News   Dec 20, 2024
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Metrolinx Unveils Next Wave of Big Move Projects

The Star is speculating that there may a more permanent delay in the Hurontario line

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/cit...95412--is-mississauga-bailing-on-its-lrt-plan

What was said on Tuesday at budget meeting shows how 2 side mouth some of the councilors are. I was not at Wed meeting and again it shows how some councilors only look from election to election to have a job and not the real future needs of the city.

Until Move 2 was announce, I was going to recommend that Peel go alone at this time in building the LRT as a P3 until funding is at hand to replay the funds to build it.

Considering the government was to pay 100% of the cost to build Move 2020, its now 66%.

Why is a study needed for electrify lines when its already done in Europe.
 
Also with Durham's BRT, I'm guessing the future looks beak for the eastern Sheppard LRT line.

The Durham BRT is going to run along Kingston Road and likely along Ellesmere to Scarborough Centre, which would be complementary to the Sheppard LRT not a replacement for it.
 
I'm surprised the Waterfront LRT is such a low priority. Not only would it be the easiest to build, but could act as a demo line for the rest of the LRT projects.

Having the Waterfront LRT phased later will allow some time for the following:

-A reconsideration of using the Bay Streetcar Tunnel to access Union (can be kept at grade along Bremner and terminate at the ACC, or continue East to the Portlands)
-Political pressure to tear down the Gardiner (when maintenance outstrips the cost of demolition) will necessitate the construction of alternate routes into downtown, creating further need for the WWLRT.

There is no doubt in my mind that the gap in infrastructure will be filled when something is decided about the Gardiner. In the meantime however, I would have liked to see electrification of the lake shore GO line put into higher priority.
 
That Star article was rather depressing. Some of these Mississauga councillors are idiots. They can't pony up their share to get the ONE project in Mississauga that needs to get done, done? Gawd they're as bad as the Toronto councillors who refuse to pay for their own transit.
 
That Star article was rather depressing. Some of these Mississauga councillors are idiots. They can't pony up their share to get the ONE project in Mississauga that needs to get done, done? Gawd they're as bad as the Toronto councillors who refuse to pay for their own transit.

This is the GTA. We screw up for fun around here.
 
That Star article was rather depressing. Some of these Mississauga councillors are idiots. They can't pony up their share to get the ONE project in Mississauga that needs to get done, done? Gawd they're as bad as the Toronto councillors who refuse to pay for their own transit.
Maybe GTA residents don't consider the transportation problem to be bad enough to pay to address it? It seems hard to believe, but maybe as much as they hate traffic jams, they hate increased taxes even more?
 
The sad thing is that they have such wide lanes in Mississauga LRT technology fits perfectly.. With all those condos going up around Square one they better start building either transit or offices. Everyone wants transit but no one wants to pay for it. This is beginning to look less and less like a BIG Move...

I also think Vaughan is going to catch up to Mississauga. The Subway expansion is going to be huge for the cities core. Mississauga looks most like a real city in comparison to the other suburbs at the moment. Skip forward 50 years and Vaughan and Richmond hill might have caught up.
 
No kidding.

Miss will not be able to get any PPP funding to build an at grade LRT. There is a lot of money out there from investors when it comes to PPP as they are seen as a reliable, stable investment when the stock markets and economy are in a precarious state. That, however, is not the case except in limited stop airport routes where upkeep is relatively low or when the systems are totally grade separated. Grade separation allows for automated trains which reduces the largest single operating cost of any new system....labour.

This is why Vancouver's Canada and Evergreen lines were successful in getting large chunks from the private sector for rapid transit construction. If the system were to even have one level crossing that would mean no automation and much higher operating costs. Extentions of lines are very problematic for PPP as revenue calculations are more difficult and less beneficial to the citys themselves. This is why the Boradway subway/Millenium line western expansion to UBC will not use a PPP.

Miss could get private money but would require a grade separated system.

Also..............why the hell does the city have to do an enviornmental assessment for UP Link when it is already going down a rail corridor and all they are doing is putting up electrical polls? What an obscene waste of time and money. Toronto and Metrolinx seem to use enviornmental assessments as a way to put off decision making for a few years. Vancouver's entire 18km Millenium line had only a 3 month enviornmental assessment.

This 'second phase" of the Big Move is good politics but the building of phase one only just started. It's very easy, as Metrolinx and the TTC know well, to make announcements and put pretty lines on a brand new map at a media event but they mean nothing. It's just more talk and nothing will get done until they find the money, have solid deadlines, and realistic budgets none of which is forthcoming. No one in Toronto expects these things to get done which is a good thing because they won't for atleast 30 years. It's this little thing called money that keeps getting in the way.

Ya gotta love that piece about Miss having to probably cancel their LRT because Hazel and friends don't want to push for the tax increases needed to build it. The article made them look short sighted but Toronto isn't willing to contribute one nickel for their LRT lines. Why should the people of Miss have to tolerate tax increases to fund their LRT when they can just get Queen's Park to pay for it like Toronto.

Untill the city, councillors, and citizens stop abbrogating their responsibilities of actually paying for their own infrastructure, Toronto will continue on with it's stellar rapid transit expansion of the last 30 years and much smaller Vancouver and Calgary will pass the TTC by.
 
Union Pearson Express website: http://www.upexpress.com/en/

The website says fare will be "competitive" and offer "value".
However, I have a sense that it won't be cheap and will only make sense if you are traveling alone. if you have one or two companions you are better off sharing a taxi and save the subway ride to Union and waiting.

The airport express bus currently charges $26.95, running about 35 minutes one way and it doesn't just stop at Union. The train has to do better than that.
 
Miss will not be able to get any PPP funding to build an at grade LRT. There is a lot of money out there from investors when it comes to PPP as they are seen as a reliable, stable investment when the stock markets and economy are in a precarious state. That, however, is not the case except in limited stop airport routes where upkeep is relatively low or when the systems are totally grade separated. Grade separation allows for automated trains which reduces the largest single operating cost of any new system....labour.

Err, no. Viva is a P3 between York and Veolia; the Melbourne streetcar system is also operated privately. Whether P3 works or not has nothing to do with whether it is grade separated or not but the financial terms negotiated between the government and the private provider.

AoD
 
Err, no. Viva is a P3 between York and Veolia; the Melbourne streetcar system is also operated privately. Whether P3 works or not has nothing to do with whether it is grade separated or not but the financial terms negotiated between the government and the private provider.

AoD

I'd say the bigger determination of whether or not a P3 is viable is the projected ridership relative to the type of technology used and the cost of construction. The DRL is going to have an enormously high per km construction cost, but the ridership on the line would make a P3 arrangement viable. By the same token, a P3 on a VIVA route could also be viable, because even though the ridership is lower, so is the capital and operating costs. I would think that the Hurontario LRT's capital costs and ridership would be about the same ratio in order to make a P3 viable.

That's a contrast to lines like Sheppard East and Finch West though. Big capital cost, but not enough ridership to guarantee that they'll actually turn a profit.
 

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