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ahrvojic
Guest
That's true. The alternatives do cost *a lot* more and in many cases may not even be alternatives for that reason.
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That's true. The alternatives do cost *a lot* more and in many cases may not even be alternatives for that reason.
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
There's a Wal-Mart at Scarborough Town Centre.
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
And, of course, the best place for the Kipling line to be extended is to the Airport...MCC and Sherway can be served by a Queen line 
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dashingdan
Guest
Just because Sherway has low ridership from Mississauga, doesn't mean it has low ridership from Toronto.
Plus, have you ever taken the bus to Sherway? It's ridiculously slow. First of all, it starts at Mississauga Hospital/Trillium, and does a grand tour of southeast mississsauga before it bothers to go to Sherway. No wonder nobody takes it. If there was a bus from Square One to Sherway, I'm sure more people would take it, and if there was an express (i mean truly express, like, NO stops) from Square One to Kipling or Islington, I'm sure that would be popular.
Plus, have you ever taken the bus to Sherway? It's ridiculously slow. First of all, it starts at Mississauga Hospital/Trillium, and does a grand tour of southeast mississsauga before it bothers to go to Sherway. No wonder nobody takes it. If there was a bus from Square One to Sherway, I'm sure more people would take it, and if there was an express (i mean truly express, like, NO stops) from Square One to Kipling or Islington, I'm sure that would be popular.
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jeicow
Guest
^ There are lots of express buses to Islington. Most start somewhere in the West (South Common, Meadowvale etc.) and only the ones that pass near SQ1 (ex. Burnhamthorpe) stop there. They are popular and they save a hell of a lot of time compared to the regular route. I believe the only express bus in Mississauga that makes more than two stops is the Hurontario 202.
As for Sherway, I don't really see it being a popular thing for most Saugers. While it does have some stores that SQ1 lacks (Abercrombie is the most obvious) it really isn't all that special. It's smaller, less busy, and for most completly out of the way. Without doubt, it has more architectural merit than Sq1 does but it's a small mall and lacks places to "hang out", and with the opening of the mega Big Box area, it has almost become more suburban than MCC is right now. While I'm sure that there are people who shop there, I just don't see it's a major destination for most. And with it's current location at a major highway junction, I think driving there is easier for most. Btw, I think the routing of the current route 4 (Sherway bus) is more just there to connect the two hospitals b/c of the idiotic "campuses" that came into effect and how the poor naming of the campuses confuse people. (Queensway Campus not actually located on Queensway while the Mississauga Campus is)
While it will get ridership from TO I am more fimiliar with the areas to the east of the 427 in the Cloverdale area having more high density nodes and I just see it being more sucessful. I'm not trying to say a stop at Sherway shouldn't exist, but with the current way that subway extensions and funding have been during the last two decades, I just don't think it would be the best move for the TTC, just like one day a VCC may make sense, it just seems like an unwise option now.
As for Sherway, I don't really see it being a popular thing for most Saugers. While it does have some stores that SQ1 lacks (Abercrombie is the most obvious) it really isn't all that special. It's smaller, less busy, and for most completly out of the way. Without doubt, it has more architectural merit than Sq1 does but it's a small mall and lacks places to "hang out", and with the opening of the mega Big Box area, it has almost become more suburban than MCC is right now. While I'm sure that there are people who shop there, I just don't see it's a major destination for most. And with it's current location at a major highway junction, I think driving there is easier for most. Btw, I think the routing of the current route 4 (Sherway bus) is more just there to connect the two hospitals b/c of the idiotic "campuses" that came into effect and how the poor naming of the campuses confuse people. (Queensway Campus not actually located on Queensway while the Mississauga Campus is)
While it will get ridership from TO I am more fimiliar with the areas to the east of the 427 in the Cloverdale area having more high density nodes and I just see it being more sucessful. I'm not trying to say a stop at Sherway shouldn't exist, but with the current way that subway extensions and funding have been during the last two decades, I just don't think it would be the best move for the TTC, just like one day a VCC may make sense, it just seems like an unwise option now.
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interchange42
Guest
The TTC's last plan to extend the Bloor-Danforth line west was born during the Peterson era I believe, continued on the radar during the Rae Days, but was dropped like everything except Sheppard during the Dark Ages.
That plan had the line running along the north side the CP tracks, diving underground to avoid the back of some places of business, with a potential station at the East Mall, then curving south to Sherway for a station at Queensway and the West Mall, and then curving west for a terminal station at Dixie at the GO line.
