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I’m tired of the lack of civility downtown
- Thread starter Admiral Beez
- Start date
Jasmine18
Senior Member
I personally avoid going near any drug clinic like the one near Yonge and Dundas.
I am not against drug clinics but as a young woman especially at night, that area is just unsafe.
I am not against drug clinics but as a young woman especially at night, that area is just unsafe.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Not every city relegates or surrenders its downtown core to the marginalized, addicted and insane. Last August I was in Singapore and their downtown is remarkably free of such folks, and I felt totally at ease walking downtown at night, with normal folks (I suppose we can’t say normal anymore), families and kids all around. Manhattan is also free of Street people, at least in the tourist areas I’ve seen.
pman
Senior Member
Sydney has vastly fewer street people or beggars in the CBD as well, though like Singapore it’s a lot wealthier than Toronto.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
What bugs me is how most services for marginalized, addicted and homeless are located downtown. I have to think it’s chicken and egg, in that the people follow the services. Why else would someone from outside the city congregate downtown?
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Jasmine18
Senior Member
I think Toronto is sort of hotspot for vagrants and drifters now it seems?
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Certainly. First of all, it's well known that TPS will not enforce the Safe Streets Act and Highway Traffic Act with regards to roadside panhandling.
Safe Streets Act, 1999, S.O. 1999, c. 8 https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/99s08
Solicitation of captive audience prohibited
(2) No person shall,
(e) solicit a person who is in the process of getting in, out of, on or off a vehicle or who is in a parking lot; or
(f) while on a roadway, solicit a person who is in or on a stopped, standing or parked vehicle. 1999, c. 8, s. 3 (2).
Highway Traffic Act, R.S.O. 1990, c. H.8 https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/90h08
Duty of pedestrian
(4) No pedestrian shall leave the curb or other place of safety...and move into the path of a vehicle
Towered
Superstar
Because downtown is where the density is, allowing a concentration of services in close proximity thus making travel easy. It's not as efficient in the suburbs where everything is forced to be spaced far apart.
Johnny Au
Senior Member
Singapore chose the path of security. Even most chewing gum is banned and dental chewing gum requires a prescription from the physician.
It is a very tough balancing act between freedom and security.
taal
Senior Member
I do wonder about Manhattan then ? While not speaking first hand I've heard many say there are less (I'm really not sure what word to use here) vagrants then we have ? Is this true ? Where are there ?
Now if you compare Toronto to say Seattle or San Francisco ... it's much worse over there.
Now if you compare Toronto to say Seattle or San Francisco ... it's much worse over there.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Bussed out: how America moves thousands of homeless people around the country
Each year, US cities give thousands of homeless people one-way bus tickets out of town. An 18-month nationwide investigation by the Guardian reveals, for the first time, what really happens at journey’s end
www.theguardian.com
AoD
44 North
Senior Member
On the topic of busing the destitute has it ever been asserted as fact that towns and cities in Ontario have been sending their downtrodden to Toronto with one-way bus tickets? I've heard this from time to time, and it makes sense that they'd do this to 'clean up' their towns. Why would places like Barrie, Markham, Sault Ste Marie spend 1000s housing people or caring for those perceived as a civic blight when they could spend a pittance on a bus ticket and have the Big Smoke foot the big bills. Do wonder if it's actually a fact.
jje1000
Senior Member
On another note- was the incident(s) at the Raptors Championship celebrations a signifier of a general state of civility in this city, a signifier of particular elements within basketball culture, or an isolated incident?
Thankfully no deaths, and the organizers were able to deescalate this.
Thankfully no deaths, and the organizers were able to deescalate this.
A friend was in the area where the shooting was; she was trampled because the first thought people have now is of an active (mass) shooter situation and they panicked and ran. Is that reflective of our overall culture rather than just our city?
44 North
Senior Member
Since there was another fairly major incident the night the Raps won it doesn't seem all that "isolated". So I think it's somewhat safe to say that it's a signifier of particular elements within basketball. Not to say that other sports wouldn't see violent crime during celebrations. As incidents go there'd possibly be more violence with a Leafs victory, or Jays. Drunken brawls would be many. But guns would be a major surprise. Whereas with basketball huge hip hop influence. Rap's ambassador is Drake, and though he's the wholesome Toronto guy, doesn't mean he's not still not representing some of the violent criminal elements of hip hop in his artistry. Drake's great, and I love hip hop. But his two latest singles definitely express some of the tough-guy violence or even gun culture (Going Bad, Mob Ties). And he's leading the Rap's parade. So it sort of comes with the territory.
With the part about how the "organizers were able to deescalate this", I do question whether Matt Devlin chose the right words. When he told the crowd "there's an emergency being dealt with", I feel like emergency could produce more panic. Dirty bomb, active shooter, sarin gas...emergency means it's happening and still going on. If I heard that I'd want to be out of there. If he said isolated incident, which it arguable was, I think that'd be a better phrasing.