GO Transit: Service thread (including extensions)

[felix123]

^ any prediction/estimation on the time to train enough people and then the opening to 'get it right this time'?

Update:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1505673173823631363

That AMA is hinting at "News very soon coming" gives me hope. The 30 minute weekend service on LSW wasn't enough for the largest economic region in the country, but it was at least reasonable, and on weekend afternoons one could usually find a seat.

Service needs to be increased beyond 30 minute frequencies, but GO's scheduled frequency has always been unreliable.
Their claims of the shot-lived 15 minute service on LSW were so full of asterisks that it seemed to me like false advertising.

 

[anb]

The service changes might come either April 1/2. For then, i’m expecting them to give us August 2021 service, just with Lakeshore being 15 mins all day added on with having some of the previously added Niagara trips, and Routes 41/56 spanning across the 407 corridor being at a 15 min or better combined service.

Express services on LSW and Kitchener are 50/50 right now on making a return but i’m not 100% sure if they would. It’s definitely preferred for the latter because i took the worst train to travel short distance (aka the 4:34PM London train with all stops included and also on a Friday). You basically had 3 different service patterns in 1 overstuffed train which obviously creates chaos. The local/express peak setup worked perfectly fine for what it did with the crowding control.

There also was a mistake they made adding 30 min all day service from Union-Bramalea to the schedules back in November, but i’m sure they’re probably planning to do that later on in the year if things keep going in the direction that we’re in right now. I can say in my own experience that it’s definitely preferred as mid day trips on the line is actually getting rather busy. It will probably continue to get more traffic as more offices open and more students (with more cheaper fares now), get back to school fully in person (and those gas prices add on to a definite reasonable option too).

 

[ARG1]

The service changes might come either April 1/2. For then, i’m expecting them to give us August 2021 service, just with Lakeshore being 15 mins all day added on with having some of the previously added Niagara trips, and Routes 41/56 spanning across the 407 corridor being at a 15 min or better combined service.

Express services on LSW and Kitchener are 50/50 right now on making a return but i’m not 100% sure if they would. It’s definitely preferred for the latter because i took the worst train to travel short distance (aka the 4:34PM London train with all stops included and also on a Friday). You basically had 3 different service patterns in 1 overstuffed train which obviously creates chaos. The local/express peak setup worked perfectly fine for what it did with the crowding control.

There also was a mistake they made adding 30 min all day service from Union-Bramalea to the schedules back in November, but i’m sure they’re probably planning to do that later on in the year if things keep going in the direction that we’re in right now. I can say in my own experience that it’s definitely preferred as mid day trips on the line is actually getting rather busy. It will probably continue to get more traffic as more offices open and more students (with more cheaper fares now), get back to school fully in person (and those gas prices add on to a definite reasonable option too).

On paper I think you're right. However another angle to think about is the fact that there is an election in a few months. From what I have heard from various sources including several CSAs, there were several service expansions planned pre-covid such as all day Milton and Richmond Hill Line services which were supposed to start in mid-2020, obviously cancelled due to COVID. Politically speaking, now would be the perfect time to introduce many of these service expansions due to said upcoming expansion, and while it might be unlikely, I do think there is a possibility for juicier details. Gonna stay pessimistic though and say it won't happen ))))

 

[innsertnamehere]

Given they had express services on LSW last fall, I imagine they will return. Commuting traffic into the core is likely already at higher levels than it was in 2021, and with Provincial workers returning in April and even more offices returning, traffic levels will be far higher as well.

LSE won't have express service again for years due to construction restrictions.

I wonder if 30 min service will get extended to Hamilton soon as well - there have certainly been hints of that happening. I'd prefer they focus service on restoring it on core areas of the network first though of course. It's honestly ridiculous GO is still running it's January peak-lockdown schedules right now.

 

[ARG1]

Given they had express services on LSW last fall, I imagine they will return. Commuting traffic into the core is likely already at higher levels than it was in 2021, and with Provincial workers returning in April and even more offices returning, traffic levels will be far higher as well.

LSE won't have express service again for years due to construction restrictions.

I wonder if 30 min service will get extended to Hamilton soon as well - there have certainly been hints of that happening. I'd prefer they focus service on restoring it on core areas of the network first though of course. It's honestly ridiculous GO is still running it's January peak-lockdown schedules right now.

I believe that the track connection is done, however the signalling has yet to be installed. We will have to wait on that.

 

[ShonTron]

On paper I think you're right. However another angle to think about is the fact that there is an election in a few months. From what I have heard from various sources including several CSAs, there were several service expansions planned pre-covid such as all day Milton and Richmond Hill Line services which were supposed to start in mid-2020, obviously cancelled due to COVID. Politically speaking, now would be the perfect time to introduce many of these service expansions due to said upcoming expansion, and while it might be unlikely, I do think there is a possibility for juicier details. Gonna stay pessimistic though and say it won't happen ))))

I doubt that Richmond Hill will ever get all-day service. There are no passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub, and the northern section of the route is a busy CN mainline. It would require a lot of investment from Metrolinx for minimal gain.

