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Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

WillTo

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Here's my latest oddity.
Transfer is correct, but the location was certainly not Queensway garage. It was actually Old Mill Subway. This can't be a one-of error, must have been affecting every card tapped on this bus, probably since the start of shift.
The irony being, I watched this bus (66) come all the way up Prince Edward to the subway, on my phone, using Nextbus. Apparently Nextbus can know where my bus is, but the Presto reader on the bus doesn't.
View attachment 128951
- Paul
Yep, I think people are getting all sorts of weird locations or null values. Only thing I haven't seen was a reading from a streetcar somewhere where there is no track :)
 

TransitBart

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Ok. I’ll take the bait. I don’t know anything.

How is it possible to get all these weird locations?

And elsewhere on this thread someone commented that TTC buses had less equipment installed associated with the PRESTO system.

What is up? Why is this installation performing so strangely at times?
 

Kitsune

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I've had a Tap at Dupont read all sorts of locations on the otherside of the city, its allowed me to do a fake circle route once.
 

amnesiajune

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Transfer is correct, but the location was certainly not Queensway garage. It was actually Old Mill Subway. This can't be a one-of error, must have been affecting every card tapped on this bus, probably since the start of shift.
The irony being, I watched this bus (66) come all the way up Prince Edward to the subway, on my phone, using Nextbus. Apparently Nextbus can know where my bus is, but the Presto reader on the bus doesn't.
How is it possible to get all these weird locations?

I think the location defaults to the bus's or route's garage if Presto can't figure out the location. In any case, it doesn't matter - the location of the bus isn't considered when it's figuring out if you have a valid transfer, just the route (and whether or not the two routes actually intersect doesn't seem to be considered either).
 

johntauren

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I think the location defaults to the bus's or route's garage if Presto can't figure out the location. In any case, it doesn't matter - the location of the bus isn't considered when it's figuring out if you have a valid transfer, just the route (and whether or not the two routes actually intersect doesn't seem to be considered either).

I've had weird locations in Brampton, and nothing to do with where the garages are.
It's often off by a few stops (usually the nearest major timed stop), but sometimes it's been off by entire routes. I've had taps at Bramalea Go show as Kennedy/Vodden once.
 

W. K. Lis

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Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX".

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Then why are the green machines doing on a UPX platform? ARRGHHH!
 

crs1026

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I think the location defaults to the bus's or route's garage if Presto can't figure out the location. In any case, it doesn't matter - the location of the bus isn't considered when it's figuring out if you have a valid transfer, just the route (and whether or not the two routes actually intersect doesn't seem to be considered either).

The explanation that a contact gave me today is - Presto does not access the vehicle's AVL (Automatic Vehicle Location) transponder but generates its own position data, and the Presto version is more primitive and relies to some degree on 'dead reckoning'. So the transit control center knows exactly where the bus is but Presto doesn't.
Location may not matter to the fare calculation just yet, but if ML truly intends to move to fare by distance, it will matter a lot more in the future. I wonder if the technology is up to that standard.

- Paul
 

amnesiajune

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Location may not matter to the fare calculation just yet, but if ML truly intends to move to fare by distance

Metrolinx doesn't plan on using vehicle location data for FBD. Their FBD plans involve flat fares for local transit, and FBD for things like commuter rail, subways, LRT and BRT where tapping off (at fixed card readers) is feasible.
 

Megaton327

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Then why are the green machines doing on a UPX platform? ARRGHHH!

I think the signage is extraordinarily clear and easy to understand. The gray machine is solely for passengers taking the UPX to/from pearson. The green machine is for passengers travelling between Union, Bloor, Weston, and any other GO rail stations; as it is a GO machine, it deducts GO fares, including things like monthly capping, their post-secondary student discount, and allowing for transfers between other GO rail lines or buses and the UPX. The UPX presto reader is not integrated with GO so you don't get a transfer or monthly capping etc.

I have long said it would make much more sense to only have the green GO reader and get rid of the gray one, but with this signage they've installed I don't see how this could be even slightly confusing. Suboptimal/inefficient, yes, but not in any way unclear to passengers.
 

nfitz

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Metrolinx doesn't plan on using vehicle location data for FBD. Their FBD plans involve flat fares for local transit, and FBD for things like commuter rail, subways, LRT and BRT where tapping off (at fixed card readers) is feasible.
What about GO Buses? Surely they need to know the vehicle location when you tap off. I don't see how you put tap off machines at every GO bus stop.

So the transit control center knows exactly where the bus is but Presto doesn't.
Transit control doesn't always know quite where the bus is.

This one seems to be in Lake Ontario right now!
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Gosh, and here's another!
upload_2017-12-3_4-55-23.png
 

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DSC

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Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX". Green means "GO', grey means "UPX".
Yes, it is really quite confusing to have two possible tap-on and tap-off possibilities sitting side by side. Surely PRESTO can be programed to realise that if you tap on at Pearson and tap off at the UPX platform at Union you came from the airport. If you tap on at Weston and off at the UPX platform at Union you came from Weston. The system seems able to deal with different fares for people who go from Aldershot to Union vs Exhibition to Union.
 

cbrown2009

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Yes. But there are only gray machines at the airport station, not green ones. And the two are not yet integrated. It’s a hassle, but what to do?
 

EastYorkTTCFan

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Yes. But there are only gray machines at the airport station, not green ones. And the two are not yet integrated. It’s a hassle, but what to do?
It's simple if you use the UPX as a go train you tap on the go reader if you take it to or from the airport you use the UPX reader.
 

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