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GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

Shon,

Caltrain did an independent study that concluded that the Siemens Desiro double decker EMUs they are considering performed better in crash impacts than the FRA standards.

Perhaps these might be a good candidate for GO's lakeshore line?

32013_5f.jpg
 
Ohhh! I like!

If Georgetown electrifies, as Metrolinks has planned, GO might need dual-mode locomotives for the commuter services (unlike the "Express Rail" planned) because I can't see them electrifying all the way to Kitchener/Baden/Stratford any time soon. I know AMT might also be in the market for dual-mode locos for the planned line to the northwest via the Mount-Royal Tunnel.

But they're not Bombardier. Doesn't that disqualify them here?
 
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^Actually, Shon, the report mentions those EMUs built to the EU's EN15227 standards meet or exceed FRA requirements for crash-worthiness and they do mention that Alstom and Bombardier make models.

I hope this puts to rest the argument that European railcars aren't adequate for North American passenger railroading. They seem so much sleeker, while we get blunt-nosed cabs with hazard stripes.
 
I was, of course, being sarcastic. There's few things that drive me up the wall than excuses like FRA standards, especially for commuter rail on centrally-controlled rail corridors. The few times 'light rail' DMUs are allowed (Ottawa, Camden-Trenton) are under extreme restrictions (though the Ottawa DLRT crosses two active heavy-rail lines at grade! The horror!) The FRA standard are of course one of the excuses for using 60-year old RDCs for Blue 22 as they are FRA-compliant.
 
nfitz said:
I wasn't advocating moving it, I was advocating a second temporary station.

Perhaps not the best option, but it seems particularly bizarre to me, that GO is talking to expanding to a city of over 300,000 (combined Kitchener/Waterloo), and despite their demand being primarily from people parking at their stations, it doesn't seem they are planning any parking within the city of Kitchener! As much as I hate more parking lots, it seems to me that there should be one.
Click to expand...

1) There's the cost of building an additional station, and servicing it.
2) Weber street is the major North-South corridor through the centre of the region, (king street narrows through downtown Kitchener.
3a) The surrounding 2 lane local streets would not be able to handle the additional traffic.
3b) The location you propose is more out of the way for most KW residents for this reason.
4) A good proportion of the people using the GO service are university students, most of which take the bus and don't own cars
5)The station is easily accessible by modified bus routes.


It is incredibly likely that either VIA or the Region of Waterloo will figure out parking in this area once the EA is finished for the rapid transit line and a layout is finalized for the new GO/VIA station. In the mean time, Bus routes can be modified to better serve the existing station.

I understand the concern, and if there were room to provide parking at a Downtown Kitchener station without too much disruption, I'd be for it. It would be nice if a parking garage were in the proposal, but there isn't, as the Kitchener station is temporary. Once the final station is built, the parking situation will be figured out.
There will need to be a station in the west end of Kitchener, and in Baden. Remember that this in an inaugural service, and if the numbers are right, we could see this stations sooner rather than later.

In due time.
 
ShonTron said:
Ohhh! I like!

If Georgetown electrifies, as Metrolinks has planned, GO might need dual-mode locomotives for the commuter services (unlike the "Express Rail" planned) because I can't see them electrifying all the way to Kitchener/Baden/Stratford any time soon. I know AMT might also be in the market for dual-mode locos for the planned line to the northwest via the Mount-Royal Tunnel.

But they're not Bombardier. Doesn't that disqualify them here?
Click to expand...

Yeees, pretty trains, envious. :)

I could definitely see the Georgetown line electrified to Georgetown and not further for the following reasons:
(I'm a fan of lists tonight, don't know why)

1) Georgetown is the current limit of where a bulk of the people living there commute to and from more built-up areas of the GT(H)A
2) The line past Georgetown switches ownership from CN to the GEXR (Currently owned by RailAmerica). This could cause more complications than its worth.
3) It would be redundant to electrify parts of this corridor while in 20 years time, there would be a straighter, faster high speed rail corridor through the escarpment and glacial river valleys within a close vicinity.

I personally wouldn't see the line electrified to Kitchener until there was a high speed rail proposal on the board. However, Electrification of rail corridors along the Lakeshore and Georgetown will go a long way to helping create true HSR corridors. There's also the benefit communities along the corridor by having less polluting trains running by them on a regular basis.

This also doesn't mean that parts of the GEXR can't be electrified, such as the sections through Kitchener and Guelph. These corridors would likely need electrification regardless. You could begin to see something akin to what's happening in Weston with their rail corridor.

GEXR could eventually see electrification along the north mainline route, but it is definitely at a lower priority than other rail corridor improvements.

[EDIT] @ shontron concerning FRA standards. Yes, it is convoluted.

Even so, we need to start building trains in Ontario again.
 
