News   Aug 16, 2019
 2.5K     11 
News   Aug 16, 2019
 925     1 
News   Aug 16, 2019
 1K     0 

Metrolinx: Presto Fare Card

ttk77

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Oct 4, 2010
Messages
1,225
Reaction score
262
Location
Harbourfront
The need additional hardware to tell the reader it's on the express route, that isn't scheduled for implementation yet.
That's terrible planning on Presto's part. There's no way it should require extra hardware to do that. Someone poorly designed their back end if they can't link the bus route to the fair to be charged through software alone.
 

AlvinofDiaspar

Moderator
Member Bio
Joined
Apr 22, 2007
Messages
25,831
Reaction score
12,669
Location
Toronto
That's terrible planning on Presto's part. There's no way it should require extra hardware to do that. Someone poorly designed their back end if they can't link the bus route to the fair to be charged through software alone.
What you call a bug is probably a feature from Accenture's perspective.

AoD
 

mkerian

Active Member
Member Bio
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
109
Reaction score
40
TTC has enabled auto-renewing Metropass on PRESTO. Every other system on PRESTO has allowed that for a few months.

Also, and they haven't advertised it yet, the MDP replacement, the TTC "Twelve Month" Pass is enabled on the PRESTO website.
It was available, but as of today (Nov 29) it seems to have disappeared.

I called the TTC MDP Office (very long hold, nice Christmas music from the radio tho) and was informed that they (staff) have not been informed of the switchover yet as they are still installing the Presto gates and have to make sure the system is operating properly. I told her that the MDP Presto option was enabled yesterday, and she had no knowledge of that and claimed it could have been a glitch.

My headache is that come early February, all Yonge and Sheppard entrances will be Presto enabled, but only the main entrance will be accessible via Metropass. Which means the current entrance I use will become inaccessible.

The MDP rep was sympathetic, but claimed that there are no known plans to switch MDP customers over.

It will only add a couple of minutes to my walking to the subway time, but it is annoying.

EDIT: Correct my accidental use of Presto when I meant Metropass
 
Last edited:

Megaton327

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Feb 28, 2015
Messages
1,498
Reaction score
1,000
It was available, but as of today (Nov 29) it seems to have disappeared.

I called the TTC MDP Office (very long hold, nice Christmas music from the radio tho) and was informed that they (staff) have not been informed of the switchover yet as they are still installing the Presto gates and have to make sure the system is operating properly. I told her that the MDP Presto option was enabled yesterday, and she had no knowledge of that and claimed it could have been a glitch.

My headache is that come early February, all Yonge and Sheppard entrances will be Presto enabled, but only the main entrance will be accessible via Presto. Which means the current entrance I use will become inaccessible.

The MDP rep was sympathetic, but claimed that there are no known plans to switch MDP customers over.

It will only add a couple of minutes to my walking to the subway time, but it is annoying.
1) The TTC publicly stated that they released the Presto annual pass in limited quantities to test it out and troubleshoot it before deploying it widely. They took signups from a small number of people then removed it. This is exactly what happened with the first couple of months of metropasses.

2) I'm confused about what you're saying about stations. You said "all Yonge and Sheppard entrances will be Presto enabled", then "but only the main entrance will be accessible via Presto". That makes no sense. Did you mean to say that only the main entrance will be accessible via Metropass? I think that's what you were trying to say, being a MDP customer. But I'm not sure that statement is correct either--as far as I know, almost every faregate entrance, not just main ones, has at least one Metropass gate. Only a couple of very, very small entrances so far lack metropass readers entirely, it's extremely rare.
 

mkerian

Active Member
Member Bio
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
109
Reaction score
40
1) The TTC publicly stated that they released the Presto annual pass in limited quantities to test it out and troubleshoot it before deploying it widely. They took signups from a small number of people then removed it. This is exactly what happened with the first couple of months of metropasses.

