Despite what Ford says The Streetcar in Toronto is here to stay.

[GenerationW]

Oil prices will likely go up, but oil itself will be plentiful for decades, possibly centuries. Those 1970's predictions of a dwindling oil supply within 30-50 years (i.e. today) haven't come close to materializing.

 

[rbt]

Oil prices will likely go up, but oil itself will be plentiful for decades, possibly centuries. Those 1970's predictions of a dwindling oil supply within 30-50 years (i.e. today) haven't come close to materializing.

The 1950's prediction about America hitting peak production in the early 70's have been pretty much spot on. The prediction was within 2 years of it actually occurring. Production within the United States has decreased every year since except for a short rebound in the 80's. Today's production is well below peak (25 to 30% of peak).

Texas peaked in the 70's and Alaska production peaked in the late 80's.

Aside from a preserved stock-pile (emergency rations for the military) the US only has the Gulf and Alaska sources left as cheap consumer sources.


Current predictions are about the world as a whole hitting peak production capacity very soon of conventional oil. That doesn't mean an end of oil, just that the price might start increasing if demand continues to increase. Oil sands, for example, take significantly more energy to extract a barrel from than a conventional land based oil well located in Texas in the 50's. That we consider Alberta a viable location to retrieve oil from is pretty telling that oil companies also believe this prediction.

 

[W. K. Lis]

The Saturday Toronto Sun has a story today on Streetcars go back to the future in U.S.:

As mayoral front-runner Rob Ford proposes derailing some of Toronto’s iconic streetcars, several American cities are cashing in on a tram rebirth.

Ford came under fire from light rail transit and streetcar fans after announcing subways and buses would better boost TTC ridership and speed suburbanites to inner-city destinations.

His plans, key advisors said Friday, include dooming the Transit City LRTs — which suffered a major blow when the province announced this spring it would delay $4 billion in financing.

Campaign manager and brother, Doug Ford, and policy director Mark Towhey said their candidate proposes two subway lines, buying new buses and pulling slow-moving Red Rockets off routes clogged with exhaust-belching and curb-parked autos.

“In 10 years there could be no streetcars,†Ford deputy campaign manager Nick Kouvalis said in September. “It’s not the end...but we’re going to stop the streetcar plan from growing.â€

That raised red flags over a potential mega-billion-dollar lawsuit if the city cancels a TTC contract for 204 Bombardier low-floor, state-of-the-art LRT cars. The province’s Metrolinx agency ordered 182 slightly-different Bombardier cars.

The order would proceed under Ford — but with some short-turned, Towhey said.

“We’re not going to rip up the Spadina streetcar tracks,†nor those on Queen’s Quay and St. Clair Ave., which were installed on dedicated raised rights-of-way down the centre, he said.

Instead, systems Ford targets are those that compete directly with cars, trucks and buses, including the Queen and King lines.

Rather than cancel the deal with Bombardier, which Towhey said has not begun building the new sleek, longer and faster LRTs due for delivery starting in 2013, any unneeded streetcars could be offered before delivery to buyers considering placing future orders at higher prices.

“If the city is smart, we could make some money out of it,†he said.

The closest buyers are in the U.S., where several cities turned back the clock to the tram era most abandoned in the 1950s.

Ironically, Cincinnati — which sold part of its 1930-40s President’s Conference Committee fleet to Toronto — is one metropolis planning to enjoy the clang, clang, clang of the trolley.

Many other cities opted to buy surplus cars from Australia, Spain and Italy, others had museum relics refurbished. Several, including Houston, where 34,600 daily passengers ride 18 wide-door, wheelchair-accessible cars on a dedicated 12.1-km route, placed foreign orders.

President Barack Obama’s administration became the first in decades to support streetrail lobbyists.

In Washington D.C., the first new articulated streetcar built in the Czech Republic to manoeuvre in the capital’s narrow downtown streets, arrived in May.

The rest are due by 2012, when a $68 million, two-line system the District of Columbia financed is to be completed as the first two of possibly eight lines.

“We are reclaiming our past by rebuilding our future,†said Rep. Earl Blumenauer.

The Democrat from Portland, Oregon got the White House to invest almost $130 million for streetrail systems, promoting them as environmentally-friendly, longer-lasting and ultimately cheaper than buses.

Cities that accepted grants included Tucson, Ariz.; Charlotte, N.C.; Fort Worth, Tex.; Cincinnati; and St. Louis — which also sold surplus PCC cars to the TTC.

Supporters say starter streetcar and LRT systems cost far less than subways and attract housing units, plus retail and office development in almost-abandoned downtown cores, where cities such as Cincinnati razed empty or dilapidated buildings for new street-level rail routes.

Doug Ford, a businessman who travels extensively south of the border, does not foresee a major trolley rebirth, saying “it just won’t happen in the U.S.â€

He and Towhey predict developers would help finance new TTC subway stations with a projected $1 billion in exchange for building condo, office, and shopping complexes after negotiations they insist must involve consulting affected communities,

Buses, they said, are more flexible than streetcars and LRTs, which rely on rails and electrical systems.

Subways, built with giant tunnel-boring machines or in dig-and-fill trenches, are much faster people-movers, Towhey said, adding streetcars are much slower on busy streets — often crawling along at 14 km/h.