Milton will certainly get more train service, but again, it is constrained by CP’s operations. It will need another track through much of Mississauga to make it work, but that is planned.

 

[ARG1]

I doubt that Richmond Hill will ever get all-day service. There are no passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub, and the northern section of the route is a busy CN mainline. It would require a lot of investment from Metrolinx for minimal gain.

Milton will certainly get more train service, but again, it is constrained by CP’s operations. It will need another track through much of Mississauga to make it work, but that is planned.

When I say all day service, I don't mean hourly. From what I understand, the service plan from 2020 wasn't going to be hourly, it was something like every hour and a half to 2 hours, and that's midday only so no counterpeak service - which is certainly feasible.

 

[Urban Sky]

I doubt that Richmond Hill will ever get all-day service. There are no passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub, and the northern section of the route is a busy CN mainline. It would require a lot of investment from Metrolinx for minimal gain.

If that was true, every time the Canadian arrives during the pm peak would play havoc:

 

[ARG1]

If that was true, every time the Canadian arrives during the pm peak would play havoc:
View attachment 386772

I assume there's very strict timing associate with it.

Before The Richmond Hill Line was extended to Gormley, there wasn't anywhere to park the trains overnight, so they actually deadheaded all of the trains back to Union, and would deadhead immediately after dropping passengers off at Richmond Hill, while there were still trains going from Union. However I assumed that this return trip also involved having the train wait a while at the furthest south passing loop available at around Doncaster, so it wasn't exactly a fast trip down to Union.

 

[Krypto98]

I doubt that Richmond Hill will ever get all-day service. There are no passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub, and the northern section of the route is a busy CN mainline. It would require a lot of investment from Metrolinx for minimal gain.

Milton will certainly get more train service, but again, it is constrained by CP’s operations. It will need another track through much of Mississauga to make it work, but that is planned.

There is a passing track south of oriole and I think near cherry.

Milton hourly to Erindale is theoretically feasible but I don't think CP would like go trains crossing CP Humber every 30 minutes

 

[reaperexpress]

I doubt that Richmond Hill will ever get all-day service. There are no passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub, and the northern section of the route is a busy CN mainline. It would require a lot of investment from Metrolinx for minimal gain.

There are 4 passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub. The map below shows the double-tracked segments.

Prior to the pandemic, there was a train which deadheaded southbound from Richmond Hill starting around 16:00, meeting the northbound PM trains at the sidings.

 

[smallspy]

I doubt that Richmond Hill will ever get all-day service. There are no passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub, and the northern section of the route is a busy CN mainline. It would require a lot of investment from Metrolinx for minimal gain.

Richmond Hill almost had limited mid-day service in 2019 and again in 2020. A single trainset is all that would be needed to run an every-2-hours schedule from Union to Old Cummer. It's not much, but it's enough to keep buses from having to come downtown, and wouldn't interfere with CN's operations at all.

Dan

 

[ShonTron]

Richmond Hill almost had limited mid-day service in 2019 and again in 2020. A single trainset is all that would be needed to run an every-2-hours schedule from Union to Old Cummer. It's not much, but it's enough to keep buses from having to come downtown, and wouldn't interfere with CN's operations at all.

Dan

Ah, yeah, I forgot about some of the passing sidings, which were definitively needed to allow the peak service trains to deadhead back before the yard north of Gormley was opened.

For Richmond Hill, yeah, I get how running a train every two hours, when the bus service is minimal to begin with, could make sense. For Milton, though, I'd definitely prefer the frequent bus service than a train that ran less than hourly.

 

[smallspy]

For Richmond Hill, yeah, I get how running a train every two hours, when the bus service is minimal to begin with, could make sense.

From what I can recall of the plans, it wasn't just the Richmond Hill buses that would connect to the service though.

401 buses would also stop at Oriole Station to connect to the trains - when the trains were running, that is.

For Milton, though, I'd definitely prefer the frequent bus service than a train that ran less than hourly.

So would most people, I'd think. Which is why the weekend service plans for Milton called for at least hourly service.

Of course, they'd happen to be in the same service windows as the weekday service would, so they would be of limited utility. But I guess they - Metrolinx - could at least cheer the fact that more trains were running.

Dan

 

[robmausser]

There are 4 passing opportunities south of the CN York Sub. The map below shows the double-tracked segments.
View attachment 386788

Prior to the pandemic, there was a train which deadheaded southbound from Richmond Hill starting around 16:00, meeting the northbound PM trains at the sidings.
View attachment 386796

Do you have a map like this showing Barrie and Stouffville with what double tracking they have as of today? im curious where progress has been left with those projects.

Also, it always surprised me why this section here couldnt be double tracked as theres the old track in place from the CP Don Branch.

Surprised they wouldnt retrack that area and get one long continuous double track all the way from Union.