2) I'm confused about what you're saying about stations. You said "all Yonge and Sheppard entrances will be Presto enabled", then "but only the main entrance will be accessible via Presto". That makes no sense. Did you mean to say that only the main entrance will be accessible via Metropass? I think that's what you were trying to say, being a MDP customer. But I'm not sure that statement is correct either--as far as I know, almost every faregate entrance, not just main ones, has at least one Metropass gate. Only a couple of very, very small entrances so far lack metropass readers entirely, it's extremely rare.
Thanks, I made an error. I meant to say that "only the main entrance will be accessible via Metropass".

Here's the link to the TTC's statement. http://www.ttc.ca/Fares_and_passes/PRESTO/Sheppard-Yonge.jsp

The main entrance will be accessible via Metropass and Presto. The Poyntz, Harlandale, and Sheppard West entrances will only be accessible via Presto.

I also made an error in that Hullmark entrance will be Metropass and Presto, but for me that entrance is farther than the main entrance. A small gripe I know. Still, 3 out 5 five entrances will be inaccessible except via Presto. Which I'm ok with, if I had the ability to switch over to MDP Presto.

In regards to the TTC's public statement on Presto MDP, I missed that. Can you share the link?
 

Megaton327

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Feb 28, 2015
Messages
1,498
Reaction score
1,000
Thanks, I made an error. I meant to say that "only the main entrance will be accessible via Metropass".

Here's the link to the TTC's statement. http://www.ttc.ca/Fares_and_passes/PRESTO/Sheppard-Yonge.jsp

The main entrance will be accessible via Metropass and Presto. The Poyntz, Harlandale, and Sheppard West entrances will only be accessible via Presto.

I also made an error in that Hullmark entrance will be Metropass and Presto, but for me that entrance is farther than the main entrance. A small gripe I know. Still, 3 out 5 five entrances will be inaccessible except via Presto. Which I'm ok with, if I had the ability to switch over to MDP Presto.

In regards to the TTC's public statement on Presto MDP, I missed that. Can you share the link?
Wow, that's a first regarding Presto-only at multiple non-tiny entrances of a major station. Yikes. I'd be displeased if I was an MDP customer...then again it reeeeally looks like they're a couple of months away from migrating you folks over, so it's not for long, at least.

As for the Presto MDP, from Presto's twitter account https://twitter.com/PRESTOcard/status/935218692576641024 "The number of passes is being limited right now to give us and the TTC the opportunity to test out the pass to ensure we can provide the best possible product to our customers when we before we expand the program. When we do expand it, we will update."

Also from Heather Brown at the TTC https://twitter.com/hmacmillanbrown/status/935213653027991552 "Over the coming months the number of 12 Month Passes on PRESTO (MDP equivalent) will be increased"
 

mkerian

Active Member
Member Bio
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
109
Reaction score
40
Wow, that's a first regarding Presto-only at multiple non-tiny entrances of a major station. Yikes. I'd be displeased if I was an MDP customer...then again it reeeeally looks like they're a couple of months away from migrating you folks over, so it's not for long, at least.

As for the Presto MDP, from Presto's twitter account https://twitter.com/PRESTOcard/status/935218692576641024 "The number of passes is being limited right now to give us and the TTC the opportunity to test out the pass to ensure we can provide the best possible product to our customers when we before we expand the program. When we do expand it, we will update."

Also from Heather Brown at the TTC https://twitter.com/hmacmillanbrown/status/935213653027991552 "Over the coming months the number of 12 Month Passes on PRESTO (MDP equivalent) will be increased"
Thanks for the links. And I appreciate your hopefulness that it may not be long before MDP Metropass is migrated to Presto.

But the worrywart in me keeps noticing that in all the language from the TTC regarding the Presto and Metropass, there is no mention of migrating MDP customers. Expanding the program, new customers, best possible product and so on...but not migrating. Oh well.
 

salsa

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Sep 27, 2013
Messages
7,938
Reaction score
6,878
Location
North York
Exactly as I was expecting, time-based transfers (along with a whole bunch of other approved programs) are not included in the draft 2018 budget.
 

amnesiajune

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,042
Reaction score
956
That's terrible planning on Presto's part. There's no way it should require extra hardware to do that. Someone poorly designed their back end if they can't link the bus route to the fair to be charged through software alone.
I don't think it requires any extra hardware. Buses already know what route they're on - that's how you get charged on a return bus trip within two hours. And York Region had no problem supporting their premium express fares right away.
 

nfitz

Superstar
Member Bio
Joined
Nov 10, 2007
Messages
23,253
Reaction score
3,352
Location
Toronto
That's terrible planning on Presto's part. There's no way it should require extra hardware to do that.
Changed with what? There's no input on the readers.