Finally, if Bombardier locks the city into itsLRT car deal, “we’ll phase them out within 20 years,†Doug Ford said.

 

[Asterix]

They aren't but then progressives are really regressives in my opinion, to them that may mean a raise in the benefit so to them it is progress but to working Americans who pay their way it is robbery ,in my opinion

a) Your post makes little coherent sense, even if it is just your opinion.

b) It reeks of an excuse to post your advertising signature.

 

[Chuck]

I hope however that Torontonians, who would be actually affected, wish otherwise and vote otherwise. Killing SELRT and replacing it with subway could possibly make sense, but killing SELRT or TC just for the sake of doing so could not.

I would agree with that. Better have something than nothing. As long underground TC routes that might conceivably be subway one day are built to accomodate subway trains, or at least equivalent lengthed LRT trains, fair enough.

For the record, I'm a heavy user of the St. Clair line and admit it's pleasant. My beef is that as nice as St. Clair may be, it would never be able to take the place of a subway line. Escpecially considering that the TTC can't even manage a streetcar route in a ROW! Bunching is still a very regular occurence, as are irregular wait times. I've seen triple bunching once (though only once thankfully) on St. Clair.

 

[GraphicMatt]

I would agree with that. Better have something than nothing. As long underground TC routes that might conceivably be subway one day are built to accomodate subway trains, or at least equivalent lengthed LRT trains, fair enough.

For the record, I'm a heavy user of the St. Clair line and admit it's pleasant. My beef is that as nice as St. Clair may be, it would never be able to take the place of a subway line. Escpecially considering that the TTC can't even manage a streetcar route in a ROW! Bunching is still a very regular occurence, as are irregular wait times. I've seen triple bunching once (though only once thankfully) on St. Clair.

Surely spending billions of dollars in capital money to fix what is ultimately a management/operational problem (streetcar bunching) isn't a very responsible solution, is it?

 

[Dan416]

Surely spending billions of dollars in capital money to fix what is ultimately a management/operational problem (streetcar bunching) isn't a very responsible solution, is it?

Invariably they'll blame it on traffic or factors beyond their control. Only way to get away from that excuse is grade separation. Even then they'll blame things on jumpers.

 

[dunkalunk]

IIRC, both the Spadina and St. Clair Lines have little to no signal priority. Why the heck not?

 

[Asterix]

IIRC, both the Spadina and St. Clair Lines have little to no signal priority. Why the heck not?

http://stevemunro.ca/?p=4452 gives some explanation (or at least presents TTC/city excuses).

 

[W. K. Lis]

In winter, diesel buses need to be either stored in a garage or hooked up to a block heater. They need to be warmed up before going on the road. So, they will need to be idled until they are ready to run.

Streetcars don’t. You just turn them on.

Roncesvalles and Russell store most of their streetcars outdoors. Which makes them unsuitable for buses, as is.

See this link from back in January, 2010 from the the Toronto Sun, where people complained about the noise from the bus garage next door. If Ford gets his way, the complaints from Roncesvalles and Russell residential neighbours will shoot up if buses are placed there. Another expense, should they try to look elsewhere.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Rob Ford should answer the question: Why are so many North American cities installing streetcars (not just on right-of-ways, but in mixed traffic as well) in their cities?

Washington D.C., for example, is in the process of building, not removing, an eventual network of 53.1 km (33 mi.) of streetcars through their city. Some on right-of-ways, some in mixed traffic. They are being built to revive their downtown neighbourhoods and build up property values.

Why does Rob Ford want to depress the neighbourhoods around the streetcars? Revenge? Of course, subways are better, but they cost a lot more than light rail and streetcars. Do not use the excuse that streetcars block automobiles, when it is the automobile that blocks everyone including streetcars, especially single-occupant automobiles.

H Street streetcar tracks, Washington, DC

 

[cacruden]

The lack of signal priority - is the reason I really don't support any new "LRT" routes at ground level. Not worth it if they are not going to implement it correctly, and they never will.

 

[W. K. Lis]

The lack of signal priority - is the reason I really don't support any new "LRT" routes at ground level. Not worth it if they are not going to implement it correctly, and they never will.

The problem is that traffic lights are the responsibility of the roads department, not the TTC. It ends up that the car gets priority, especially the left turn vehicles ahead of transit.

It there was real transit priority, transit would go ahead of left turn vehicles and they would also get the go ahead with a red signal for everyone else. They could also use a similar system for emergency vehicles, such as fire trucks, so they would their go ahead with a red signal for everyone else. However, it is still the roads department that controls how the signals are implemented.

 

[spider]

The problem is that traffic lights are the responsibility of the roads department, not the TTC. It ends up that the car gets priority, especially the left turn vehicles ahead of transit.

Both jurisdictions fall under the City and by extension the Mayor. Maybe the problem is the lack of a message from the top that these priority signals will be used starting Monday morning or heads will roll.
Much as you TTC fans hate Rob Ford he may be the guy to solve this problem.

 

[nfitz]

Right ... Ford is going to make it more difficult for car drivers, but speed up streetcars.

Is this before or after he brings peace to mankind?