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dunkalunk said:
1) There's the cost of building an additional station, and servicing it.
2) Weber street is the major North-South corridor through the centre of the region, (king street narrows through downtown Kitchener.
3a) The surrounding 2 lane local streets would not be able to handle the additional traffic.
3b) The location you propose is more out of the way for most KW residents for this reason.
4) A good proportion of the people using the GO service are university students, most of which take the bus and don't own cars
5)The station is easily accessible by modified bus routes.
Click to expand...
Weber street is only a 2-lane street past the station - unless someone went and widened it in the last year! King Street is the major artery from Victoria, north - supplemented by Charles and Duke south of Victoria. I really don't think that there are going to be that many university students commuting to Toronto on GO; I've taken the morning VIA train out of Kitchener - and that wasn't a young crowd at all. Bus service to the current station isn't that great; only the 8 passes by, plus whatever is on Victoria Street ... it's over half-a-kilometre to King where most of the buses are (I've walked it many, many times), doable, but I'm not sure that it's going to encourage as much as it should.

Perhaps they should just move the station to King Street sooner than later ... at least it would have a good transit connection then.
 
Weber is being widened to 4 lanes in this area. However, by the time its finished, the new station will also be finished, or at least close to being finihsed. Grade separations are planned for both Weber and King at this point.


If I'm not mistaken, That's route 18, not 8 that runs to the train station. Route 6 is also nearby. But the point holds true. Route 18 and route 6 only run every half hour. Route 18 only goes to the downtown terminal. This makes it impractical.

Yes, bus service sucks now, but once the Rapid transit EA is finished, GRT will begin to modify the iXpress and other routes to better serve the rapid transit line's route in advance. The University of Waterloo is currently on redesigning the bus route network. I expect the new train station to become a terminal for many bus routes.

In the meantime, perhaps we could see a shuttle run along the current iXpress route northbound, but instead, terminating at the train station. This bus would only run before and after the arrival of a train. Coach bus companies could set up a similar route.

Most university students don't have the money to take a the train that costs way too much and only runs 3 times a day. At this point, VIA isn't really practical to anyone who lives west of Toronto. Depending on the cost of GO compared to coach lines, you could begin to see in increase in students taking the train. But it all comes down to cost.

I too do hope for the ultimate solution to be finished in a timely manner, but it is at least 5 years down the road at this point, the design and technical process has not begun yet, for both the station, the grade separations of the rail line, and the rapid transit line.
 
dunkalunk said:
If I'm not mistaken, That's route 18, not 8 that runs to the train station. Route 6 is also nearby. But the point holds true. Route 18 and route 6 only run every half hour. Route 18 only goes to the downtown terminal. This makes it impractical.
Click to expand...
You are likely correct - I always walked to King and took the 7.

Yes, bus service sucks now, but once the Rapid transit EA is finished, GRT will begin to modify the iXpress and other routes to better serve the rapid transit line's route in advance. The University of Waterloo is currently on redesigning the bus route network. I expect the new train station to become a terminal for many bus routes.

dunkalunk said:
Most university students don't have the money to take a the train that costs way too much and only runs 3 times a day. At this point, VIA isn't really practical to anyone who lives west of Toronto. Depending on the cost of GO compared to coach lines, you could begin to see in increase in students taking the train. But it all comes down to cost.
Click to expand...
But how many students ARE commuting to Toronto in the morning? Not many I'd think.
 
FYI:
Material for the second track on the Stouffville/Lincolnville line are showing up at the newly constructed 14th Ave. underpass (just south of Unionville Station)

Looks like they're moving forward quickly and all-day service to Unionville might be in the much nearer future.
Click to expand...

Thanks for pointing this out, yyzhyd! I hadn't notcied, and I've been anxious for this work to start. Hopefully today's announcement will shed some light on when all-day service will be up and running. Hopefully they can add a couple trains in the interim as they've all been packed lately.
 
I, and I'm pretty sure many others in Waterloo Region, would like to see a new GO station combined with VIA, the light rail route, and the bus services serving the current downtown Kitchener terminal (or whatever replaces them) to make one gigantic intermodal terminal for ease of transfer--then see the existing terminal razed and redeveloped. It's on a huge tract of land that's begging to be re-used.
 
The old station is historic, so it can't be razed. Doesn't mean it can't be turned into a nice park/museum though and the surrounding lands could definitely be redeveloped.
 
213M earmarked for Barrie GO stop, improvements
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Apr 03, 2009 12:29 PM
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The Canadian Press

The federal and Ontario governments have announced details of another $213 million in improvements to GO Transit.

The latest projects include a new GO rail station in downtown Barrie, which is expected to be completed by 2011.

GO Transit will buy 20 new bi-level train cars over the next two years to accommodate more riders, and will refurbish 45 locomotives while waiting for delivery of new ones.

The money will help pay for five years of track maintenance and improvements throughout the GO rail network.

There will be improvements and upgrades throughout the GO system, including new and expanded bus storage facilities, new pedestrian tunnels and bridges, wider platforms and snow-melt systems.

GO will also install another 56 bicycle shelters at its train stations, adding to the 46 already in use.

The work is part of a $500-million package of transit projects unveiled last month by Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Premier Dalton McGuinty, with details of another $38 million in spending yet to come.

The first announcement of $249 million was mainly for expansion of GO parking lots and for GO's Hamilton Junction grade separation project.
 
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