minute walk. Area served by three bus routes (one primary, 24-hour route the 32, one secondary route, the 14, one teritary route, the 33)

And most of those midrise buildings are to the west of the station, making them very close to Bathurst.

 

[sixrings]

And most of those midrise buildings are to the west of the station, making them very close to Bathurst.

I could see chaplain going. I won't advocate for that stop. But if we are going to start cutting then you have to start with Leslie first. I'm still hoping that they go back to the tunnel all the way to Don mills.

 

[Johnny Au]

Leslie deserves the chopping block. Nobody uses the LRT to go buy a car.

 

[sixrings]

Leslie deserves the chopping block. Nobody uses the LRT to go buy a car.

I actually took the subway to downs view fiat to buy my first car. Anyways we can't assume that forever a dealership would be there. But even if the place was redeveloped what would it be developed with and would that translate to riders. I think. Ore important is that Leslie screws up the short turning at don mills which will be a big thing when the DRL is built.

 

[ehlow]

Leslie deserves the chopping block. Nobody uses the LRT to go buy a car.

I actually do use the Leslie bus stop when my I bring my car in for service . Let's say I'm getting an oil change, I'd go back to Yonge & Eg for lunch while it's in the shop. But obviously I'm not arguing that ridership won't be low, and the dealership does have shuttle service. Another use for that stop is to access the ravine, and I am the type of person who takes transit to go biking/jogging, although maybe I'm the only one. Having said that, it is a very popular park in the summer.

I would've been fine if they tunnelled to Don Mills, but I'm OK with the way it is now as well. Having a few less used stops is not a disaster for the whole line in my opinion, since the line as a whole will have good ridership. I know many people on this forum would disagree, and having one unjustified stop is the end of the world. If we were designing the Yonge subway now, we probably wouldn't put a station at Rosedale, but we're sure glad that subway line exists now right?

 

[sixrings]

I actually do use the Leslie bus stop when my I bring my car in for service . Let's say I'm getting an oil change, I'd go back to Yonge & Eg for lunch while it's in the shop. But obviously I'm not arguing that ridership won't be low, and the dealership does have shuttle service. Another use for that stop is to access the ravine, and I am the type of person who takes transit to go biking/jogging, although maybe I'm the only one. Having said that, it is a very popular park in the summer.

If we were designing the Yonge subway now, we probably wouldn't put a station at Rosedale, but we're sure glad that subway line exists now right?

I don't know if your last question was asked sarcastically or seriously. I'd think many people on here would all be for cutting stations that aren't used by very many people. The glencarins, bessarion, Rosedale stations of the map. I'm also fairly confident that those who advocate cutting either don't take transit or live far from the core and are looking for the fastest way downtown as possible. I like you use transit for things like getting to high park. But I think we are in the minority. Even when I see these fantasy maps it bugs me if the lines aren't running on a grid because as a user that's how I use the system. But my needs of wanting to do everything but visit the in laws with transit is quite different then those whom want to just get downtown as quick as possible.

 

[BurlOak]

Ore important is that Leslie screws up the short turning at don mills which will be a big thing when the DRL is built.

That is evidence that the people in charge of transit (Metrolix, provincial Liberals, TTC, Stintz) were not serios about building the DRL. They did not think far enough in the future to imagine how things would operate with a DRL.

 

[innsertnamehere]

only one to blame there is Metrolinx, this is a Metrolinx project, and no way the Provincial liberals deal with that many details of a project. This type of decision is one made by bureaucrats, and as always, you are overplaying its effect on the network integrity. If anything the DRL will help the situation as most Don Mills passengers will take the DRL instead of eglinton once it opens.

 

[ehlow]

I don't know if your last question was asked sarcastically or seriously. I'd think many people on here would all be for cutting stations that aren't used by very many people. The glencarins, bessarion, Rosedale stations of the map. I'm also fairly confident that those who advocate cutting either don't take transit or live far from the core and are looking for the fastest way downtown as possible. I like you use transit for things like getting to high park. But I think we are in the minority. Even when I see these fantasy maps it bugs me if the lines aren't running on a grid because as a user that's how I use the system. But my needs of wanting to do everything but visit the in laws with transit is quite different then those whom want to just get downtown as quick as possible.

I meant to ask it expecting that most people would say "yes, despite the fact that Rosedale station isn't very well used, we're all happy the Yonge line exists" . My point was just that, sometimes having some minor flaws, or a few under-used stops in a transit line doesn't necessarily mean the transit line as a whole is flawed.

I would choose underground to Don Mills if I had the power to. However, I'm still happy Eglinton as a whole is being built, even if there is a Leslie stop.

I do agree that I'd be OK with Leslie, and a couple of surface stops to the east like Ferrand go. If you haven't already though, you guys should try going to one of the public meetings about this project and hear people complain about their local bus stop not being on the LRT map. I think the underground stations are fine, not to mention they are already doing preliminary construction on it, so the time has passed long ago to change it.

I know many people only take transit for commuting and only long distances, however, I do think some people that have metropasses use it for day to day short trips like grocery shopping, going to a restaurant, taking a jog and then taking transit back home, etc. I can definitely see that happening on Eglinton due to the urban nature of the central section.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

How many busses go into Yonge and Eglinton? I'm imagining the day when the DRL is finished and in theory gets us to lawrence. If that were to happen I'd imagine that the lawrence east bus would end at Lawrence and the DRL. The Leslie bus will end at laird. There will no longer be a Eglinton bus. Why would they keep the bus terminal there. No other major hub has a bus terminal under it. And wouldn't the bus terminal land be in 20 years in the perfect area to build either a office or a condominium? By then we will be building 100 floor buildings.

They are going to open up the Eglinton bus terminal again, or that's what I heard from metrolinx.