It's the input device that wasn't part of the initial roll-out.

Someone poorly designed their back end if they can't link the bus route to the fair to be charged through software alone.
All the buses to the fair are regular fare.

I don't think it requires any extra hardware. Buses already know what route they're on - that's how you get charged on a return bus trip within two hours. And York Region had no problem supporting their premium express fares right away.
Buses often don't know what route they are on. This was evident from the Presto transfers that the streetcars used to issue. York Region buses have extra equipment not on the TTC buses.
 

epcjay

New Member
Member Bio
Joined
Sep 21, 2010
Messages
96
Reaction score
8
I don't think it requires any extra hardware. Buses already know what route they're on - that's how you get charged on a return bus trip within two hours. And York Region had no problem supporting their premium express fares right away.
My buddy told me there is a bug with the york region express routes. I believe he said if he takes a regular bus to catch the express bus, only the regular fare is charged.
 

amnesiajune

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,042
Reaction score
956
Buses often don't know what route they are on. This was evident from the Presto transfers that the streetcars used to issue.
They definitely do. If you take the same bus route twice in two hours, you get charged twice. I believe streetcars do too, which is why there are occasionally complaints about streetcar transfers - operators sometimes put in the wrong route number on the old streetcars which causes transfers to not be recognized (from what I understand, this isn't an issue on new streetcars because Presto is linked to the system that displays the route).

My buddy told me there is a bug with the york region express routes. I believe he said if he takes a regular bus to catch the express bus, only the regular fare is charged.
Yeah. Presto allows transfers but doesn't allow an extra charge on the transfer. It's very rare for people to transfer to/from an express bus though (that's true in Toronto as well as York Region). What people do sometimes is tap the card readers for Viva at Finch before they get on an express bus.

Also, the extra fare doesn't work if you have a metropass. I think that may be a sticking point for the TTC - people who have a Metropass can't be charged the extra fare alone; they have to be charged the full $6.00 fare or nothing.
 

epcjay

New Member
Member Bio
Joined
Sep 21, 2010
Messages
96
Reaction score
8
They definitely do. If you take the same bus route twice in two hours, you get charged twice. I believe streetcars do too, which is why there are occasionally complaints about streetcar transfers - operators sometimes put in the wrong route number on the old streetcars which causes transfers to not be recognized (from what I understand, this isn't an issue on new streetcars because Presto is linked to the system that displays the route).



Yeah. Presto allows transfers but doesn't allow an extra charge on the transfer. It's very rare for people to transfer to/from an express bus though (that's true in Toronto as well as York Region). What people do sometimes is tap the card readers for Viva at Finch before they get on an express bus.

Also, the extra fare doesn't work if you have a metropass. I think that may be a sticking point for the TTC - people who have a Metropass can't be charged the extra fare alone; they have to be charged the full $6.00 fare or nothing.
Im just an average joe, but can't they implement presto readers with buttons on express routes, then program the buttons for certain things? For example, Default - Full fare. Button 2 - Express Top-up (which the backend checks if there's a current fare paid or metro pass enabled) similar to how Viva use to do it with zone 1 and zone 2????
 

amnesiajune

Senior Member
Member Bio
Joined
Jul 28, 2016
Messages
2,042
Reaction score
956
Im just an average joe, but can't they implement presto readers with buttons on express routes, then program the buttons for certain things? For example, Default - Full fare. Button 2 - Express Top-up (which the backend checks if there's a current fare paid or metro pass enabled) similar to how Viva use to do it with zone 1 and zone 2????
I don't know. Viva didn't do what you're describing though. They just let you pay one fare or the other. If you messed up you had to buy the $1.00 upgrade ticket.
 
Top