The owners of Sherway Gardens at the time had pledged (as far as I remember) somewhere around $25 million to help bring the subway their way, and were planning on extending the mall to the northwest corner of the property to meet the new station. A bus terminal was planned for under the hydro corridor immediately west of the West Mall. Since that time a large complex of condos called One Sherway has been approved, and its first towers are now under construction. Land was also identified at Evans Avenue and the West Mall as a Toronto gateway, namely to take commuter parking for those driving into town on the QEW.
Sherway's bus ridership is not low because nobody goes to Sherway, it's low because it's such a slow route from Kipling. With direct subway access, one could imagine similar traffic to that which uses Yorkdale station on the Spadina line, and yes doady, there is a lot of it: (the Spadina line is not quite the disaster you make out in your post).
I believe that the East Mall station was not seen as a high priority because it was assumed that most Mississauga buses would meet the new line at Dixie, and that the TTC's East Mall bus might be needed to serve Dundas Street as far as Kipling once other TTC Dundas bus service was replaced by the subway extension. Nowadays, I could see some special bus-only ramps being built to connect Hwy 427 express bus services to a station at the East Mall.
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That plan had the line running along the north side the CP tracks, diving underground to avoid the back of some places of business, with a potential station at the East Mall, then curving south to Sherway for a station at Queensway and the West Mall, and then curving west for a terminal station at Dixie at the GO line.
The owners of Sherway Gardens at the time had pledged (as far as I remember) somewhere around $25 million to help bring the subway their way, and were planning on extending the mall to the northwest corner of the property to meet the new station. A bus terminal was planned for under the hydro corridor immediately west of the West Mall. Since that time a large complex of condos called One Sherway has been approved, and its first towers are now under construction. Land was also identified at Evans Avenue and the West Mall as a Toronto gateway, namely to take commuter parking for those driving into town on the QEW.
Sherway's bus ridership is not low because nobody goes to Sherway, it's low because it's such a slow route from Kipling. With direct subway access, one could imagine similar traffic to that which uses Yorkdale station on the Spadina line, and yes doady, there is a lot of it: (the Spadina line is not quite the disaster you make out in your post).
I believe that the East Mall station was not seen as a high priority because it was assumed that most Mississauga buses would meet the new line at Dixie, and that the TTC's East Mall bus might be needed to serve Dundas Street as far as Kipling once other TTC Dundas bus service was replaced by the subway extension. Nowadays, I could see some special bus-only ramps being built to connect Hwy 427 express bus services to a station at the East Mall.
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dashingdan
Guest
jeicow:
I specifically said a TRUE express bus to Islington. There IS none. I've taken the 89, the 27, the 86/206, the 81/201. They all do about half the stops of a regular bus. That speeds it up a bit, but not by much. I'm talking about a dedicated EXPRESS bus from Square One to Islington, NO STOPS AT ALL. Have you even ridden any of the so-called express bus routes in Mississauga? Hell the 202 you mentioned makes fewer stops than the 206 or 201.
Regardless of your opinion of Sherway as being "out of the way" despite it being at the junction of two majory highways (427 and QEW/Gardiner), it would be idiotic for a subway line to skip it completely. A subway line would give Sherway a boost. Imagine if Yorkdale wasn't on the subway line. How busy would it be? About as busy as Sherway is would be my guess.
As for Queensway Hospital or campus or whatever, they're changing its name to West Toronto, as if that makes it any less confusing. Trillium sure is brilliant.
interchange42:
While I agree a subway line through Sherway would make it busier, I don't think it'd be to Yorkdale levels. I also agree that bus service to Sherway suffers from poor routing. Definitely from the Mississauga side, and it sounds like from Kipling as well. I'll also agree that Spadina isn't dead, at least at Yorkdale. That's a pretty busy station.
Do you think there's still room at Sherway for a subway station, with all the development that's gone around it recently?
I specifically said a TRUE express bus to Islington. There IS none. I've taken the 89, the 27, the 86/206, the 81/201. They all do about half the stops of a regular bus. That speeds it up a bit, but not by much. I'm talking about a dedicated EXPRESS bus from Square One to Islington, NO STOPS AT ALL. Have you even ridden any of the so-called express bus routes in Mississauga? Hell the 202 you mentioned makes fewer stops than the 206 or 201.
