King Street (Streetcar Transit Priority)

[ViveleCanada]

Using the complaints about the King Street Pilot as a base, wonder how much business was "lost" when the city closed most of the downtown streets to traffic because of the Raptors parade on June 17th?

The Raptors parade and King Street are two very different scenarios that really cannot be compared at all. Through interviews with the media, it seems that business owners are feeling losses because the pedestrian traffic has now shifted onto the King Streetcar as the line is much more reliable and frequent. The raptors parade introduced over two million pedestrians into the core so it was a gold mine for downtown businesses (and my god the amount of litter). Before the pilot, it was much more reliable to walk, at least during rush hour, rather than deal with the "Red Rocket." Nowadays, I notice a significant passenger-base willing to hop a few stops on the King streetcar rather than walk it out on the street. For a storefront business, that would be really bad news considering pedestrian traffic is your main market. From the more successful transit malls I noticed, such as Melbourne, catering to pedestrians seems just as important as transit priority if that pedestrian traffic is to be kept. I do consider the pilot to be successful, but IMO pedestrianization/beautification of the corridor is also needed if the city wants to get Queen street businesses on board with a possible pilot on the 501.

 

[W. K. Lis]

... Nowadays, I notice a significant passenger-base willing to hop a few stops on the King streetcar rather than walk it out on the street. For a storefront business, that would be really bad news considering pedestrian traffic is your main market. From the more successful transit malls I noticed, such as Melbourne, catering to pedestrians seems just as important as transit priority if that pedestrian traffic is to be kept. I do consider the pilot to be successful, but IMO pedestrianization/beautification of the corridor is also needed if the city wants to get Queen street businesses on board with a possible pilot on the 501.

By that, it could be a even bigger loss of "pedestrian traffic" is there was an underground electric railway under King Street, since people will not see the "draw" at street-level.

 

[nfitz]

Through interviews with the media, it seems that business owners are feeling losses because the pedestrian traffic has now shifted onto the King Streetcar as the line is much more reliable and frequent.

What's the basis for that? The data shows little change in pedestrian traffic over the November baseline. If anything, there's been a bit of a shift from Queen to King.

Also the year-over-year retail spending is was up 1.7%, compared to a decline of 0.9% in the period before the pilot. The only possible impact that the data shows is a small drop in restaurant spending - but it's retail spending that will be impacted by foot traffic more so than restaurant spending - which might be attributable to several restaurant closing near Peter because of condo construction.

 

[W. K. Lis]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1144786542436782081

I see "dead people".

 

[Steve X]

People should be walking on the streets, not hiding in their cars or in a tunnel. That's what makes a lively city

 

[ndawgg]

Just watched 3 cars go straight west to east through the church/king intersection. The fourth vehicle (which didn’t go straight because it was turning left) was a cop car. Literally watched three cars break the law and didn’t give a shit. This is why people feel entitled to disobey the rules. There are no consequences.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Can we drop the "Pilot" from this thread?

 

[pstogios]

Just watched 3 cars go straight west to east through the church/king intersection. The fourth vehicle (which didn’t go straight because it was turning left) was a cop car. Literally watched three cars break the law and didn’t give a shit. This is why people feel entitled to disobey the rules. There are no consequences.

Outrageous. But I’m not surprised.

Is there a police ombudsman or a way to lodge a complaint about this?

 

[W. K. Lis]

Outrageous. But I’m not surprised.

Is there a police ombudsman or a way to lodge a complaint about this?

As for the cameras...

From link.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

When will we get information on what the permanent infrastructure for the transitway will look like?

 

[DSC]

When will we get information on what the permanent infrastructure for the transitway will look like?

Probably in 2022 as this is planned for 2023 - after the streetcar tracks are re-laid.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Oh wow, long wait.

I just hope whatever design they recommend considers how important a tourism corridor this is for Toronto.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Probably in 2022 as this is planned for 2023 - after the streetcar tracks are re-laid.

The Yonge streets revitalization should be proceeding around the same time as well (within a year or two). The two projects should be designed as one cohesive initiative

 

[innsertnamehere]

I'm honestly confused by the constant complaints of enforcement on King. I feel like every other time I bike along King I see a cop with someone pulled over.

Enforcement is never going to get 100% of law-breakers - but enforcement is common enough that people aren't going to break the rules regularly because they will eventually get dinged.

 

[salsa]

I'm honestly confused by the constant complaints of enforcement on King. I feel like every other time I bike along King I see a cop with someone pulled over.

Enforcement is never going to get 100% of law-breakers - but enforcement is common enough that people aren't going to break the rules regularly because they will eventually get dinged.

@MetroMan , who lives on King St W would have a lot to say about that.