Regardless of your opinion of Sherway as being "out of the way" despite it being at the junction of two majory highways (427 and QEW/Gardiner), it would be idiotic for a subway line to skip it completely. A subway line would give Sherway a boost. Imagine if Yorkdale wasn't on the subway line. How busy would it be? About as busy as Sherway is would be my guess.
As for Queensway Hospital or campus or whatever, they're changing its name to West Toronto, as if that makes it any less confusing. Trillium sure is brilliant.
interchange42:
While I agree a subway line through Sherway would make it busier, I don't think it'd be to Yorkdale levels. I also agree that bus service to Sherway suffers from poor routing. Definitely from the Mississauga side, and it sounds like from Kipling as well. I'll also agree that Spadina isn't dead, at least at Yorkdale. That's a pretty busy station.
Do you think there's still room at Sherway for a subway station, with all the development that's gone around it recently?
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Ed007Toronto
Guest
If there was room for a station at Queen, King and Union I'm sure there's room for one at Sherway.
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jeicow
Guest
I admit I haven't taken one in a while since I moved. The last time I remember for sure was about 6 months ago along Burnhamthorpe from Sq1 to South Common and the bus never stopped once along the route, which was how I always remember them running, except when the driver would let elderly riders off when they requested, and even then they had to be pretty old for them to do it. Most drivers would just tell other people to wait for the regular route to come and take that instead.
Sorry for my ignorance but if you don't mind me asking, what development? I know that the One Sherway Towers (four in the end i believe) are going up but besides that isn't the area parking lots, big box and warehouses?
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AlvinofDiaspar
Guest
jeicow:
In the case of 206, there are at least 4 stops for the stretch that you've mentioned.
AoD
In the case of 206, there are at least 4 stops for the stretch that you've mentioned.
AoD
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interchange42
Guest
dashingdan: yep, the corner of the site up at Queensway and West Mall that was identified as the preferred station location, would still work.
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adma
Guest
Also don't forget the one at Dufferin Mall--which, all in all, may be little more distant a walk from Dufferin station than the STC Wal-Mart is from STC station...let alone what the Sherway Wal-Mart might be relative to whatever subway station pops up there...
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Darkstar416
Guest
Someone should take the initiative of posting a map of the area (with possible extensions)...but it aint going to be me!
I can see equal merit in both a Sherway stop and/or terminus and a Cloverdale stop and/or terminus. I still feel though that the likely conclusion of the B-D line is probably Dixie GO (slightly into Mississauga). Anyhting further should be handled by Go Transit.
Instead of dreaming of a Square One subway terminus, Mississauga residents would be better served by S-Bahn-esque levels of service on the Milton GO corridor and a new City Centre Train station meandering a little bit off the current Milton line. Perhaps Mississauga's "Future Mayor" will follow my advice.
I can see equal merit in both a Sherway stop and/or terminus and a Cloverdale stop and/or terminus. I still feel though that the likely conclusion of the B-D line is probably Dixie GO (slightly into Mississauga). Anyhting further should be handled by Go Transit.
Instead of dreaming of a Square One subway terminus, Mississauga residents would be better served by S-Bahn-esque levels of service on the Milton GO corridor and a new City Centre Train station meandering a little bit off the current Milton line. Perhaps Mississauga's "Future Mayor" will follow my advice.
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
"Also don't forget the one at Dufferin Mall"
I didn't forget it...but you have to go outside to get there so it doesn't count in the same way.
More interesting is the Costco at Wilson station...
I didn't forget it...but you have to go outside to get there so it doesn't count in the same way.
More interesting is the Costco at Wilson station...
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scarberiankhatru
Guest
"While it will get ridership from TO I am more fimiliar with the areas to the east of the 427 in the Cloverdale area having more high density nodes and I just see it being more sucessful."
There's absolutely nothing along Dundas...what nodes are you talking about? The subway would run down the rail corridor, a few hundred metres from Dundas most of the way. The only thing - barring some mega redevelopment - worth mentioning between Hurontario and Kipling is Sherway...the subway might as well go there if it goes anywhere.
There's absolutely nothing along Dundas...what nodes are you talking about? The subway would run down the rail corridor, a few hundred metres from Dundas most of the way. The only thing - barring some mega redevelopment - worth mentioning between Hurontario and Kipling is Sherway...the subway might as well go there if it goes anywhere.